New Kindle Voyage

[evanft]

Originally Posted by seanwhat

Or they could charge an extra $80 for a higher end kindle model which, among other premium features, includes extra font sets.

This is 2014 and they can't sort out simple software features like margins, fonts, hyphenation etc. even on their 'premium' model? Why? It's not like the software is in it's infancy, they're clearly aware of these issues, they're just choosing not to bother.

They're just... behind. Like a lot of people, I was hoping they'd have ironed these things in the new models, but instead they've been working on other software features which, although very good, aren't the simple things people were asking for.

This actually summarizes how I'm starting to feel about this device. These things aren't just hardware. They're hardware, software, and ecosystem. Amazon has, in my opinion, absolutely nailed 2 of those 3. To come up short in some ways on the third just feels wrong.

Originally Posted by Prestidigitweeze

I didn't find what Harry said to be pedantic. I did suspect, however, that evanft felt he'd already implied Harry's point -- that deeper margin controls were important to him but not necessarily to everyone -- and that people who read evanft's post probably inferred as much.

Pretty much this exactly. Also, the rest of your post is spot-on.

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

And why exactly do we need to squeeze as much text on a page as possible? With current readers battery life or speed of a page turn should not be such an issue that it really matters.

Doesn't matter. Some people want more. Some people want less. Where's the harm in giving people the option?

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by GoSharks

On the other hand, what else is there to do with this thread until someone actually gets a Voyage in their hands?...

I have been thinking ....

Thinking about the seemingly high price of the Voyage. The extra price compared to the PW is actually not all that big. Okay, sure, it is $80, but there is ways to save a bit. When I bought the PW it cost $180 a piece (139 wifi no so and 40 for the cover). The Voyage is only $20 more for the SO version. Removing the SO makes sense only if you are using a cover with auto wakeup feature. The Amazon cover is quite heavy, and almost all pictures on Amazon shows people reading without the cover. The new origami cover makes it easy to remove the cover for reading sessions. Putting all this information together, I gave it a try on how the PW works when no cover is used at all. And here is what I came up with:

First thing I noticed right away is how slim and light the PW is once you liberate it from its shell. Then using it to read it becomes so much easier to hold - and I noticed how I naturally switch hands a lot more often than before. With the cover it was only really comfortable to hold with my right hand - without cover it is about the same left and right. Reading like this for about a week has been wonderful. Using the power button to turn the PW on is less hassle than having to flip the cover open. The one bad thing is the missing buttons - I can see now how useful the buttons/sensors can be when reading without cover.

Upgrade or not upgrade? It has been such a pleasure to read with the naked PW that the removal of the cover has already been an upgrade. I can understand now why Amazon shows most pictures of people reading without the cover. There is some food for thought: save $20 on the SO, save $40/$60 on the origami cover - and that knocks down the price to original PW cost.

I will probably wait until the Voyage is back in stock without weeklong waiting and then reconcider. Also should allow for some experiences and reviews to be availlable. Until then I will enjoy my upgraded PW1.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by badgoodDeb

HEY! Quit fighting!
I too like the Kindles the way they are. I can read faster if the text isn't wider than a paperback's text used to be. But I don't want to fight over it. It's all OPINIONS!

I'm not saying to take away the formatting options that mist people use. I'm saying to change the ones most people don't use to ones that a lot more people would use.

So if you like the line height for KF8 and the smallest margins the way that are right now, you would not lose a thing. But others who would like smaller margins and maybe a smaller line height would have these options as well.

Amazon has taken things too much in the opposite way and given options that hardly anybody will use when they could very easily change hem to options more people would use.

[GoSharks]

@DuckieTigger-
That was an extremely cogent and well written discussion that was entirely germane to the original topic of this thread....what the h#ll are you doing? Knock it off!!!!

[krazy4katz]

Well, nothing else to do right now so I might as well add to this discussion. Not likely I could do any more damage.

Frankly, I never changed the settings on my K3 except for the font size, but after all of this discussion of margins etc. I took a more careful look. The default margins are fine with me. The widest margin might be for people who are used to reading newspapers. I could see reading downloaded news that way and some people might like that. Speed readers are taught to look at the entire line at once. Not very relaxing for fiction, but maybe OK for news.

[JSWolf]

Please take a look at the Kobo Aura H2O in the middle of the picture (not trying to push the H2O, just using what's ont he screen as an example of what I am trying to say). Look at how the margins are and the line height. This is what I mean as looking good. This is something that Amazon could easily do via simple settings.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/att...5&d=1412385831

How many would like to have the Kindle with settings that give a look similar to the sample?

[Josieb1]

Another thing no one ever really compares is risk free buying. I have multiple Kindles and I've had lots of replacements over the years and I know I can buy a Kindle worry free from Amazon. If I don't like it out of the box it can be returned to Amazon, if I don't like the screen, the fonts, the margins, it doesn't matter it can go back.

Now Kobo's. That's a totally different risk here in the UK. I have no retailer I can buy from here that will accept a return for anything other than an obvious fault. If I don't like the colour of the screen, tough, live with it. Unless I can show a specific noticeable fault I have to keep it.

Yes I like my Kobo Aura, but I have pin pricks, tiny ones, I lived with them rather than risk a replacement (yes that was my option, no refund just a replacement) that might be worse. I'd love the H20 but I'm already seeing reports of dead pixels, yellow screens and flaky software. I can't buy a Kobo risk free, it's buyers pot luck over here. We only have three sellers. Kobo themselves, WHSmith (which is where I got my Aura) or Argos. I have no idea if Kobo have a returns policy if you don't like the device. WHSmith won't take it back and neither will Argos. Screens are very subjective, you can dislike a screen on a device but not actually have a fault.

At least with Amazon I know I can use the device for a few days, weeks even, and still send it back if I don't think it's worth the money. I can't do that with any other ereader on the market.

[Mivo]

I'm surprised the UK doesn't have the "return anything you buy online or long distance within 14 days if you don't like it, and the seller pays the return shipping" regulation that we have in Germany (I thought it was a EU-wide thing). I rarely make use of it, but it certainly removes the stress from buying hardware/etc online. It also makes sellers more accommodating.

[Canuck_in_Japan]

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

I have been thinking ....

Thinking about the seemingly high price of the Voyage. The extra price compared to the PW is actually not all that big. Okay, sure, it is $80, but there is ways to save a bit. When I bought the PW it cost $180 a piece (139 wifi no so and 40 for the cover). The Voyage is only $20 more for the SO version. Removing the SO makes sense only if you are using a cover with auto wakeup feature. The Amazon cover is quite heavy, and almost all pictures on Amazon shows people reading without the cover. The new origami cover makes it easy to remove the cover for reading sessions. Putting all this information together, I gave it a try on how the PW works when no cover is used at all. And here is what I came up with:

First thing I noticed right away is how slim and light the PW is once you liberate it from its shell. Then using it to read it becomes so much easier to hold - and I noticed how I naturally switch hands a lot more often than before. With the cover it was only really comfortable to hold with my right hand - without cover it is about the same left and right. Reading like this for about a week has been wonderful. Using the power button to turn the PW on is less hassle than having to flip the cover open. The one bad thing is the missing buttons - I can see now how useful the buttons/sensors can be when reading without cover.

Upgrade or not upgrade? It has been such a pleasure to read with the naked PW that the removal of the cover has already been an upgrade. I can understand now why Amazon shows most pictures of people reading without the cover. There is some food for thought: save $20 on the SO, save $40/$60 on the origami cover - and that knocks down the price to original PW cost.

I will probably wait until the Voyage is back in stock without weeklong waiting and then reconcider. Also should allow for some experiences and reviews to be availlable. Until then I will enjoy my upgraded PW1.

I'm all for eReaders without covers! I've been proselytizing about that on here for a long time now. Why have an ultralight device and then practically increase the weight and bulk by 50% by adding a cover? I think a good compromise is to buy a sleeve for it works when you're not reading. Because, do you really need a cover when you're holding it in your hands? So while I agree with you 100%, it seems to me that you are using a bit of fuzzy math to equate the price of the original PW and Voyage. I think it is quite clearly $80 more than the original PW no matter how you rationalize it.

[Josieb1]

Originally Posted by Mivo

I'm surprised the UK doesn't have the "return anything you buy online or long distance within 14 days if you don't like it, and the seller pays the return shipping" regulation that we have in Germany (I thought it was a EU-wide thing). I rarely make use of it, but it certainly removes the stress from buying hardware/etc online. It also makes sellers more accommodating.

We probably do but that only applies if you don't use the item and it can be resold, and has been returned it the same condition it arrives. I was told by Argos that if the H20 showed any sign of being taken out of the box then it couldn't be returned.

It's something to do with it being an electronic item. Tbh I'm not prepared to risk it. One Kobo I took a chance on, two, that's gambling too much.

Ohh and seller never pays return postage, the buyer does.

[Mivo]

Originally Posted by Josieb1

We probably do but that only applies if you don't use the item and it can be resold, and has been returned it the same condition it arrives. I was told by Argos that if the H20 showed any sign of being taken out of the box then it couldn't be returned.

That's indeed limiting and pretty much useless, no doubt. The only condition here is that the item shows only signs of expected, normal (2-week) use, so taking something out of the box and using it a little is fine. The return shipping is paid by the seller if the value of the item exceeds €30, and the seller has to arrange the pick-up if requested. It's exceptionally consumer-friendly. I only really made use of it once, because I almost sympathize with the sellers (and I don't order stuff just to sample it). But yes, it's a good thing.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

I turned against hacking. When I did, all it would do is rob my time. Time I now rather spend enjoying my Kindles to read. And for me it turned out that the less I fiddled with my Kindle, the more I could just simply read. If I want to upgrade to the Voyage, then I don't have to worry about waiting for a hack. Out of the box it would work good enough.

I guess my issue was moving from my Nook Simple Touch (my first eReader) and going to my Kindle ... finding that the margins were wider on the Kindle was distracting to me. Maybe if I had started with a Kindle -- and only used Kindles -- I may not have noticed it, but it bothered me quite a bit and made concentrating on reading more difficult. I'm much happier with my K4 now that I've narrowed the margins with the non-root hack. It gives me a more uniform "reading experience" when I change from one device to the other.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by GoSharks

On the other hand, what else is there to do with this thread until someone actually gets a Voyage in their hands?...

Exactly.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Amazon has taken things too much in the opposite way and given options that hardly anybody will use when they could very easily change hem to options more people would use.

You said it much better than I was attempting to say it.

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

How many would like to have the Kindle with settings that give a look similar to the sample?

I like it. Now I definitely want to track down a cheap Kobo Touch.