UK e-book prices to rise from 1st January 2015

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by murg

I had a scary thought...

This new regime involves as tacit agreement by the vendor that they are doing business in the EU, and are subject to EU tax laws.

What's to stop the EU (or any of the member countries) from passing a tax law that says that anyone doing business with EU customers have to pay a profit tax to that EU country. The profit tax doesn't even have to be proportional to the sales from that country. And of course, the write-off laws are different in every country.

Imagine a Delaware based US company having to file a tax return in Delaware, the US, and twenty different European countries.

Don't give them ideas.

[murg]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Don't give them ideas.

And of course, these non-EU companies would then have to follow EU regulations on running a company: minimum wages, employment conditions, health insurance, environmental policies, etc...

[murg]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Consider Duane's situation:

First off, she stops asking for an address to buy a book from her. If she's the publisher, and has world-wide rights, there is no need to ask for an address.

Then, stop figuring out the country from the IP address. In addition to being fraught with error, it is not necessary for her to sell you a book.

And finally, get a credit card processing service where she doesn't see the card information. This way she has no idea of which country the card is from.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by murg

First off, she stops asking for an address to buy a book from her. If she's the publisher, and has world-wide rights, there is no need to ask for an address.

Then, stop figuring out the country from the IP address. In addition to being fraught with error, it is not necessary for her to sell you a book.

And finally, get a credit card processing service where she doesn't see the card information. This way she has no idea of which country the card is from.

At which point they drag her into court and she spends more in the first lawyer consultation than the website produced all year.

Her only real options are:

1- submit to EU rule
2- shut down the web site
3- only sell via Amazon or smashwords, Kobo, etc
4- hope the US DOJ issues a preemptive ruling saying not to comply.

I wouldn't hold my breath for that last one.

[Little.Egret]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

At which point they drag her into court and she spends more in the first lawyer consultation than the website produced all year.

Her only real options are:

1- submit to EU rule
2- shut down the web site
3- only sell via Amazon or smashwords, Kobo, etc
4- hope the US DOJ issues a preemptive ruling saying not to comply.

I wouldn't hold my breath for that last one.

Err, Diane Duane lives in the EU, the Republic of Ireland to be precise.

She can and is pressuring the various democratically elected people to adjust things.

As I mentioned up thread, the EU has been trying to get VAT paid on ‘Electronically supplied services’ supplied from outside the EU since 2003 at least. Various US states would like Amazon to collect sales tax for them.

Things are not moving fast.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Little.Egret

Err, Diane Duane lives in the EU, the Republic of Ireland to be precise.

I would imagine, then, that she has a plan of action. This change was, after all, announced years ago, so people impacted by it have had lots of time to prepare for it.

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by murg

I had a scary thought...

This new regime involves as tacit agreement by the vendor that they are doing business in the EU, and are subject to EU tax laws.

What's to stop the EU (or any of the member countries) from passing a tax law that says that anyone doing business with EU customers have to pay a profit tax to that EU country. The profit tax doesn't even have to be proportional to the sales from that country. And of course, the write-off laws are different in every country.

Imagine a Delaware based US company having to file a tax return in Delaware, the US, and twenty different European countries.

Well, the mayor of London, England was born in New York City to at least one UK parent and permanently moved to the UK at 5 years age. Now the US wants income tax from him on the sale of a home in England.

(And most large "Delaware based" corporations have about as much presence in Delaware as Amazon has in Luxembourg.)

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Little.Egret

As I mentioned up thread, the EU has been trying to get VAT paid on ‘Electronically supplied services’ supplied from outside the EU since 2003 at least. Various US states would like Amazon to collect sales tax for them.

Things are not moving fast.

In the US any motion is just political posturing.

The very reason EU pols want to raise taxes is why it won't happen in the US.
The House of Representatives is not about to raise consumer taxes in a weak economy. And that is half the reason Amazon isn't fighting proposals for internet sales taxes. (The other half is their warehouse building plans.)

As for Duane, I thought she was in the US because of other comments she'd made about the versions she could sell on her site.

The points still apply to US-based digital sites; the mere threat of legal harrassment is enough to force closure.

[JSWolf]

The problem as I see it is the EU is trying to force it's will on sites & people who are not in the EU. The EU is overreaching it's authority and that needs to stop.

[conan50]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The problem as I see it is the EU is trying to force it's will on sites & people who are not in the EU. The EU is overreaching it's authority and that needs to stop.

+1000
It is about control. I can imagine many issues arising down the road from one country or group of countries trying to control other nations and people via the Internet and Internet sales and services.

[JSWolf]

I am in the US. If I buy an eBook from a site in the EU, I should not get taxed VAT as I don't pay VAT where I am. Will the EU try to get some sort of tax from me?

[rkomar]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I am in the US. If I buy an eBook from a site in the EU, I should not get taxed VAT as I don't pay VAT where I am. Will the EU try to get some sort of tax from me?

I think the point of the law is to apply the tax based on where the purchaser is. Consider it like a "duty" paid on imported goods. The duty goes to the purchaser's government. The exporter gets taxed at their location based on total revenues and what not, and would factor those costs into the list price.

[gbm]

This means a French person travelling from London to Paris by train, having passed through the Channel Tunnel, could purchase an online subscription, connecting to the French mobile network, with a French IP address, and using a French credit card, but it would be correct for VAT purposes to show this as a UK customer. Getting this wrong risks an unlimited fine, even though the VAT rate in both countries is 20 per cent.

No law should have an "unlimited fine".
The EU prides itself for it's stand on human rights, but then passes a law with an unlimited fine.

bernie

[Little.Egret]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I am in the US. If I buy an eBook from a site in the EU, I should not get taxed VAT as I don't pay VAT where I am. Will the EU try to get some sort of tax from me?

Not as such.

But if your state has a sales tax then in the remote future that EU site may charge it and remit to your state treasury in return for your state collecting VAT for the EU for every state site that makes sales in the EU.

[Little.Egret]

Originally Posted by gbm

No law should have an "unlimited fine".
The EU prides itself for its stand on human rights, but then passes a law with an unlimited fine.

bernie

Those EU and Euro Human Rights (ECHR) Courts have case law on what fines are proportional and proper.

unlimited means no fixed maximum