Register Guidelines E-Books Today's Posts Search

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > News

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-28-2011, 02:52 PM   #61
Keryl Raist
Zealot
Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Keryl Raist's Avatar
 
Posts: 140
Karma: 379182
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Charleston, SC
Device: Kindle for PC
Quote:
Originally Posted by emilikins View Post
Libraries do not kick people out of their homes, and generally get a very small slice of the tax pie. Our city, which is a major metro area, the average property tax payer only has $75-$150 of their property tax going to the library - and we're not a low tax city.
Just because it's a small slice of the pie doesn't mean it isn't there.

The question is: what social services are we as a society willing to evict people over? The library may be pretty far down on the list, but it's still there.

There's also a reason why it's far down on the list. The vast majority of people will say that yes, it's okay to toss someone out of their house to make sure the fire department, cops, and hospitals stay open. By the time you get to schools, probably about half of the respondents no longer think it's a good idea. My guess is by the time you get to libraries and parks, very few people think it's a worth while trade-off.
Keryl Raist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2011, 03:06 PM   #62
MrsJoseph
Loves Ellipsis...
MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.MrsJoseph ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
MrsJoseph's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,554
Karma: 7899232
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Device: Kobo Wifi (broken), nook STR (returned), Kobo Touch, Sony T1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keryl Raist View Post
Just because it's a small slice of the pie doesn't mean it isn't there.

The question is: what social services are we as a society willing to evict people over? The library may be pretty far down on the list, but it's still there.

There's also a reason why it's far down on the list. The vast majority of people will say that yes, it's okay to toss someone out of their house to make sure the fire department, cops, and hospitals stay open. By the time you get to schools, probably about half of the respondents no longer think it's a good idea. My guess is by the time you get to libraries and parks, very few people think it's a worth while trade-off.
While it is true that if you don't pay your property taxes the government can - and will - take your home...we all know that even if the pittance given to libraries via property taxes was removed our taxes would be just as high. People would still be kicked out of their homes if they did not pay taxes. The only difference is that instead of your $15-$20/year going to the library and literacy it would now go to something stupid like "Parks and Recreation" or "needed to pick up a hooker across state lines." That money would NOT reappear in your pocket.
MrsJoseph is offline   Reply With Quote
Advert
Old 10-28-2011, 04:05 PM   #63
Andrew H.
Grand Master of Flowers
Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 2,201
Karma: 8389072
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Naptown
Device: Kindle PW, Kindle 3 (aka Keyboard), iPhone, iPad 3 (not for reading)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsJoseph View Post
While it is true that if you don't pay your property taxes the government can - and will - take your home...we all know that even if the pittance given to libraries via property taxes was removed our taxes would be just as high. People would still be kicked out of their homes if they did not pay taxes. The only difference is that instead of your $15-$20/year going to the library and literacy it would now go to something stupid like "Parks and Recreation" or "needed to pick up a hooker across state lines." That money would NOT reappear in your pocket.
I agree with this generally, although most people where I live pay $100-$200 in property taxes to support the library (4% of property taxes go to the library).

But I doubt that there is anyone who can pay 96% of their property taxes, but just can't come up with the last 4%.
Andrew H. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2011, 07:08 PM   #64
Rob Lister
Fanatic
Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Rob Lister ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 532
Karma: 3293888
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Virginia
Device: Nook Simple Touch
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew H. View Post
I agree with this generally, although most people where I live pay $100-$200 in property taxes to support the library (4% of property taxes go to the library).

But I doubt that there is anyone who can pay 96% of their property taxes, but just can't come up with the last 4%.
I doubt your doubt. I bet roughly 4% of those that can't pay their property tax miss by only the last 4%.
Rob Lister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2011, 09:31 PM   #65
BWinmill
Nameless Being
 
I have found that most of the people who complain about taxes do so because they don't want to pay taxes, not because they cannot afford it. And as libertarian as some people may try to sound, they'll squeal as soon as someone threatens to dismantle infrastructure that they deem essential. I'm sorry to be blunt, but I have found that is how people tend to be over such things.

Libraries serve many important social functions. They are probably the cheapest form of education, way to provide employment resources, way to provide business resources, way to promote arts and culture, and so forth. They are cheap because their collections serve so many purposes. They are cheap because their spaces provide so many purposes. They are cheap because they do what every civil society should do: share their resources.

Libraries are also places where every sector of society meet, from the homeless to the wealthy. So it isn't a matter of saying that they shouldn't be supported because they serve one group of people over another. No librarian is going to kick out a successful business person for using their databases for business purposes (and why should they, they pay taxes too). No librarian is going to give a homeless man the boot because they want to escape the streets for the printed word.

But if you really insist that libraries are a burden and ought to be dismantled, can I please insist that some of the government programs that I disagree with be dismantled. I mean huge globs of money would be saved if most of the roads were torn up, leaving only enough capacity was left for commercial vehicles and public transportation (heck, I'd even be willing to pay the real costs of public transportation through my fares if that happened).
  Reply With Quote
Advert
Old 10-28-2011, 09:38 PM   #66
BWinmill
Nameless Being
 
Double Post
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2011, 07:27 PM   #67
Keryl Raist
Zealot
Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Keryl Raist ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Keryl Raist's Avatar
 
Posts: 140
Karma: 379182
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Charleston, SC
Device: Kindle for PC
Quote:
Originally Posted by BWinmill View Post

But if you really insist that libraries are a burden and ought to be dismantled, can I please insist that some of the government programs that I disagree with be dismantled. I mean huge globs of money would be saved if most of the roads were torn up, leaving only enough capacity was left for commercial vehicles and public transportation (heck, I'd even be willing to pay the real costs of public transportation through my fares if that happened).
While I have not suggested Libraries be dismantled, I'm more than fine with people paying the actual costs of the services they use.

Also, ripping up the roads just costs more money. Selling them to private owners who may keep them up (or not) as they so chose allows the public sector more money to do other things, and shifts the burden of road upkeep to those who wish to pay for it.
Keryl Raist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2011, 11:42 PM   #68
BWinmill
Nameless Being
 
Well, that last comment was heavy with sarcasm since I have found that many of the people who will adamantly oppose institutions such as libraries, public education, health care, mass transit, etc. will scream bloody murder if roads aren't expanded (or whatever their pet program is).

But I would suggest that a lot of people forget why a lot of these institutions. Governments usually fund libraries, schools, hospitals, mass transit, power generation, etc. for economic reasons (rather than idealistic socialist goals). Roads were originally built to facilitate the transportation of goods. Power generation was taken over by government to provide cheap electricity for factories, schools were funded to create an educated workforce and indoctrinated citizens. In other words, it is mostly about jobs. That doesn't change the fact that people such as myself support them for more socialistic ideals, but I don't think that the opinion of left-wingers should persuade the other side that these government services aren't necessary.

After all, libraries are good for adult education (which is poorly serviced by the government otherwise). Libraries provide valuable resources for entrepreneurs to do market research prior to setting out to create new jobs (which they couldn't afford to do if they had to pay for database access themselves). And the list can go on. These institutions are a net benefit to almost everyone ... unless you believe that we should go back to the "good old days" when these resources didn't exist.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
the future of libraries and ebooks on NPR kindlekitten News 32 04-12-2011 09:02 PM
The Future, Libraries and eBooks 6charlong General Discussions 7 08-09-2010 10:35 AM
CNN article on Changing/Future Libraries kennyc News 0 09-04-2009 02:32 PM
Science Friday segment on Digital Libraries vranghel News 0 05-14-2007 02:39 PM
Do libraries have a future? Bob Russell Deals and Resources (No Self-Promotion or Affiliate Links) 28 10-13-2006 02:20 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:53 PM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.