Using Kindle WI-FI could get YOU Arrested!

[trekchick]

Originally Posted by brewjono

I was of the opinion that you could change it to just 3G.

I watched a Podcast today and the guy did a comparision of the K2 and K3 in 3G for web surfing. He made of point of showing that he had put the k3 in 3G mode so that the comparision would be fair. He didn't show how he did that though.<snip>

Unfortunately, switching between WiFi and 3G is _not_ user configurable. If the WiFi access point is secured, you can simply not enter the key or tell your Kindle to "forget" it and it won't connect. That's how he forced it to use 3G for the podcast.

But, Kindle will connect to open or remembered WiFi networks automatically, and if there's a WiFi network available, Kindle won't connect to 3G.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by trekchick

But, Kindle will connect to open or remembered WiFi networks automatically, and if there's a WiFi network available, Kindle won't connect to 3G.

I'm sorry to disagree, but the Kindle will not connect to an open WiFi network automatically, unless you specifically tell it to do so. Once you've connected to a particular network, then the Kindle will reconnect to it automatically, but it will never, ever, connect to a new network all on its own without you telling it to do so.

[trekchick]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Do you know of any device that will automatically connect to an unknown WiFi connection without asking first? I don't.

Doesn't the old adage "ignorance of the law is no excuse" apply here? If you break the law you break it; to the best of my knowledge, "willful intent" is not a requirement for prosecution or conviction.

Kindle does connect to open WiFi networks without asking. I had my Kindle 3 out at the pub, and the little WiFi icon switched on automatically and I settled a friendly wager with a quick wikipedia search. Only later did I wonder why it didn't verify that I wished to connect to a new network.

When I used my K3 at the library, I had to manually select the access point in settings. Even though the library access point is unencrypted, you still have to click the "Yes, I'll be good" button before using it, so Kindle didn't automatically join there.

[DiapDealer]

I'm fairly certain HarryT is correct regarding auto-magic connections to "new" unprotected WiFi networks.

However, with respect to current UK law, I would think it would be in Amazon's best interest to make "forgetting" a wireless network a user-configurable option--if it's not already. Accidents and tom-foolery do happen after all.

[oggelbe2007]

Originally Posted by HarryT

That's rather like arguing that it's OK to watch TV without a licence merely because the signals are passing through your house . I wish you luck in presenting that argument to a judge...

Around here the airwaves are free. In other words, it is legal to capture anything broadcast. Yes, anything. This is how radar detector cases are fought in states that attempt to outlaw such devices. It is a radio receiver, the speed device emits radio waves, and the receiver picks up the waves. Federal law allows this to happen. Why do you think we can listen to police radio? It is incumbent upon the broadcaster to encrypt his broadcasts. I'm tired of protecting the stupid, ignorant, and/or lazy with nusence laws. Why would you want (or need) a bunch of airwave nazis running around. And these "it would be like" analogies are downright moronic, it is especially NOT like burglarizing someone's house. I shouldn't even have to explain how ridiculous THAT comparison is. Lastly why do we really care. People who feel violated by this probably feel violated by most things.Yes,If you park in front of my house to get my wifi that would be creepy, but it would be strange regardless of the circumstances,stopping there to make a phone call,read a map whatever...

[koland]

Originally Posted by HarryT

In this particular case, though, I really don't think the law is an ass. Using someone's computer resources without their permission is wrong, regardless of whether or not they have secured them. You don't have the right to go and sit in someone's living room and watch their TV if they go out and leave their house door unlocked. Using their WiFi network is really not much different.

But, if they leave a TV playing out on the lawn, I feel free to sit there, on my side of the grass, and watch it to my heart's content.

When they move it inside and close the window, that's another matter, entirely, of course.

[sirmaru]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Forgive me, but I don't believe you are correct. Please do correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty certain that it's illegal in the US to decrypt satellite TV without paying for it. The "if the signals are on my property, I can do whatever I want with them" argument has no legal validity.

It is illegal to decrypt cable broadcasts in the US. Large, public ISP's as well require memberships in their ISP's with ID's and passwords on the Kindle even though they are technically unlocked.

For example, I went to an auto dealership yesterday and they had two large, national WiFi links at their site which were UNLOCKED. I tried to access them but I could not enter since I lacked the proper cookies on my Kindle WiFi 3.

For my own ISP, ATT, they have even informed me that their "public" hotspots all over the nation REQUIRE me to accesss my home page, enter my ID and password and, only then, would they download an entry cookie to my laptop or K3. Otherwise, I cannot enter their hotspots either.

When ATT installed a Residential Gateway in my house, it comes with a home network REQUIRING a 10 digit unlock key. They do not allow non-key networks for their customers.

Breaking any of these protections is a CRIME in the USA.

If one gives away, returns or sells the K3, one must first delete all cookies on the K3 and cancel all network keys to prevent others from having this access aside from deregistering it from Amazon.

[koland]

Originally Posted by trekchick

Kindle does connect to open WiFi networks without asking. I had my Kindle 3 out at the pub, and the little WiFi icon switched on automatically and I settled a friendly wager with a quick wikipedia search. Only later did I wonder why it didn't verify that I wished to connect to a new network.

Most likely that was an AT&T hotspot - it does log into those automatically, as disclosed in the terms of service.

I've had to log it in manually (one time) to other free networks set up at coffee shops and others.

[koland]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

However, with respect to current UK law, I would think it would be in Amazon's best interest to make "forgetting" a wireless network a user-configurable option--if it's not already. Accidents and tom-foolery do happen after all.

Home, Settings, click next to wi-fi networks. Find connected network and click to Forget.

[sirmaru]

Originally Posted by koland

Most likely that was an AT&T hotspot - it does log into those automatically, as disclosed in the terms of service.

ATT logins to their WiFi spots are NOT automatic unless you PAY.

Go here to see how to do that:

http://www.att.com/gen/general?pid=5949

However, for ATT Uverse customers it is free but one must log in to get the downloaded cookie first. This is how it works:

"Customers with AT&T High Speed Internet, AT&T U-verse High Speed Internet, or AT&T FastAccess® DSL—all speed plans included. No ordering required! Simply use your primary AT&T high-speed Internet membership ID and password at any AT&T Wi-Fi Basic Hot Spot. Learn more at http://www.att.com/gen/general?pid=6431"

If you do not have an account with them, you must pay $ 4.00 for the one shot access with your credit card.

[trekchick]

Originally Posted by koland

Most likely that was an AT&T hotspot - it does log into those automatically, as disclosed in the terms of service.

I've had to log it in manually (one time) to other free networks set up at coffee shops and others.

Ahhh... That just might be the case. I was starting to doubt my recollection, but I was sure I hadn't imbibed enough to misremember.

[karthwyne]

Originally Posted by sirmaru

For my own ISP, ATT, they have even informed me that their "public" hotspots all over the nation REQUIRE me to accesss my home page, enter my ID and password and, only then, would they download an entry cookie to my laptop or K3. Otherwise, I cannot enter their hotspots either.

When ATT installed a Residential Gateway in my house, it comes with a home network REQUIRING a 10 digit unlock key. They do not allow non-key networks for their customers.

Breaking any of these protections is a CRIME in the USA.

If one gives away, returns or sells the K3, one must first delete all cookies on the K3 and cancel all network keys to prevent others from having this access aside from deregistering it from Amazon.

You do not understand AT&T's authentication scheme at all. The wifi hotspots are NOT public, they are for paying customers of that service (or a service that includes them) and are being migrated to being more open for just the patrons of the location even if the user is not an AT&T customer. They are using methods to weed out freeloaders and provide the service solely to those that are authorized by the terms they have made.

With AT&T DSL or U-Verse HSIA, the wireless gateways come with wireless enabled and encryption. I CAN however, disable either of those if I choose. Very easily in fact. It by no means is a requirement.
AT&T authenticates users onto their network (different methods for different technologies), but this happens between the gateway and the radius, not the wireless login.

[trekchick]

Originally Posted by sirmaru

ATT logins to their WiFi spots are NOT automatic unless you PAY.<snip>

Karen is right. Kindle Help page states: "Free Access at AT&T Hotspots
Enjoy free Wi-Fi access at AT&T hotspots across the U.S. for shopping and downloading Kindle content--no AT&T registration, sign-in, or password required."

That must include Wikipedia, too.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/custom...540&#setupwifi

[pchrist7]

Originally Posted by koland

Home, Settings, click next to wi-fi networks. Find connected network and click to Forget.

You just said it !
So simple, but it bit hidden, until you try it.

First, intentionally using someone's WiFi without permission is like breaking into their home without permission. Yes the person should have secured their WiFi or locked their doors, but if they don't that is not an open invitation to phish or rob. In both cases it is illegal entry.

Second, and more important, this is another case of a post that was ill thought out or designed to grab attention and is NOT really Kindle-centric.