Why are people unwilling to vote with their wallets?

[Sirtel]

Uploading a copyrighted book to a cloud storage is the only way I can have a usable offsite backup copy. So yeah, of course I do it.

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Without DRM removal and backups you don't really have what you paid for.

Except that I really DID get what I paid for.

I don't buy books until I'm ready to read them, so DRM is a non-factor in that regard. When I do buy them, I happily read them immediately with the app of where I bought them from on an Android tablet (or listen to it with a phone). I don't re-read, so there's no need for backups (or for storage until I get around to reading them). The price I pay for what I read/listen to is one that I find more than satisfactory for the one-time experience. Way cheaper than the price of a good meal for a much longer period of enjoyment. So I got exactly what I wanted, for exactly what I paid. I win.

The fact that "buying a book" used to mean something else to others in the past is of no consequence in my valuation of what I'm paying for today.

[haertig]

Most of the books I read I bought years ago. I tend to read a book or two at the start of a series, and if I like them, I buy the rest of the series, or at least a few books to move along in the series. I have several partially read series that I go back and forth between, usually switching between series every book or two so I don't get tired of any one series too quickly.

So it's important to me to be able to remove DRM. Because by the time I get around to reading a purchased book, years could have elapsed and my eReader may have bitten the dust and been replaced. I may need to convert the books to a different format because of that. Which means DRM must not be present. So first thing after a book purchase, I strip the DRM and convert and save the book in the two major formats that I use - EPUB and AZW3. I know it is redundant to store them in both formats, but I do that anyway. Disk space is cheap, and eBooks are very small.

[nana77]

Originally Posted by Terisa de morgan

The main cost is not the translator, but purchasing the rights to publish the book in that language.

Originally Posted by Quoth

Absolutely. Same with having a human narration. You can't sell or give it* away without paying royalties, which may include up-front costs.

[* Translation, narrated or fully illustrated graphic novel using abridged text. Human or computer generated makes no difference]

Thanks, last question, promised; just I don't like to not finish a discourse.
My thought was if it wouldn't be nice if (relating to the thread) a site (oficial, something that users sees and has some reputation - and won't count AI votes, off course), can keep a count of requests for a translation. That's all.
Maybe in some years it may reach a point where a publisher, that knows its rights values it, and easily may choose some, maybe it can keep requests for translators, too; and maybe it can keep a count of books that users - again - would like to have on a digital copy, while there are none at the moment... This latter one might give some monies to someone, that - imho - perhalps it doesn't even needs to be too skilled, but has the time to do the job.
Finished; apologizes if it was to silly.
Ps: In the worsest it may look as a feature as having readers that might think them listened. (Sorry , pun not intended).

[Quoth]

The current publisher might not have rights for the target language market. You'd have to target publishers in that language market with a petition. Then it might be up to the author.

The publishing system is a bit broken.

Even the world English language market is artificially broken into regions where some publishers have secretly agreed not to compete. Common between some big USA and UK publishers.

See also region coding on DVDs, BD and games, where even when a publisher has world wide rights they want to chop up the markets to better exploit them. That is evil.

[nana77]

Originally Posted by Quoth

The current publisher might not have rights for the target language market. You'd have to target publishers in that language market with a petition. Then it might be up to the author.

The publishing system is a bit broken.

Even the world English language market is artificially broken into regions where some publishers have secretly agreed not to compete. Common between some big USA and UK publishers.

See also region coding on DVDs, BD and games, where even when a publisher has world wide rights they want to chop up the markets to better exploit them. That is evil.

Tought: if a place (just as an example, like this: https://www.isfdb.org/) keeps a count, nobody has to go searching the publisher, is the opposite. An agent/publisher knows its job already, that's it - imho. Namely if it can afford it or not, etc.. no one would be called.

[Desertway]

I'm in the "meets my needs" group. With arthritis and nerve damage, the Kindle Oasis 3 is the perfect ereader for me, both ergonomics and weight (even my lighter Clara HD isn't as comfortable to hold). I spent a good decade using D&T, Calibre and the liberation tools. I got tired of it. Now I just want to buy or borrow, send wirelessly to device and read. That said, I also send all my books to my old K3 as a back up and a precaution.

[JBaby]

Originally Posted by Quoth

KU is a streaming service and buying the books supports the Indies far better. All KU ebooks can be bought and that benefits Amazon less than a KU sub.


https://www.theguardian.com/film/202...-prime-lawsuit

Though bought Kindle titles can't be directly downloaded to PC, they are still downloaded locally to the app or kindle, unlike "buying" streaming video content, which is deceptive marketing.

I will stop buying ebooks from Amazon if they can only be read while online.

The Licence (shown on USA on book page and not in EU) is deceptive. You do have the same reading rights for a bought ebook as bought paperback that is in copyright. It's just that the digital file nature rather than a physical artefact makes transfer more difficult. Breaking Amazon's claimed licence would require them to sue you for the losses. If Amazon doesn't have the copyright they likely can do nothing more than close your account, only the copyright holder (or assigned publisher) can sue for copyright violation. Again they have to prove losses.

SO:

1. Never upload a copyright ebook to the Internet (in theory Send to Kindle – other than for PD titles – violates copyright as Amazon Kindle files can't use it and Cloud storage does too as most will scan content for AI models).
   
2. Remove the DRM
   
3. Make Backups

Without DRM removal and backups you don't really have what you paid for. Copyright, DRM and the USA's malicious DMCA are three separate entities.

DRM is incompatible with Copyright, because usually it doesn't expire.
DMCA is a sop to USA Media corporations to allow control of consumers.

I get all of this. But KU is the only way to support these particular authors. My 2yr subscription was purchased prior to the ending of the D&T notice so I feel no need to cancel it. I will not buy books I can’t backup. And yes I know I can still back them up now. But I’m operating from a place that Amazon is going to close that loophole too. I’ve always backed up my books because Amazon screwed me damn near 20yrs ago when the Mobipocket DRM servers got shut off. That moment taught me about DRM and the need to backup books. I have all of my ebooks going back to 1999 when I bought my first ebook from Peanut Press for my Handspring Visor. The only books I don’t have are the 7 Mobipocket books.

I detest Send to Kindle. I only use it for reading articles and fanfic. I only sideload books and comics via USB. And those are things I don’t do often.

I was buying Kindle books long before I ever had a Kindle. I was buying them and converting them to ePub so I could read them on my iPhone and then later on iPad after it debuted. I didn’t get a Kindle until 2019. I specifically chose Amazon as my store because of D&T and how easy it was to bypass the DRM. In fact I got my first Kindle on a whim at a charity rummage sale so I could backup my books the easy way and not have to worry about the Kindle Desktop app updating.

Originally Posted by haertig

Most of the books I read I bought years ago. I tend to read a book or two at the start of a series, and if I like them, I buy the rest of the series, or at least a few books to move along in the series. I have several partially read series that I go back and forth between, usually switching between series every book or two so I don't get tired of any one series too quickly.

So it's important to me to be able to remove DRM. Because by the time I get around to reading a purchased book, years could have elapsed and my eReader may have bitten the dust and been replaced. I may need to convert the books to a different format because of that. Which means DRM must not be present. So first thing after a book purchase, I strip the DRM and convert and save the book in the two major formats that I use - EPUB and AZW3. I know it is redundant to store them in both formats, but I do that anyway. Disk space is cheap, and eBooks are very small.

I feel this. I only buy books on sale and sometimes I don’t get to them for years. This is especially true when I buy bundles.

[DrNefario]

Originally Posted by Quoth

KU is a streaming service and buying the books supports the Indies far better. All KU ebooks can be bought and that benefits Amazon less than a KU sub.

The current KU page rate is fairly generous, and for indies will often work out better than the royalties for buying a book.

If, like me, you tend to buy books when they go on sale, then the difference is even greater. The murky area is that when I buy a book, I don't need to actually read it for the author to benefit.

Also the KU payout is at Amazon's whim, so it's handing a lot of control to them.

As a reader, I find KU expensive, and I wonder if that's actually also part of the lock-in. If I'm on KU, I'm going to read KU books exclusively, or I'm not getting value for money. If it was cheaper it would be more disposable and I'd read outside its walled garden. If Netflix was 5 times more expensive, I sure wouldn't have other subscriptions running at the same time. (I mean, I wouldn't have Netflix very long or very often, but that's exactly where I am with KU.)

[JBaby]

Originally Posted by DrNefario

As a reader, I find KU expensive, and I wonder if that's actually also part of the lock-in. If I'm on KU, I'm going to read KU books exclusively, or I'm not getting value for money. If it was cheaper it would be more disposable and I'd read outside its walled garden. If Netflix was 5 times more expensive, I sure wouldn't have other subscriptions running at the same time. (I mean, I wouldn't have Netflix very long or very often, but that's exactly where I am with KU.)

Amazon really messed up by raising the price. Subscribing for two years used to be the best value. Now when you sign up for two years it’s only $10.99 a month instead of $11.99. I still read enough from KU to still make it valuable for me. And I’m in a better financial position so I can afford the hike. I don’t read KU books exclusively. I usually read them in between my library loans unless I’m binging a series.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by DrNefario

The current KU page rate is fairly generous, and for indies will often work out better than the royalties for buying a book.

Proof? Actual audited 3rd part stats? People keep writing this and it might only be true for a self-selecting minority.

Also it should be per loan, not page. Also Amazon should have to buy the content to list it, like our local library (which loans ebooks and pays royalty per loan on paper or ebooks, even if not read and is free to residents).

KU is only fair to Amazon. That's why it exists. Like Gym subs rather than pay as you go, Amazon benefits from subs disproportionately compared to sales, especially as KU boosts sales for Amazon of titles that are then exclusive.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by JBaby

I get all of this. But KU is the only way to support these particular authors.

No, ALL KU books are available for purchase on Amazon. That better supports authors (writers) than a sub and borrows. They get the full "royalty" even if you don't read the ebook, or even if you read it 5 years later.

[theducks]

Help Authors?
I guess KU is one way to introduce a new author / series to to the masses.
With print books, someone had to front a print run $$. With e-books, that take a TINY portion of a modern HD. (FWIW the majority of titles in my Library would fit on a 1.4M floppy. My Library is stored on a 2T HD that hardly notices it, The main drive is a SSD, for where I want performance)

But the flip side is with a purchase, the Author gets paid, even if I never get around to reading it (The dratted TBR pile )

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by theducks

FWIW the majority of titles in my Library would fit on a 1.4M floppy.

Do you mean after you have stripped the huge amazon mandated cover image and any embedded fonts?

As an example, the "All Systems Red" Murderbot EPUB is 3.1 MB with a 2.3 MB cover image and 0.4 MB embedded font.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by j.p.s

Do you mean after you have stripped the huge amazon mandated cover image and any embedded fonts?

As an example, the "All Systems Red" Murderbot EPUB is 3.1 MB with a 2.3 MB cover image and 0.4 MB embedded font.

Well, I don't strip large images or embedded fonts. I like them. Only the embedded font for main text gets stripped, if there is one.