Penguin ends library/Overdrive relationship starting tomorrow

[Synamon]

Here is a list of addresses for the publishers that won't supply libraries with ebooks that a librarian put together, if anyone is up for a sending some letters or emails to the publishers.

[rdfry]

Originally Posted by Synamon

Here is a list of addresses for the publishers that won't supply libraries with ebooks that a librarian put together, if anyone is up for a sending some letters or emails to the publishers.

Just did my part sent an email to each one of the misguided publishers.

[BearMountainBooks]

I thought for sure they would find a way to make some money and still be able to lend books. If they can't lend through libraries, they should start their own "library" even if it is "fee based."

I can understand them not wanting to just sell the books just once to a library, but to not have them there at all doesn't make sense either.

In fairness, I think they gave the idea a try and didn't like the results. It's a lot easier to borrow a book from the comfort of your living room. I know there have been times when I've bought a book just to have it delivered rather than to to the library, check it out and have to return it (or be on a wait list.) But with ebooks? I can check as easily at the library as Amazon. And the wait list is no big deal because they'll email me when it's ready. I can start reading without having to get in the car and pick it up.

Re: Piracy. It's alive and well and not having books in libraries or having them there makes no real difference. Those who were okay doing it before still will be and if they were choosing between the library and piracy, there wasn't much gain for the publisher anyway.

Originally Posted by spindlegirl

I dont do "sample chapters".

I'm okay with sample chapters for fiction, but have a real problem when it comes down to sample chapters for non-fiction. In a lot of cases, they will only include the prefactory material and maybe chapter 1 (where the first chapter is often a second introduction). I'm sorry, but that is not a representative sample of what they're selling. It is also a far cry from how I would preview a non-fiction book in a book store, where I would flip to the chapters that interest me to judge the quality of writing.

[SteveEisenberg]

Originally Posted by Synamon

I found some FAQs on the beta being used by the Kansas State Library, it's very early days for this system.

That was interesting. From the FAQ:

The platform fee for the old company was scheduled to increase by 700% over the next 3 years. The Kansas library community would have been unable to continue purchasing enough new downloadable books to keep up with demand. Because of this we have changed companies. The new downloadable services will be provided by One Click Digital (Recorded Books) for audiobooks and by 3M Cloud Library for ebooks.

Clicking on the "Open Letter" confirms that the old company was Overdrive:

The proposed new contract included:

•substantial subscription charges to individual libraries in the consortium;

•a 700% increase from 2010 to 2013 for the Digital Library Reserve Server
Application Service (platform) fee; and

•removal of language (11.4) that acknowledged consortium ownership of
material. . . .

The State Library (acting on behalf of the Consortium) was also required to obtain permission from each of the 163 publishers of purchased audio and ebook content so that the content could be moved to a new platform vendor. As of today, the State Library has received 88 publisher permission forms and has permission to move the content of 3804 audio and 875 ebooks to the new providers.

This would seem to be a pitifully small number of titles, even if only a portion of what they will have on the 3M platform. Also, their description of the 3M beta problems sounds above the norm. As a professional programmer, I can understand performance problems when you start getting large numbers of simultaneous users. But this sounds lame, even for a beta test:

3M did not want to overload the new system, so only 2 librarians at a time have had access to the shopping interface. They have purchased around 150 books in less than 2 weeks.

I theory, I like the 3M model on grounds of it being so inconvenient that publishers won't see it as a threat. In practice, I hope my libraries can afford to keep with Overdrive.

[BearMountainBooks]

Originally Posted by SteveEisenberg

That was interesting. From the FAQ:


Clicking on the "Open Letter" confirms that the old company was Overdrive:


This would seem to be a pitifully small number of titles, even if only a portion of what they will have on the 3M platform. Also, their description of the 3M beta problems sounds above the norm. As a professional programmer, I can understand performance problems when you start getting large numbers of simultaneous users. But this sounds lame, even for a beta test:



I theory, I like the 3M model on grounds of it being so inconvenient that publishers won't see it as a threat. In practice, I hope my libraries can afford to keep with Overdrive.

From talking to my librarians, using overdrive wasn't error free or all that pleasant to learn--and they mentioned it was VERY expensive too. One of the reasons it took them so long to join (and when they did, they had to go in with two other libraries) was the overdrive software/platform fees--not the price of books. I think when people get angry at the publishers for not buying into the system, one thing that gets lost is that the middle man might be part of the problem. I looked at Overdrive's contract a few years ago to see if it was possible or worthwhile to try and get my books on the system. The problems were pretty hard to overcome. I would have had to raise the price of my books considerably for it to make sense (10 dollars or higher), join in with other writers (hassle) AND they take a cut from the price of the book when a library decides to license it. So overdrive gets money for supplying the platform and also a cut of each book that is licensed.

It can be very difficult to even consider doing the work involved to join a platform like that given some of the expenses. I would love to see more books in the system, but I can understand why some of the publishers are just walking away. The hassle and the expense is probably not working out logically for their bottom line (even counting exposure.) And I think a large reason might be the lack of competition in the library platform space. Other companies probably want to offer something like overdrive, but overdrive has a foot in the door.

There are other software platforms for libraries (not for ebooks--for checking out books) sold to libraries. I can tell you from working there that those companies take full advantage of the fact that the library is a government entity. They charge ENORMOUS fees for support, upgrades and licensing fees to use the software. I'm guessing Overdrive operates the same way.

So the barriers aren't just the publishers. There's politics/contracts with a government entity (read: cash cow) involved.

Just a few random thoughts.

[tubemonkey]

Libraries need to get this sorted out, because the future is digital technology. Libraries that don't embrace ebooks will eventually disappear.

I don't care whose service they adopt, just as long as I can download books from the comfort of my home and/or device. Under no circumstances will I accept in-library only downloading.

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

Libraries need to get this sorted out, because the future is digital technology. Libraries that don't embrace ebooks will eventually disappear.

Maybe publishers want libraries to disappear? If I recall correctly, this type of behaviour is also why the US adopted the doctrine of first sale over a century ago.

Does anyone know if public libraries have been working with university libraries in this regard. Even though their needs are different, they are working under the same laws and university libraries have been dealing with electronic books and periodicals on a large scale for a much longer time. Some of the problems that public libraries are facing now sound very similar to the problems that university libraries were facing 15 years ago.

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by elemenoP

And also: is it really true, or was it a misunderstanding, that Hachette actually pulled titles when they restricted their library lending?

I don't think that it's true. My library still has titles under Hachette's various labels and I'm sure it they had pulled titles there would have been an internet uproar like there has been for Penguin or when Harper went to their 26 checkout restriction.

[dkperez]

According to the librarians where I live, they feel caught in the middle. Demand for ebooks has increased astronomically, but the publishers are making fewer and fewer titles available.

And, (I have no idea whether it's Overdrive or publishers doing) the prices for ebooks is significantly HIGHER than the library pays for hard cover books.

I've seen in this thread references to ADA and right of first purchase. Is the US law so far behind that it doesn't cover ebooks as well as "printed" books? And if so, is there any indication that something will be done soon to address the war on libraries currently in process by the publishers?

[BearMountainBooks]

Originally Posted by dkperez

According to the librarians where I live, they feel caught in the middle. Demand for ebooks has increased astronomically, but the publishers are making fewer and fewer titles available.

And, (I have no idea whether it's Overdrive or publishers doing) the prices for ebooks is significantly HIGHER than the library pays for hard cover books.

I've seen in this thread references to ADA and right of first purchase. Is the US law so far behind that it doesn't cover ebooks as well as "printed" books? And if so, is there any indication that something will be done soon to address the war on libraries currently in process by the publishers?

The cost of ebooks *is* higher. That was the first attempt (I believe) of publishers to reconcile the costs of overdrive, getting in the program and trying to figure out how they could make money on at least a sale. The same thing is basically how audio works--some of those audio books are very, very high because the publisher has a large number of upfront costs and does not expect to be able to sell a large volume amount. So they charge much more for the products. They well-know the audio will be "recirculated" and "resold" multiple times.

Now, I am not a big fan of publishers, but having looked over some of the costs and what contracts I could see and having formatted books and looked into requirements, I honestly think if I were a publisher I'd be looking for a different solution to getting books into the hands of readers (other than overdrive). And I suspect that is what they are doing. Either another vendor so that there is some competition or doing it from Penguin's own site. I don't think it's a war on libraries, I think it's a desperate attempt to get books into circulation and make some recurring revenue. Now how much is fair for lending/borrowing is another story. And look, in the long run if publishers can't afford the program, that means they aren't getting paid and authors aren't getting paid and that is only going to delay books more.

I'm not sure what you're referring to as right of purchase as I'm not even sure it applies to hardcover, but that could be my ignorance. I do know that the ebooks are not SOLD, they are licensed and licensing laws are more typical with software and anything electronic than a sale.

[Andrew H.]

Originally Posted by dkperez

And, (I have no idea whether it's Overdrive or publishers doing) the prices for ebooks is significantly HIGHER than the library pays for hard cover books.

Well, to some extent this makes sense, since OD is not only providing the books, but also taking care of distributing the checked out book.

I've seen in this thread references to ADA and right of first purchase. Is the US law so far behind that it doesn't cover ebooks as well as "printed" books?
[/quote]
The ADA is a red herring - it doesn't compel publishers to provide e-books to libraries. And US law isn't "behind" any other law wrt the first purchase doctrine - a lot of countries don't even have a first purchase doctrine to begin with. And, again, that's not really relevant to the issue of publishers providing libraries - or not providing libraries - with e-books.

And if so, is there any indication that something will be done soon to address the war on libraries currently in process by the publishers?

I think libraries need to investigate alternatives. But we may end up in a situation where libraries have no new release e-books from big publishers, and only half of big publishers provide any e-books at all. And I don't think there's really anything to do about that legally.

[anamardoll]

Originally Posted by calibrated

A USB cable? Really? How...quaint.

One is almost tempted to saddle up the horse, hitch up the buggy, ride into town and send them a sharply worded telegram.

[sabredog]

Looks like a movement exposing the current navel gazing by the agency publishers in regards to Overdrive is starting, prompted by signs pinned up at the article author's library workplace..

Looks like more readers will turn to casual piracy if they cannot loan an ebook from their local library.



http://www.teleread.com/library/noti...arah-houghton/

[tubemonkey]

There's nothing wrong with publishers refusing to sell ebooks to libraries. Writing them to voice your displeasure is a waste of time unless you back it up by boycotting all of their imprints and all of their authors.