What do you think the Amazon Kindle means for the Sony Readers? - Page 5

Nate the great · 11-20-2007, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lemurion

I figure it just means that mobi DRM is going to get busted wide open really soon.

from your keyboard to hacker's ears...

pilotbob · 11-20-2007, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rflashman

For me it is easy. Since day one I have been waiting for Sony to live up to its 'promise' to provide newspapers. I don't need the wireless link, just that their Connect store sold me some formatted newspapers. They never bothered to.

Kindle is offering what I want (NYT, Washington Post, etc.) so that is my key decision and I willing to spend money on that. So I ordered my Kindle today and will most likely eBay my Sony reader (bet it doesn't get much after this)...

Rick

Is it a PRS-500? How old is it, and what would you want for it?

BOb

astra · 11-20-2007, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate the great

from your keyboard to hacker's ears...

LOL

I am with you on this one!

Greg G · 11-20-2007, 12:01 PM

I think that the apeal of the Kindle will be the "no computer requried" thing. Ipod certainly proved that a device that requires a computer connection can work but people who listen to portable music players and people who read lots of books can be very different regarding their willingness to use computers.

My father is in the market for an e-book reader this holiday season and I'm not sure what to reccomend. I know I'll get lots less tech support calls if I steer him toward the Kindle. The downside is that we won't be able to share purchased books (I figure we would share an account and use gift cards to avoid abusing each other's credit cards). The other big issue to me is that the screen resolution on the kindle is lower. I really notice the difference between my 500 and 505. If the Kindle is more like the 500 screen I will probably be suggesting the 505 for $100 less. Another thing that bothers me is that the Kindle is ugly and looks bulky. Too bad we can't go to a B&M store and hold one. I look forward to seeing what our early adopters who have both have to say when compairing them side by side.

-Greg

kovidgoyal · 11-20-2007, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

No, it literally is Mobi DRM. If you take a Kindle file, rename it to ".prc" or ".mobi" and open it in Mobi Reader, you see the cover page and get told that the book hasn't been activated for your device. This is precisely the same behavior you get with any other Mobi DRM file that's not encoded for your device. It looks as if all that's happening is that this is standard MobiPocket DRM using a PID that's internal to the Kindle.

That may be because both DRM formats expose metadata, including cover in an unencrypted form. Of course, it may also be that the DRM algorithm is the same.

M0zza · 11-20-2007, 01:52 PM

Do you think this means not even a slight chance of mobipocket reader for Sony. Or do you think Amazon will be more interested in sellng books?

I suppose as they are using their own format. The former.

kovidgoyal · 11-20-2007, 01:55 PM

I think amazon will start out married to the kindle and then eventually realize the error of their ways.

M0zza · 11-20-2007, 02:04 PM

I'm more hoping for a Mobipocket release for the sony reader. I agree with you that eventually Amazon will release books in multiformat (although I think there will be a lag when releasing hot titles).

I'm hoping that there is enough independence between Amazon and Mobipocket to allow them to carry on releasing the reader for other devices. So I can download Mobi books that are already out there.

edsohsmith · 11-20-2007, 02:43 PM

Quote:

No, it literally is Mobi DRM. If you take a Kindle file, rename it to ".prc" or ".mobi" and open it in Mobi Reader, you see the cover page and get told that the book hasn't been activated for your device.

But the point is the intention is to exclude you from reading amazon kindle files on you Cybook or other ebook device. Hence, another DRM format.

HarryT · 11-20-2007, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edsohsmith

But the point is the intention is to exclude you from reading amazon kindle files on you Cybook or other ebook device. Hence, another DRM format.

Another use of an existing DRM format is probably more technically accurate but yes, I see what you're saying.

KlondikeGeoff · 11-20-2007, 03:43 PM

What do you think the Amazon Kindle means for the Sony Readers?

I'll tell you what I think it will mean. First, let me say, as I have on these forums before, that I had (and still have and use) the old Rocket eBook. It had many features such as dictionary, annotation, search, etc that Sony did not bother with for some odd reason, but Kindle has incorporated.

It may not look as sleek as the Reader, but it will "read" the same with loads of extra neato features, such as the wireless download, keyboard, six sizes of type, etc.

Now, back to poor old Rocket eBook, which started life as an RCA device, and then was acquired by Gemstar, British publishers of "TV Guide." It was heavier and thicker because it had backlighting and a touchscreen, but otherwise was a great device, years before Sony got into the field. One terrific thing for people for vision problems was that you could download any two fonts and point sizes that was on your computer, and really get large print books that way. Also, you could adjust the brightness in several steps as well as the contrast, read from all four directions, reverse the page-foward page-back buttons, and more.

All in all, it was a wonderful device. Like the Reader, every time I was in a doctor's office, a store, or an airport reading it, invariably somebody asked what it was, and when they saw, they thought it was way cool. Several of my friends bought them after seeing mine. You could also buy and download books from Amazon and Barnes & Noble. Their Librarian software was excellent too.

So, Gemstar in their infinite wisdom finally announced that they were discontinuing it because they were not selling enough of them.

You may not be surprised by this, as they absolutely NEVER ever advertised or promoted the availability of their eBook, so obviously, nobody knew about it except by word-of-mouth, or somebody happening upon one in a store.

Now, I was very disappointed by that, but I kept downloading enough PG free books to keep me going, and still use it when want to read at night or in a dark place.

When Sony announced the forthcoming Reader, I sent an email asking to be on their list when it came out, and they did, and when it was released, was one of the first to buy it. It is great, and I love it, despite the fact that they had left out so many features that the eBook had years ago. And despite the horrendous, stupid Connect website.

Also, I am chagrined and appalled to see that Sony seems to be following Gemstar's idiotic policy of keeping it pretty much a secret. If they advertised it at a tiny fraction of the amount they do for their other consumer products, there would be a quantum jump in sales, but for some unknown reason, they don't seem to want to. Very mysterious.

I therefore predict, that even if they change their minds and start promoting, it is far too late to compete with the power that Amazon.com can exert in promoting the Kindle. They may keep it going on a tiny scale, but it will never compete with Amazon's ability to do business on a vast scale. I hope it continues, and I will keep mine, but expect will get a Kindle after it has aged a bit and/or the next version comes out.

Alas, poor ol' Sony will never be able to catch up to Amazon. I hope I'm wrong, but doubt it.

slayda · 11-20-2007, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaleDe

In the Kindle forum someone already bought a book and downloaded it to his pc. He is still waiting for his Kindle to appear they registered it before it even shipped. He will use USB to load the file from his PC tomorrow when his Kindle appears.

Dale

But was he able to read it on the PC?

TheLongshot · 11-20-2007, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KlondikeGeoff

Also, I am chagrined and appalled to see that Sony seems to be following Gemstar's idiotic policy of keeping it pretty much a secret. If they advertised it at a tiny fraction of the amount they do for their other consumer products, there would be a quantum jump in sales, but for some unknown reason, they don't seem to want to. Very mysterious.

Very par for the course for Sony, tho. (See: SACD)

Jason

slayda · 11-20-2007, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

No, it literally is Mobi DRM. If you take a Kindle file, rename it to ".prc" or ".mobi" and open it in Mobi Reader, you see the cover page and get told that the book hasn't been activated for your device. This is precisely the same behavior you get with any other Mobi DRM file that's not encoded for your device. It looks as if all that's happening is that this is standard MobiPocket DRM using a PID that's internal to the Kindle.

May be a dumb question since I don't buy DRMed Mobipocket, but would it be possible to read the Kindle book with a PC Mobipocket reader if you could discover what the Kindle PID was?

DaleDe · 11-20-2007, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slayda

But was he able to read it on the PC?

No, nothing in the literature has ever indicated that Kindle files could be read on a pc. Perhaps someday but not now. Of course the real answer is. What in the world would you ever want to do that when you have a reader??!!

Dale

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11-20-2007, 12:01 PM	#64
Greg G Groupie Posts: 181 Karma: 66 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: NJ Device: Kindle Papwerwhite	I think that the apeal of the Kindle will be the "no computer requried" thing. Ipod certainly proved that a device that requires a computer connection can work but people who listen to portable music players and people who read lots of books can be very different regarding their willingness to use computers. My father is in the market for an e-book reader this holiday season and I'm not sure what to reccomend. I know I'll get lots less tech support calls if I steer him toward the Kindle. The downside is that we won't be able to share purchased books (I figure we would share an account and use gift cards to avoid abusing each other's credit cards). The other big issue to me is that the screen resolution on the kindle is lower. I really notice the difference between my 500 and 505. If the Kindle is more like the 500 screen I will probably be suggesting the 505 for $100 less. Another thing that bothers me is that the Kindle is ugly and looks bulky. Too bad we can't go to a B&M store and hold one. I look forward to seeing what our early adopters who have both have to say when compairing them side by side. -Greg

11-20-2007, 01:52 PM	#66
M0zza Geek... Apparently Posts: 211 Karma: 51260 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Herts, UK Device: Sony PRS-505 (Silver), ASUS Transformer TF300T, IPAD Air 2	Do you think this means not even a slight chance of mobipocket reader for Sony. Or do you think Amazon will be more interested in sellng books? I suppose as they are using their own format. The former.

11-20-2007, 01:55 PM	#67
kovidgoyal creator of calibre Posts: 45,347 Karma: 27182818 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mumbai, India Device: Various	I think amazon will start out married to the kindle and then eventually realize the error of their ways.

11-20-2007, 02:04 PM	#68
M0zza Geek... Apparently Posts: 211 Karma: 51260 Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Herts, UK Device: Sony PRS-505 (Silver), ASUS Transformer TF300T, IPAD Air 2	I'm more hoping for a Mobipocket release for the sony reader. I agree with you that eventually Amazon will release books in multiformat (although I think there will be a lag when releasing hot titles). I'm hoping that there is enough independence between Amazon and Mobipocket to allow them to carry on releasing the reader for other devices. So I can download Mobi books that are already out there.

11-20-2007, 03:43 PM	#71
KlondikeGeoff Wombat Aficionado Posts: 481 Karma: 733 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Arizona Device: Fire, Kindle1, Sony PRS-500 Reader, Rocket 1100 eBook	What do you think the Amazon Kindle means for the Sony Readers? I'll tell you what I think it will mean. First, let me say, as I have on these forums before, that I had (and still have and use) the old Rocket eBook. It had many features such as dictionary, annotation, search, etc that Sony did not bother with for some odd reason, but Kindle has incorporated. It may not look as sleek as the Reader, but it will "read" the same with loads of extra neato features, such as the wireless download, keyboard, six sizes of type, etc. Now, back to poor old Rocket eBook, which started life as an RCA device, and then was acquired by Gemstar, British publishers of "TV Guide." It was heavier and thicker because it had backlighting and a touchscreen, but otherwise was a great device, years before Sony got into the field. One terrific thing for people for vision problems was that you could download any two fonts and point sizes that was on your computer, and really get large print books that way. Also, you could adjust the brightness in several steps as well as the contrast, read from all four directions, reverse the page-foward page-back buttons, and more. All in all, it was a wonderful device. Like the Reader, every time I was in a doctor's office, a store, or an airport reading it, invariably somebody asked what it was, and when they saw, they thought it was way cool. Several of my friends bought them after seeing mine. You could also buy and download books from Amazon and Barnes & Noble. Their Librarian software was excellent too. So, Gemstar in their infinite wisdom finally announced that they were discontinuing it because they were not selling enough of them. You may not be surprised by this, as they absolutely NEVER ever advertised or promoted the availability of their eBook, so obviously, nobody knew about it except by word-of-mouth, or somebody happening upon one in a store. Now, I was very disappointed by that, but I kept downloading enough PG free books to keep me going, and still use it when want to read at night or in a dark place. When Sony announced the forthcoming Reader, I sent an email asking to be on their list when it came out, and they did, and when it was released, was one of the first to buy it. It is great, and I love it, despite the fact that they had left out so many features that the eBook had years ago. And despite the horrendous, stupid Connect website. Also, I am chagrined and appalled to see that Sony seems to be following Gemstar's idiotic policy of keeping it pretty much a secret. If they advertised it at a tiny fraction of the amount they do for their other consumer products, there would be a quantum jump in sales, but for some unknown reason, they don't seem to want to. Very mysterious. I therefore predict, that even if they change their minds and start promoting, it is far too late to compete with the power that Amazon.com can exert in promoting the Kindle. They may keep it going on a tiny scale, but it will never compete with Amazon's ability to do business on a vast scale. I hope it continues, and I will keep mine, but expect will get a Kindle after it has aged a bit and/or the next version comes out. Alas, poor ol' Sony will never be able to catch up to Amazon. I hope I'm wrong, but doubt it.

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