The Technology Vent and Rant Thread

[poohbear_nc]

I'm really not a real Chrome user - but working from home now - and my workplace uses MS Teams to link with me - and I needed Chrome for video chats - so started using Chrome in March without noticing anything weird - then it seemed the more I used it, the slower the response time and the buffering of the typing began.
And yes, I've cleared my cache, etc.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Hunh. Soooo, it's NOT me. Interesting.

Chrome auto-updates in the background by default, so you may not be aware the version has changed. Here, a version check returns
Version 83.0.4103.61 (Official Build) (64-bit)

There have been several updates in the past couple of weeks. Most are security fixes and a quick scan reveals no obvious culprits.

Alt-Shift-I in Chrome brings up the Feedback box you can use to send problem reports to Google. I suspect a lot of folks reported this.

(I use Firefox, and haven't seen this issue. It has a different set of quirks.)
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Dennis

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

Chrome auto-updates in the background by default, so you may not be aware the version has changed. Here, a version check returns
Version 83.0.4103.61 (Official Build) (64-bit)

There have been several updates in the past couple of weeks. Most are security fixes and a quick scan reveals no obvious culprits.

Alt-Shift-I in Chrome brings up the Feedback box you can use to send problem reports to Google. I suspect a lot of folks reported this.

(I use Firefox, and haven't seen this issue. It has a different set of quirks.)
______
Dennis

Ha.

83.0.4103.61 (Official Build) (64-bit)

Looks familiar. I shall go forthwith and kvetch. I hate using Chromium Edge without my damn extensions. It just messes with my Tao.

Hitch

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Ha.

83.0.4103.61 (Official Build) (64-bit)

Looks familiar. I shall go forthwith and kvetch. I hate using Chromium Edge without my damn extensions. It just messes with my Tao.

If you are using Microsoft's Chromium based build of Edge, I believe it ought to run your preferred Chrome extensions. It's based on the underlying Blink rendering engine and V8 JavaScript engine.

Even before MS pivoted on Edge development and dropped the in house Spartan rendering engine they developed to replace their previous Trident engine, replacing it with Chromium, browser development was increasingly toward a common framework for extensions. Extensions would be pure JavaScript, built on a common API, so it would be possible for developers to create extensions that could be installed in any current browser with minor code changes. (As an example, the extraordinarily popular uBlock Origin blocker add on for Firefox was also available for Chrome and original Edge.

Go the the Chrome store and see if stuff will install in Chromium Edge. I don't expect a fix for your Chrome problems to happen right away, and Chromium based Edge might be what you can use till you get a fix for whatever is giving Chrome indigestion.
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Dennis

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

If you are using Microsoft's Chromium based build of Edge, I believe it ought to run your preferred Chrome extensions. It's based on the underlying Blink rendering engine and V8 JavaScript engine.

Even before MS pivoted on Edge development and dropped the in house Spartan rendering engine they developed to replace their previous Trident engine, replacing it with Chromium, browser development was increasingly toward a common framework for extensions. Extensions would be pure JavaScript, built on a common API, so it would be possible for developers to create extensions that could be installed in any current browser with minor code changes. (As an example, the extraordinarily popular uBlock Origin blocker add on for Firefox was also available for Chrome and original Edge.

Go the the Chrome store and see if stuff will install in Chromium Edge. I don't expect a fix for your Chrome problems to happen right away, and Chromium based Edge might be what you can use till you get a fix for whatever is giving Chrome indigestion.
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Dennis

Bless you, Dennis. Truly.

My penchant for troubleshooting this type of stuff has faded and paled, as I've lost most of my so-called "spare time." Warning, mostly-unrelated rant follows in the Spoiler, feel free to ignore, I'm venting:

Spoiler:

I had something like this, around not having time, happen...not exactly, but, with PhraseExpress. As it turns out, even though it will do EVERYTHING that I want it to do, you have to bloody program it, in a way that PEX understands. it's one of those applications that's "well, yes, it will do that! [IF you already know how, and there's s**t for documentation on it].

The other users seem to think it's funny, that I don't know how to program the damned thing. You know, "all good lads together" and all that. One forum poster said to me, "programming's not for sissies" and so help me GOD, he should be glad he wasn't within striking distance of me when he said it. Quite literally, and yes, I know, this isn't PC, I would have punched him right in the mouth. Jackass. The entire documentation, on the functionality I was seeking, was two lines long, basically saying "yes this exists."

It's sold as a bloody app for BUSINESSES and I don't see a goddamned thing funny about it. I don't have time to spend 10-20 hours learning their macro/programming language to make it behave. Infuriating. And their attitude, that I should already know how to do it? Well, crap, then why not say on the website that if you can't already program it, don't buy it? I mean, you guys know me; I'd love to get into it, figure it out; but I don't have that kind of time these days and more importantly, that isn't hinted at ANYWHERE pre-sale.

So, even thinking about spending the hours needed, to troubleshoot Chrome...oy. I can't even, as the kids say.

I shall sally forth and see if I can make Chromium Edge my...well, you know, slave. I do, truly, appreciate it.


Hitch

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Bless you, Dennis. Truly.

My penchant for troubleshooting this type of stuff has faded and paled, as I've lost most of my so-called "spare time." Warning, mostly-unrelated rant follows in the Spoiler, feel free to ignore, I'm venting:

<vent elided> But there does seems to be documentation:

Spoiler:

https://www.phraseexpress.com/docs/14/

If that's what you saw and it didn't address your question, sorry.

A quick scan makes this look like a corporate product that will be programmed by IT support staffers and rolled out to users who need the functionality. It does not look like the sort of thing most end users will want to wrestle with.

So, even thinking about spending the hours needed, to troubleshoot Chrome...oy. I can't even, as the kids say.

I shall sally forth and see if I can make Chromium Edge my...well, you know, slave. I do, truly, appreciate it.

If it assists you and saves you some trouble, I'm happy. It's why I participate in forums like this.

And on a different line, I noted BetterRed talking about different profiles. I've been doing that for ages in Firefox, which makes it easy. Want to generate a new profile? Run Firefox in Profile Manager mode, with firefox -p. Profile Manager will let you create a new profile, give it a name, and specify where it is kept.

I have a top level C:\Mozilla directory. Profiles live in C:\Mozilla]\Firefox\Profiles, with sub-directories with the name I gave the profile when I created it. I can run Firefox using a specified profile with firefox -p <profile name> For that matter, I can have more than one FF instance active at once, as long as each uses a different profile. firefox -no-remote -p <profile name> does it.

I want the same bookmarks and history available in all created profiles, which is easy enough but requires hacking done at the OS level, outside of FF. (Technically, I have a master copy, and I symlink that into the profile directories I create, replacing the default places.sqlite file that Firefox uses to hold bookmarks/history. All FF profiles are using th4e same FF bookmarks/history file. But SQLite does atomic commits, so stepping on each other's toes is unlikely even with more than one profile active. Only one will actually be updating the file at any time.)

The main differences between profiles are precisely what extensions are installed.

I haven't played with doing that in Chrome, but it sounds like a profile specifically for browsing and another for eBook creation activities might be a good idea.
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Dennis

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

<vent elided> But there does seems to be documentation:

Spoiler:

https://www.phraseexpress.com/docs/14/

If that's what you saw and it didn't address your question, sorry.

I've read that 3x, front-to-back. Every bloody page. AND watched every available video, too. C'mon, Dennis, you know me. What I meant was, about this one particular function, that I need, there are two lines of text, saying "yes this exists." That's about it, I kid thee not.

Spoiler:

FWIW, I'm trying to make the If/Then/Else work.

A quick scan makes this look like a corporate product that will be programmed by IT support staffers and rolled out to users who need the functionality. It does not look like the sort of thing most end users will want to wrestle with.

See? I absolutely don't get that from their website, at all. And no, I didn't read ALL their Help/FAQ documentation, before I bought, but I did read about half of the DOCS pages to which you linked. I just...it seemed pretty simple, if you're left-brained and have a background in DBMS or the usual. It never occurred to me that I needed actual PROGRAMMING. I mean, the fundamentals are pretty "click this, insert that."

If it assists you and saves you some trouble, I'm happy. It's why I participate in forums like this.

And on a different line, I noted BetterRed talking about different profiles. I've been doing that for ages in Firefox, which makes it easy. Want to generate a new profile? Run Firefox in Profile Manager mode, with firefox -p. Profile Manager will let you create a new profile, give it a name, and specify where it is kept.

I have a top level C:\Mozilla directory. Profiles live in C:\Mozilla]\Firefox\Profiles, with sub-directories with the name I gave the profile when I created it. I can run Firefox using a specified profile with firefox -p <profile name> For that matter, I can have more than one FF instance active at once, as long as each uses a different profile. firefox -no-remote -p <profile name> does it.

I want the same bookmarks and history available in all created profiles, which is easy enough but requires hacking done at the OS level, outside of FF. (Technically, I have a master copy, and I symlink that into the profile directories I create, replacing the default places.sqlite file that Firefox uses to hold bookmarks/history. All FF profiles are using th4e same FF bookmarks/history file. But SQLite does atomic commits, so stepping on each other's toes is unlikely even with more than one profile active. Only one will actually be updating the file at any time.)

The main differences between profiles are precisely what extensions are installed.

I haven't played with doing that in Chrome, but it sounds like a profile specifically for browsing and another for eBook creation activities might be a good idea.
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Dennis

I have not, previously, set up profiles in Chrome. I admit it, I just..I get burned out managing all my entities/avatars,etc. For logins and all that; sadly, because I'm pathetic, I don't really have any 'secret identities' on the Net. I find that posting under your own name--or close enough so that your real identify isn't hidden--helps keep me honest and from descending into that cavalier and easy cruelty that pervades online living.

So, yes, I digress some more. I will set up some Chrome profiles and do some testing.For the nonce, I'm using Chromium Edge; some of the extensions do work so that's helpful.

Thanks, guys.

Hitch

[BetterRed]

Done

BR

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

Attachment 179610

Attachment 179609

Done

BR

Mah hero! :-)

Hitch

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Hitch

See? I absolutely don't get that from their website, at all. And no, I didn't read ALL their Help/FAQ documentation, before I bought, but I did read about half of the DOCS pages to which you linked. I just...it seemed pretty simple, if you're left-brained and have a background in DBMS or the usual. It never occurred to me that I needed actual PROGRAMMING. I mean, the fundamentals are pretty "click this, insert that."

It's possible that I got it because of decades doing things like support in corporate environments.

A look at what they offered triggered my "Oh, my. This is powerful but complex. If I were deploying it to users I might wish to provide pre-configured instances covering the basics that could be further customized if needed." reflex.

The issue is that some problems are inherently complicated, and don't have simple solutions. One example might be uses for the ubiquitous Excel spreadsheet program. Serious financial people do a lot of programming in Excel, because it can rice, slice, and dice the numbers any way you like...once you understand how to program it to do that. Gaining that understanding is a long term process.

When you find yourself dealing with if, then, else cases, you have gone past drag and drop and point and click. (And the problems are in what you pass to IF as the condition to be met, what you pass to THEN as the action to take if the condition is met, and what you pass to ELSE if it isn't.) You are attempting to massage data, and if you don't have a clear idea of how it is currently structured, good luck on restructuring.

(I recall a story about a legendary programmer in the early days. He was given an assignment, and for a while, people looking in his office would see him drawing diagrams on sheets of paper. Those diagrams were documenting transitions in state, and the various transitions that might be made and the state things would be in before and after. Once he felt he had a clear idea of the state of the data and how it might be transformed, he wrote the program on paper, then typed it into a terminal and tried to run it. He had to make one change which was correcting a typo when he entered the program on the terminal. After that, it just worked, because he started with the data, clearly understood how it would be structured coming in, and what transitions needed to be made to produce the desired form coming out.)

And my spider sense tingled when I saw that they were also incorporating a macro processor. I consider that a separate area, and would be inclined to deploy it as a separate program. Adding it onto an existing program just multiplies possible support headaches.

I may be starting at shadows here based on bad experiences in the past and it may not be the problem source I might anticipate. I hope not, at least.
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Dennis

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

It's possible that I got it because of decades doing things like support in corporate environments.

A look at what they offered triggered my "Oh, my. This is powerful but complex. If I were deploying it to users I might wish to provide pre-configured instances covering the basics that could be further customized if needed." reflex.

The issue is that some problems are inherently complicated, and don't have simple solutions. One example might be uses for the ubiquitous Excel spreadsheet program. Serious financial people do a lot of programming in Excel, because it can rice, slice, and dice the numbers any way you like...once you understand how to program it to do that. Gaining that understanding is a long term process.

When you find yourself dealing with if, then, else cases, you have gone past drag and drop and point and click. (And the problems are in what you pass to IF as the condition to be met, what you pass to THEN as the action to take if the condition is met, and what you pass to ELSE if it isn't.) You are attempting to massage data, and if you don't have a clear idea of how it is currently structured, good luck on restructuring.

(I recall a story about a legendary programmer in the early days. He was given an assignment, and for a while, people looking in his office would see him drawing diagrams on sheets of paper. Those diagrams were documenting transitions in state, and the various transitions that might be made and the state things would be in before and after. Once he felt he had a clear idea of the state of the data and how it might be transformed, he wrote the program on paper, then typed it into a terminal and tried to run it. He had to make one change which was correcting a typo when he entered the program on the terminal. After that, it just worked, because he started with the data, clearly understood how it would be structured coming in, and what transitions needed to be made to produce the desired form coming out.)

And my spider sense tingled when I saw that they were also incorporating a macro processor. I consider that a separate area, and would be inclined to deploy it as a separate program. Adding it onto an existing program just multiplies possible support headaches.

I may be starting at shadows here based on bad experiences in the past and it may not be the problem source I might anticipate. I hope not, at least.
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Dennis

No, no, I agree with you--and all powerful programs/apps/whatever have steep learning curves, agreed. It reminds me of the old EZPublish days, when EZP was the only CMS around that actually could do everything--a home page, articles/blogs, forums, eCommerce, etc.--but, if you didn't already know how to make it sit up and bark, well, you were hosed.

Their forums also had that whole "all clever lads together" thing going on. If someone would ask, "can you do X," their reply would be YES. (Assuming you CAN make it do X). The forum members had that same smug attitude.

And it's not like there are PEX experts sitting around waiting to be hired, either. So, I find myself with a program that I don't have time to learn, without a staff that can make it work, and nobody to hire--and I don't even have a clue where I'd start to learn, either. Yes, I know that If/Then/Else has its ins and outs and all that...but it's JUST bloody logic. That part, I can do. But in viewing the I-T-E interface...there's not an indicator in hell that will tell you what the bloody hell goes in the THEN place or spot or action. A macro? Programming code? A magic Badger that directs traffic? Seriously, it's like it's a secret.

Anyway, enough bitching. I'll just find something else, but yes, I'm bloody annoyed about it. Sure, it's powerful. I get that. Sure, it's not meant for Word button pushers. Get that too. But their whole attitude, that "oh, tough cookies if you were stupid enough to pay us for it when you didn't already know how to use it," really pisses me off.

Hitch

[Xenophon]

This reminds me of nothing more than the "joys" of working with Splunk. They have a query language with a big fat manual and a ton of online documentation. What they lack is a query language that is internally consistent, has an actual proper definition with a grammar, etc. In some functions, arguments that involve fields whose name includes a '.' (one character dot/period/full-stop) must be quoted with single quotes. In other functions, those same arguments must be quoted with double quotes. In yet other functions, those exact same arguments must be left without any quotes.

Getting any of those cases wrong doesn't yield an error message either! Instead, it gives you wrong output, where "wrong" ranges between incomplete, empty, and just-plain-crazy. When you go read the manual for the various functions, they don't bother mentioning any of this. [Of course, this is only one minor example out of a giant ant-farm of similar bug-inducing inconsistencies!]

I have the "honor" to work with the largest single Splunk cluster known to exist (there may be other larger ones that are in gov't black programs or are unmentionable for some unknown reason). So we twisted the tech rep's arms really hard, and finally found out why things are so inconsistent. It seems that different functions and areas of functionality were implemented at different times, by different teams, with hand-written parsers and absolutely no standards whatsoever. There's no grammar available for their query language because they can't actually tell what it is without reading and reverse-engineering all the parsing code! And, of course, now that they have a bazillion customers they can't change any of that either, because they'd be certain to break some important customers' stuff.

[DiapDealer]

Why can I mark all notifications as read on Facebook* desktop, but not Facebook* mobile?

*

Spoiler:

Save the commentary. I'm not interested in if, or why, you don't use Facebook and/or social media in general.

[badgoodDeb]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Why can I mark all notifications as read on Facebook* desktop, but not Facebook* mobile?

*

Spoiler:

Save the commentary. I'm not interested in if, or why, you don't use Facebook and/or social media in general.

I've noticed this too. I just wait till I reach my desktop. I wonder if using a browser on my ipad type device would give a different result, rather than the app.

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by badgoodDeb

I've noticed this too. I just wait till I reach my desktop. I wonder if using a browser on my ipad type device would give a different result, rather than the app.

It appears the Chrome browser on my Android phone will allow me to "Mark All As Read," but ... ewww! Using a browser on a phone feels like fail. A tablet?... sure.

Why would they leave such a feature out of the mobile app? What do they gain (because it has to be a design decision and not an accident)?