Fantasy Recs for 11-y.o. boy?

[meeera]

Originally Posted by Nyssa

Teleportation and time travel are definitely Science Fiction tropes! Science Fiction (by my definition) is anything that is based in a particular field of science, can be scientifically studied or created, technologies and space [as in space travel, planets, alien beings,

Fantasy usually has to do with mythological, fairy tale, or fabled beings [Vampires, Elves, Fairies, Trolls, Werewolves, etc.], magic, and/or the Paranormal / Supernatural.

And any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Like I said, the boundaries are fuzzy, and the arguments have been had over and over and won't ever be resolved, because people like to draw bright lines where there are none. Time travel, with our current level of knowledge, is a fantasy, as is faster-than-light travel and telepathy. The Pern world has dragons, but they're engineered. It also has a pseudo-medieval/feudal society, with princesses and weyrs and guilds, and a fairly low level of tech, and a focus on agriculture.

The bottom line as far as this thread goes is that Pern is unlikely to give a "Ew yuck, that's SF and therefore not for me" reaction to a typical fantasy reader.

[Nyssa]

Originally Posted by meeera

And any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

Like I said, the boundaries are fuzzy, and the arguments have been had over and over and won't ever be resolved, because people like to draw bright lines where there are none. Time travel, with our current level of knowledge, is a fantasy, as is faster-than-light travel and telepathy. The Pern world has dragons, but they're engineered. It also has a pseudo-medieval/feudal society, with princesses and weyrs and guilds, and a fairly low level of tech, and a focus on agriculture.

The bottom line as far as this thread goes is that Pern is unlikely to give a "Ew yuck, that's SF and therefore not for me" reaction to a typical fantasy reader.

Quite honestly, it was strictly the fact that there were Dragons that made me put it into the Fantasy realm. All of those other characteristics can be found in both/either Science Fiction and/or Fantasy.

If they are engineered, however, then I can see why it would fall under Science Fiction - although I, personally, would most likely consider the series both Science Fiction and Fantasy.

What drives me crazy, however, is when SciFi and Fantasy are automatically lumped together as one genre, even though they really aren't the same. There are stories that a purely Science Fiction and others that are purely Fantasy.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Nyssa

If they are engineered, however, then I can see why it would fall under Science Fiction - although I, personally, would most likely consider the series both Science Fiction and Fantasy.

In this particular series it's a case of settlers on an alien planet encountering local animals which remind them of the legends of dragons on Earth, and hence deciding to call them dragons. It really isn't a fantasy series in any way .

You really should read them - an SF classic.

[Nyssa]

Originally Posted by HarryT

In this particular series it's a case of settlers on an alien planet encountering local animals which remind them of the legends of dragons on Earth, and hence deciding to call them dragons. It really isn't a fantasy series in any way .

You really should read them - an SF classic.

Ah! That makes so much more sense!

As to my reading it, its one of those "some day I really should" type things.

My biggest concern is making sure I can find all of the books and preferably in ebook format. This is a huge series!!

[meeera]

Originally Posted by Nyssa

Ah! That makes so much more sense!

This is backstory that fills in as time goes on, and so is very mildly spoilery if you haven't read any.

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The 'dragons' they find, really smallish telepathic lizards who breathe fire, are then genetically engineered into large rideable dragons who form a single telepathic bond with a human at Hatching, and have certain other psychic powers like teleportation.

[ATDrake]

Originally Posted by Nyssa

As to my reading it, its one of those "some day I really should" type things.

My biggest concern is making sure I can find all of the books and preferably in ebook format. This is a huge series!!

Well, if it's any help, you can probably stop reading them after All the Weyrs of Pern, because that's the point where the story pretty much effectively wraps up for the "present-day" timeline and there's a really steep drop in quality immediately thereafter, IMHO as someone who owns a large chunk of the series in 2 languages and has kept reading them up to the next-but-latest from the library out of sheer morbid curiosity.

Also, you can try reading Moreta: Dragonlady of Pern first as a standalone, as it's an "historical" novel in the series which tells a completely self-contained tale about one of the legendary figures in Pern's past and also happens to be one of the best-plotted and best-written of the series, again IMHO as someone who has read almost-the-lot, and will also serve as a pretty good introduction to the style, culture, and basic themes of Pern.

(One of the latter being the slow generational loss of knowledge from their more industrially advanced space colonist roots due to the pressure of fighting Thread, and the way their society has become warped into a kind of increasingly feudal and un-egalitarian pattern rather different from the original settlers' intentions, by being constantly under an on-and-off siege condition which automatically gets all the resources allocated to it, leaving little left over time for societal leisure and engagement in civilized pursuits, like spending time properly preserving knowledge.)

[Nyssa]

Originally Posted by meeera

This is backstory that fills in as time goes on, and so is very mildly spoilery if you haven't read any.

..
..
..

The 'dragons' they find, really smallish telepathic lizards who breathe fire, are then genetically engineered into large rideable dragons who form a single telepathic bond with a human at Hatching, and have certain other psychic powers like teleportation.

Originally Posted by ATDrake

Well, if it's any help, you can probably stop reading them after All the Weyrs of Pern, because that's the point where the story pretty much effectively wraps up for the "present-day" timeline and there's a really steep drop in quality immediately thereafter, IMHO as someone who owns a large chunk of the series in 2 languages and has kept reading them up to the next-but-latest from the library out of sheer morbid curiosity.

Also, you can try reading Moreta: Dragonlady of Pern first as a standalone, as it's an "historical" novel in the series which tells a completely self-contained tale about one of the legendary figures in Pern's past and also happens to be one of the best-plotted and best-written of the series, again IMHO as someone who has read almost-the-lot, and will also serve as a pretty good introduction to the style, culture, and basic themes of Pern.

(One of the latter being the slow generational loss of knowledge from their more industrially advanced space colonist roots due to the pressure of fighting Thread, and the way their society has become warped into a kind of increasingly feudal and un-egalitarian pattern rather different from the original settlers' intentions, by being constantly under an on-and-off siege condition which automatically gets all the resources allocated to it, leaving little left over time for societal leisure and engagement in civilized pursuits, like spending time properly preserving knowledge.)

Thank you both!

I have added Moreta: Dragonlady of Pern to my wishlist (There are now 3 books I'd like to get, but I've already spent all of my Amazon Christmas money. )

[HarryT]

Yes, the series starts off (with "Dragonflight") in a medieval, feudal society, and it's only gradually over several books in the series that the "backstory" about the planet's colonisation and the loss of their high-technology civilisation fills in.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Yes, the series starts off (with "Dragonflight") in a medieval, feudal society, and it's only gradually over several books in the series that the "backstory" about the planet's colonisation and the loss of their high-technology civilisation fills in.

Harry:

I don't disagree that Dragonflight, et al, are sci-fi, and certainly Anne McCaffrey--with whom I had the privilege of some emails back and forth, a long time ago--considers them such--adamantly.

Nonetheless, I can't believe that any young person can't imagine themselves a DRAGONRIDER, upon reading the series, or even any one of them...so I think it would be a nice segue into sci-fi for him. (Did I forget to say that?). That, or POM, Verne...any of those are fantastical enough, with adequate perils, fights to save humanity (or whatever)...to fill the bill, I'd think.

I agree that Moreta was one of the best-written books in the series. And I also agree that ATWOP seems to be the climax of the "old" series, before the "new" co-authored by her son.

Hitch

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Harry:

I don't disagree that Dragonflight, et al, are sci-fi, and certainly Anne McCaffrey--with whom I had the privilege of some emails back and forth, a long time ago--considers them such--adamantly.

Nonetheless, I can't believe that any young person can't imagine themselves a DRAGONRIDER, upon reading the series, or even any one of them...so I think it would be a nice segue into sci-fi for him. (Did I forget to say that?). That, or POM, Verne...any of those are fantastical enough, with adequate perils, fights to save humanity (or whatever)...to fill the bill, I'd think.

I agree that Moreta was one of the best-written books in the series. And I also agree that ATWOP seems to be the climax of the "old" series, before the "new" co-authored by her son.

Hitch

Oh, I totally agree, Hitch. They're wonderful books, and I read them (on their initial publication!) when I was a teenager .

If you want to widen the scope of the thread to cover SF, I'd also strongly recommend Heinlein's "Juveniles". Great books, many of which are still among my favourites <cough> years after I initially read them when I was a yoof. Books like "Space Cadet" and "Starman Jones" really fired my imagination when I read them: I wanted (and still want ) to be a space cadet!

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Oh, I totally agree, Hitch. They're wonderful books, and I read them (on their initial publication!) when I was a teenager .

If you want to widen the scope of the thread to cover SF, I'd also strongly recommend Heinlein's "Juveniles". Great books, many of which are still among my favourites <cough> years after I initially read them when I was a yoof. Books like "Space Cadet" and "Starman Jones" really fired my imagination when I read them: I wanted (and still want ) to be a space cadet!

Y'know...I realize I've never read those! I can't believe it. I thought I'd read absolutely everything Heinlein, but I've not read those. I may have to try them!

Ask my crew: they'll tell you I achieved Space Cadet status a Looooooooong time ago. ha!

Hitch

[WillAdams]

Andre Norton?

Witch World
Beast Master
&c.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Nyssa

Really? I haven't read the series, but, I thought anything with Dragons was automatically Fantasy!?!

The dragons were originally native lizards that were gen3etically modified.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by meeera

Science fantasy, perhaps, like anything with teleportation and time travel.

Dr. Who is not fantasy. It's science fiction and it has time travel and teleportation.

[JSWolf]

Another good series he might like is the Shannara series by Terry Brooks. I suggest he read in chronological order.

Word & Void
Running with the Demon
A Knight of the Word
Angel Fire East

Genesis of Shannara
Armageddon's Children
The Elves of Cintra
The Gypsy Morph

Legends of Shannara
Bearers of the Black Staff
The Measure of the Magic

Shannara
First King of Shannara

Paladins of Shannara
Allanon's Quest

Shannara
The Sword of Shannara

Paladins of Shannara
The Black Irix

Shannara
The Elfstones of Shannara

Paladins of Shannara
The Weapons Master's Choice

Shannara
The Wishsong of Shannara
Indomitable-The Epilogue to The Wishsong of Shannara

Heritage of Shannara
The Scions of Shannara
The Druid of Shannara
The Elf Queen of Shannara
The Talismans of Shannara

Voyage of the Jerle Shannara
Ilse Witch
Antrax
Morgawr

High Druid of Shannara
Jarka Ruus
Tanequil
Straken

Dark Legacy of Shannara
Wards of Faerie
Bloodfire Quest
Witch Wraith

Defenders of Shannara
The High Druid's Blade