Amazon is destroying e-reader innovation

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

...The (non-UK) euro markets are driven by techies and hobbyists, students and academics--people who are interested in the technology and not just the stories...

What is giving you this impression?
In Germany, when on the train, I experience exactly the opposite.
I assume, the hobbyist, students and academics you describe mostly would be of the younger generation below 25, 30 tops.
I see lots of people with readers on the train. But mostly older ones. I'd say, mostly in the range of 30 to 45.
The younger ones usually have their smartphones, a few have phablets or tablets.

I think, there's another huge difference to the US. From what I read and hear, most brick and mortar bookstores in the US face serious problems and lots of them have disappeared already.
In Germany, probably due to the book price binding (you can't give discounts as you please, the prices are fixed), those stores still do fine.
And they all sell the very same reader. Their alliance developed the Tolino Shine, obviously very much mirroring Kindle Paperwhite.
And again: If I stroll through those bookstores (there are 5 in a radius of 2km around my house), it's mostly "elderly" customers around 30 or 40.

[Purple Lady]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Yes, you can. Watermarking is not DRM encryption (that is kinda the point ) and therefore the ebook files are perfectly readable by anything that wants to. Why would ebook editors be the exception?

Oh yeah, duh! When you put it like that, it's kinda obvious isn't it.

[QuantumIguana]

Originally Posted by Rizla

It's not giving me what I want. Am I then not included in your definition of 'people'?

Not everyone is going to get everything they want. I didn't say that Amazon gives everyone what they want. Amazon provides enough of what many people want, if they didn't, they wouldn't be so big. Perhaps the dissatisfied aren't a large enough market for other companies to bother with. If I like a TV show, it usually gets cancelled - there just wasn't enough other people watching it to keep it on the air. That doesn't mean that the more successful shows are harming anything.

[cfrizz]

Originally Posted by Hampshire Nanny

I think you've given a good description of a casual reader vs a hard-core reader. I own a Kindle 3/keyboard, 2 other older eInk devices, an iPad and an iPhone. I keep a book on my iPhone so that I can read when it's the only device I have with me. I put the cookbooks and kids books on the iPad because its large color screen is conducive to enjoying those books. But for hard-core, heads-down, reading for many hours straight (can you say flight from LA to NYC?) it's eInk all the way. Easier on the eyes, easier on the battery.

Now see right there you are off base, I am a hard-core reader. I go through 100-200 books a year. The majority of my reading is done on my pc & Note 2 phone.

But by the same token I have no problem also reading on my T1 or mp3 player or Nexus tablet.

I don't allow myself to become distracted when I'm reading. When I'm reading on my pc, I have Pandora or WMP playing music, and I'm just reading away. When on my phone, the phone is off and I don't have a plan for accessing the web that is what my pc is for.

I prefer backlit screens for reading since my eyes are bad and I don't want to strain them trying to read in poor lighting conditions! I love reading on my T1 outside sitting in the sun getting a tan and reading.

My Note 2 battery last just fine all day long and then I plug it in at night when I turn in.

I'm going down to DC next week to visit my brother I will only have my Note 2 with me to read, & play my music while I'm reading. before this I had to lug my phone, mp3 player, and T1 to accomplish everything I wanted to. Now I just carry one machine for all of it.

I have never bought a Kindle nor do I have any interest in doing so. But if they are providing enough machines to satisfy most people, then as far as I'm concerned they are not DESTROYING anything!

People have been conditioned to constantly EXPECT improvements in all tech, but there is only so much you can do to any machine that is designed to read books. For the majority of us we want small, portable, and convenient. There are plenty of gadgets out there that do that now at prices we are willing to pay.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

the phone is off and I don't have a plan for accessing the web

You have a smart phone that works as a phone, but with no data plan? What carrier allows that?

[meeera]

Originally Posted by GERGE

Retina Macbook Pro has 220 PPI while Retina iPad has 264 PPI.
Kobo Glo and Kindle Paperwhite has 212 PPI, Kobo Aura HD has 265 PPI.

"Retina" also has a big viewing-distance fudge factor in its definition, so you can't compare those PPI-to-PPI. I hold my Kobo way closer to my eyes than I do my Macbook. iPhone and iPad Mini Retina are 326 PPI.

[cfrizz]

Originally Posted by ApK

You have a smart phone that works as a phone, but with no data plan? What carrier allows that?

T-Mobile. I buy $50.00 worth of minutes I can text and connect through Wi-Fi if within range. However, I find surfing the web on that little screen to be very frustrating. That is what a pc is for.

I only got a smart phone because I wanted to be able to read my ebooks and on occasion, listen to music while reading. Like when I'm stuck on a train with a screaming baby!

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by mgmueller

What is giving you this impression?


In Germany, when on the train, I experience exactly the opposite.
I assume, the hobbyist, students and academics you describe mostly would be of the younger generation below 25, 30 tops.

.

Not necessarily, no.
In audio, the "golden ears" hobbyists skew older, ditto for film photography.

Hobbyists doesn't mean dilettantes or explorers, rather the opposite: committed and dedicated users.

As for what gives me the impression that it is a hobbyist market: a tech product category that after seven years of continual development has only captured 3% of the market and still exists must be surviving off committed and dedicated hobbyists. The old laser disk market was just like that: it was a solid technology that really pleased its owners, who kept it afloat for years while the mainstream went with tape, and stayed with it even well into the DVD era.

And the impression that a good portion of the supporting market is students and academics, that comes from the demands for, and efforts devoted by the vendors to provide, ever greater pdf support. And the pining for cheap large format readers for pdf use.

[Manabi]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

I prefer backlit screens for reading since my eyes are bad and I don't want to strain them trying to read in poor lighting conditions! I love reading on my T1 outside sitting in the sun getting a tan and reading.

My eyes aren't exactly great either (without my glasses I'm quite literally legally blind in one eye) and I also find reading on back-lit LED/LCD screens works better on me for eye strain. I read on my Nook HD+ all the time, I probably spend an average of 7+ hours a day reading on it in fact, between books, manga, comics and browsing the web to read stuff. If I spend about 4 hours reading a paper book, my vision starts going blurry. Not so with the tablet. Also, if I read white text on black, it happens much, much faster. My vision can start blurring within 5 minutes! So I even tend to avoid web sites with a white on black theme.

So it's definitely not true that e-ink or paper is easier on the eyes for everyone.

Originally Posted by fjtorres

As for what gives me the impression that it is a hobbyist market: a tech product category that after seven years of continual development has only captured 3% of the market and still exists must be surviving off committed and dedicated hobbyists. The old laser disk market was just like that: it was a solid technology that really pleased its owners, who kept it afloat for years while the mainstream went with tape, and stayed with it even well into the DVD era.

Heh, I got in on the very end of the LD era and picked up a LD player dirt cheap along with some LDs even more dirt cheap. Wasn't a bad deal.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

While I have no doubt this is what some (maybe many) people experience, it is absolutely not true in my case. I can read indefinitely on a properly adjusted, backlit LCD tablet screen with no discernible eyestrain (at least no worse than the eyestrain I would get from reading a physical book, or from an eInk device, for the same length of time).

I think it's time that people stop declaring that LCD is worse for "eyestrain" than eInk as incontrovertible, universal fact. I've personally met too many people (and heard from many more) who defy this so called "rule" to continue to believe that mileage doesn't vary in this regard--a lot.

So how about we restrict our opinions (with regard to device eyestrain) to what does or doesn't strain our own eyes and and allow others to do the same.

I have to wonder what are the percentages involved. You say that LCD doesn't cause eye strain for you like it does for me, but what percentage of the market are the two different viewpoints. Ultimately that is where the market will go. Towards what is the most comfortable situation for the greatest number of people that is. I mean if say 25% of LCD users say they aren't suffering eye strain from using it and that same 25% do suffer eye strain using eink then that means 75% will be suffering eye strain on LCD and probably won't be while using eink. Of course those are just example percentages and I do wonder what the actual numbers are.

[Yapyap]

Re: LCD vs eInk - whichever way it goes, it doesn't make those of us preferring eInk and wanting it to stick around "dinosaurs" who are against innovation or what not. It just makes us people who prefer to read on eInk because it's more comfortable or convenient for us. I love my iPad and my phone, but not for reading; my eyes just can't take it comfortably.

As for Europe vs not-Europe - one has to keep in mind that "Europe" is not a homogenous market. What is true and valid in the UK (or in continental Europe, for France or Germany or a handful of other countries that have Kobo and Amazon catering to them in addition to local shops) isn't necessarily true for the majority of Europe.

Amazon and Kobo don't cover the majority of European languages, which means they're all but useless for a whole lot of European readers (especially those who don't read in English or German/French). Most European countries don't have the market for their local shops to develop store brand readers comparable to the Kindle, Nook or Kobo (at best, they can slap their brand on one of the other readers, e.g. our main bookshop chain is now offering a branded version of Pocketbook that includes a link to the online shop).

That + the adoption of ePub (it's watermarked here too, not Adobe DRM) pretty much means it's a much more open market where any reader (ePub or Kindle, since watermarked books are freely convertible) can compete - and Kindles and Kobos, with the 20% VAT added, don't really sell for remarkably cheaper than Pocketbook or Onyx or Sony.

[johnnyb]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

The only thing Amazon is guilty of is giving people what they want, all in one convenient place, at prices we are willing to pay. There is nothing illegal or destructive about that since we are the ones making the purchasing decisions.

Amazon still hasn't given me a proper Mac app which allows copying of text and some actual Mac app behavior... Since Apple did just that with iBooks, I'm not using the Kindle at all anymore and haven't bought a single book in over half a year... Mostly paper books now, of course not from Amazon...
They a quick to do something and then jump to something new, nominally being available on all platforms, without giving any of their products real polish needed (this is precisely their overall entrepreneurial philosophy)... I don't care about market metrics, they have ceased to give me what I want...

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by Yapyap

Re: LCD vs eInk - whichever way it goes, it doesn't make those of us preferring eInk and wanting it to stick around "dinosaurs" who are against innovation or what not. It just makes us people who prefer to read on eInk because it's more comfortable or convenient for us.

Absolutely. For my own part, I never intended to suggest otherwise. I'm merely tired of those whose eyes prefer reading on eInk clinging uselessly to the idea that their preference is somehow ... natural(?) ... or organic(?). Even if they're in the majority ... what would be the relevance? Preferences aren't required to have justification. Nor should they need vindication in numbers. Like what you (rhet) like without attempting to assign some sort of "natural order of things" quality to your choice.

I read entirely on LCD these days, myself. But I don't think there's any reason to believe that eInk devices won't stick around for the long haul. There may not be a myriad of choices/features for those who prefer them, but nobody's going to be forced to read books on technology that hurts their eyes.

[cfrizz]

I'm glad you found an app that works for you. That still doesn't mean Amazon is evil/bad, whatever. Buy from them or not, Amazon doesn't really care and neither does anyone else.

I'm not interested in buying any Apple products, they cost way too much money just for a name. That doesn't make them evil, it just means I'm not interested in buying their products.

The majority of us don't give a flip about market metrics, we simply want what we want and get it from whoever provides it at a cost we are willing to pay.

[Yapyap]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Absolutely. For my own part, I never intended to suggest otherwise. I'm merely tired of those whose eyes prefer reading on eInk clinging uselessly to the idea that their preference is somehow ... natural(?) ... or organic(?). Even if they're in the majority ... what would be the relevance? Preferences aren't required to have justification. Nor should they need vindication in numbers. Like what you (rhet) like without attempting to assign some sort of "natural order of things" quality to your choice.

That's perfectly understandable, and I also hope that with time, there will be fewer people going around telling those who prefer LCD devices that their preference is wrong and LCD cannot possibly be good. Whatever works!

I think there is a certain amount of fear among those of us (obviously not everyone) who have tried LCD devices and found them unsuitable, regardless of app or settings, for longer reading sessions, that if too many people start using multi-purpose devices / LCD devices for reading, eInk readers, which for many of us offer the best reading experience imaginable, will simply stop being offered. That fear, subconscious or not, may be what makes some people vocally defensive of eInk to the point of attacking LCD device suitability for everyone.

I've read two books on my iPad. It's doable, especially with sepia background and turning brightness to a point where it's not too bright but still offers enough contrast (for me that's around 50% - I've tried to read at lower brightness but just cannot) but I reach the stage of eyes starting to water heavily and "floaties" arriving a whole lot sooner than with eInk (or paper, although eInk seems even better these days). On the other hand, my mother is perfectly happy with my old 1st generation iPad for reading and has no complaints. So I'm quite aware it's a very personal thing!