Troubleshooting Kindle 3G, got scammed...

[DiapDealer]

I think you should have drained your savings account paying a private detective to track down the original owner of the Kindle, or maybe a psychic. Amazon doesn't want it... cops don't want it... yep, you should have gone with a psychic private detective at your own expense. Any other decision shows a horrific lack of judgement.

There probably is no "owner," pining away for his stolen Kindle. Amazon doesn't always require the return of a Kindle when they exchange them. People are scamming Amazon all the time with "Mine never got delivered" or "It just didn't work when it got here." Amazon writes it off, blacklists the serial number, and then that blacklisted Kindle gets sold to some poor unsuspecting (or suspecting) schmuck. The "owner" was probably the crook... and Amazon, in their own way, are encouraging a Kindle black-market by not requiring returns of "defective" units instead of asking people to "pretty-please dispose of them properly."

[Tome Keeper]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

I think you should have drained your savings account paying a private detective to track down the original owner of the Kindle, or maybe a psychic. Amazon doesn't want it... cops don't want it... yep, you should have gone with a psychic private detective at your own expense. Any other decision shows a horrific lack of judgement.

There probably is no "owner," pining away for his stolen Kindle. Amazon doesn't always require the return of a Kindle when they exchange them. People are scamming Amazon all the time with "Mine never got delivered" or "It just didn't work when it got here." Amazon writes it off, blacklists the serial number, and then that blacklisted Kindle gets sold to some poor unsuspecting (or suspecting) schmuck. The "owner" was probably the crook... and Amazon, in their own way, are encouraging a Kindle black-market by not requiring returns of "defective" units instead of asking people to "pretty-please dispose of them properly."

In the first post the OP says that Amazon CS told him that the Kindle was stolen. All some posters are saying is that returning the blacklisted Kindle to the person who sold it, what ever the reason for its blacklisting, just allows the scammer to do it again to someone else.

However, I get that that may have been the quickest/simplest way to get the money back.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

and Amazon, in their own way, are encouraging a Kindle black-market by not requiring returns of "defective" units instead of asking people to "pretty-please dispose of them properly."

You make that sound like a bad thing.

I don't mean the black market part, but if Amazon can afford to make things easier for it's customers that way, good for them.

And I have a sneaky suspicion that Amazon is not losing too badly in this. Despite some silly claims about Amazon lacking in customer service because they won't support the stolen Kindle, I wonder how many poor victims of the scammers Amazon has rescued by selling them a refurb, thereby bringing them in to the Kindle fold?

[Poppaea]

Originally Posted by Tome Keeper

In the first post the OP says that Amazon CS told him that the Kindle was stolen. All some posters are saying is that returning the blacklisted Kindle to the person who sold it, what ever the reason for its blacklisting, just allows the scammer to do it again to someone else.

However, I get that that may have been the quickest/simplest way to get the money back.

He does not know who bought the Kindle and Amazon won't tell him!

The OP has reported the seller to ebay and Amazon. What else do you think he is to do??? DiapDealer is right, obviously people will only be satisfied when he comes up with Sherlock Holmes, a mad fortune teller who will point out the thief and a giant bloodhound to identify the original owner, restores the Kindle to the buyer and lights a candle in Rome in Saint Pauls Cathedral that was blessed by the Pope.

As far as I can see he did what he was able to do.

[Tome Keeper]

Originally Posted by Poppaea

He does not know who bought the Kindle and Amazon won't tell him!
.

I didn't say he knew who brought the Kindle. I said that Amazon had told him it was stolen, as a poster was suggesting it was simply a defective Kindle that Amazon had exchanged, and said that by returning it to the person who SOLD it to HIM, that person may well try to scam other people.

I also agreed that by returning it to that person, was probably the easiest way to get the OPs money back.

I'm not suggesting the OP tries to find the original owner. He has done most of what is in his power, the only other thing, in the UK, would have been to hand the Kindle into the police as stolen property, but obviously in that case the OP wouldn't have got his money back, so he did what he could and what was best for him.

[DiapDealer]

You make that sound like a bad thing.

I don't mean the black market part, but if Amazon can afford to make things easier for it's customers that way, good for them.

It wasn't my intention to make it sound like a "bad" thing. I was just trying to make the point that these situations where people who buy second-hand Kindles--only to find that they have been reported "stolen" or are blacklisted--are not governed by the normal "There's a Right and Wrong Thing to Do Here" guidelines.

People just seem to be too quick to jump on the "You've received stolen property and you have to turn over to the police! OMG!" bandwagon. It's not that simple. The police don't want it because no one has reported it stolen... and if they have reported it stolen, the only entity (Amazon) who could put the police in contact with rightful owner of the Kindle (through serial numbers and registration details) has chosen not to participate in any such investigation (nor do they want the device returned to them). Probably because giving personal customer information to the police would be frowned on by a paranoid (and rightfully so) public. Can't (shouldn't) risk the bad PR.

So my interpretation is not that the OP chose the easiest or quickest solution, but rather he chose the ONLY solution left to him. He even took extra steps and left the seller negative feedback. Sleep easy, OP... some of us have your back!

[ApK]

Really, in the OPs case, if the seller was willing to meet him and return his money, seriously, how shady could he have been?

Failing getting your money back from the seller or eBay/Paypal, I think my personal course, even being the law and order hound I am, would have been to return it to Amazon.
I agree that it probably would not have warranted any attention from the police, and I think Amazon is probably in a better position to do the right thing with it anyway.

ApK

[ProfCrash]

He reported the seller to Amazon and EBay. He did all that he could do. I know folks who reported similar situations to the Police and they did nothing. The device is not worth enough to merit real attention.

The only person who knows if the Kindle was reported as defective or was stolen is the seller. There is little that can be done to that individual. The OP reported the seller to Amazon and EBay. That is all he can do.

[SameOldStory]

Person #1, Joe Doe.
An item is stolen. Joe Doe reports it to the police, Amazon, and his insurance company.
The insurance company reads the police report and pays Joe.

Amazon.
Amazon can report that this item is stolen/blacklisted/non-supported. BUT THEY CAN NOT TAKE IT BACK! IT IS NOT THEIRS ANYLONGER.

The insurance company.
The item belongs to them if it's ever recovered. THEY HAVE REIMBERSED THE PROPERTY OWNER FOR THE ITEM.

The OP.
His first question is how to use an item that was sold to him and may be stolen.

Originally Posted by Anubis_

Is it possible to buy a new Kindle ( i.e. a broken one) retrieve it's serial number and overwrite the serial number of the blacklisted Kindle with it ( i've read you can do it in debug mode). Then register the kindle normally.

Thanks

Later he threatens the "vender" with a bad rating, and the "Vender" gives in.

Originally Posted by Anubis_

Going to contact Amazon, I just contacted the vendor saying I'm going to file complaints on both the auction site and the payment system (pay-pal): Let's see what happens, these people that do such scams need to pay the consequences.

(Just what are the "consequences" of reporting someone in this situation? One negative mark on their record? Or do they get banned from using ebay/paypal forever.)


He's taking more heat than he feels is justified and decides to lay a big chunk of the blame on Amazon. If someone needs to have this explained, I don't think that they would be able to understand. But do remember that it's not Amazons anymore, and even if you put it in their hands, they can not just give it to the original purchaser. (Why an I beating a dead horse! )

Originally Posted by Anubis_

...and obviously Amazon is being unco-operative. They can't disclose anything and they don't care about whoever lost/got stolen the Kindle in the first place. Great stuff :\

Later.

Originally Posted by Anubis_

The seller said he's taking it back and refunding me.
He wants to meet this sunday...Am I gonna get shanked?
I'll let you know what happens after meeting him...or not if I' m dead..

Having gotten his money back, he now notifies ebay and paypal that the seller is a crook (in his opinion).

Originally Posted by Anubis_

as bad as this is, I got not other choice but try to contact the seller (should I even bother, he's a thief) or keep it...

The item is, probably, now for sale again. But he got his money back, so all ends well. Right?

[DiapDealer]

The item is, probably, now for sale again. But he got his money back, so all ends well. Right?

Yep, pretty much.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by SameOldStory

But do remember that it's not Amazons anymore, and even if you put it in their hands, they can not just give it to the original purchaser.

But they could recycle it, maybe even refurbish it, keep it off the black market, and possibly give the person who sends it in a good deal on a legit unit as a customer service gesture.

[SameOldStory]

Kinda like what Apple does when you sit on your iPhone and break the display? I guess that would be fair. But to do that, they would have to buy it from the insurance company. Remember it no longer belongs to Amazon or the original purchaser.

[ApK]

Originally Posted by SameOldStory

But to do that, they would have to buy it from the insurance company.

I can see that happening.

[TMPoole]

Originally Posted by Anubis_

People sell Kindles with broken batteries, screens etc, I just need an authentic Serial Number...but if you think it's unlikely check this out...https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=122362

About the ethical fact...What else am I supposed to do with a kindle that has been PAID for (by me) but stolen by someone else????

Or you could just file a claim with Ebay. They'll make it good unless the auction stated that the Kindle was blacklisted or stolen at your time of purchase.

I've had eBay refund my money on an auction where the screw was stripped and the seller wouldn't refund my money.

They'll have you ship the item back, get confirmation and they'll refund your purchase and take it out of the hide of the seller.

Screwing the poor sucker that had their Kindle stolen is totally unnecessary.