Finding the perfect paragraph indentation size

[Argon]

Originally Posted by hobnail

Yeah, I was wondering if I'd had it backwards after I sent that. Regardless, to me I want the indentation to be consistent; whatever letter/text is above or below the indented text should stay in that place when the text is zoomed in our out.

Try making a simple web page with the lorem ipsum text and set the paragraph indentation at 5% and another page with the indentation at 1.5em. Name the files percent.html and em.html then they'll open in your web browser. If you normally have your browser maximized make it a regular window and resize its width. Watch how the indentation changes in the percent file while it stays the same with the em file. If you prefer that varying indentation then that's fine but you don't want to upload public domain books using percent based indentation here or wherever because it's nonstandard and few people like that.

Yes, exactly, but you still have em and % backwards.

[Argon]

Does anyone know why a book I bought with a stylesheet that says 5% is slightly less indented than an ebook I reformatted to have 5%? Shouldn't they be the exact same?

[hobnail]

Originally Posted by Argon

Does anyone know why a book I bought with a stylesheet that says 5% is slightly less indented than an ebook I reformatted to have 5%? Shouldn't they be the exact same?

Maybe the body has a margin, padding, or something? Or the paragraphs do? Use the inspector thing in the editor to look at the numbers for the boxes.

[jhowell]

Originally Posted by Argon

Does anyone know why a book I bought with a stylesheet that says 5% is slightly less indented than an ebook I reformatted to have 5%? Shouldn't they be the exact same?

When converting to KFX (Enhanced Typesetting) Amazon "fixes" text-indent expressed as a percentage. A value set by the publisher of 5% will be changed to 1.6em in KFX. That may be a factor in what you are seeing.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by hobnail

Maybe it was the w3c but I could swear it was Daisy.

https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/G169.html

Here are some others that I found:

https://a11y-101.com/design/text-alignment

http://mediaaccess.org.au/accessible...-in-documents/

https://webaim.org/techniques/textlayout/

None of these articles are of any use. They all fall short of telling the truth. All but one leaves out the discussion of hyphenation. Without that, these articles are a sham. The one that does mention hyphenation does so is a way that's like an afterthought and there is no example of full justify with hyphenation. So really, none of these articles are good at discussing left vs. full justification.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

No, I'm using yours. It helps, but kepub still doesn't look as good as ePub on Nook. Thing is, there are other positives about using kepub on Kobo, so I still use the format.

Forget the nook to read ePub. You can read ePub on your Kobo with the better typesetting. I mostly read ePub because it looks better. And as to being slow to turn the page, ePub is not too slow to turn the page.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Argon

Yes, exactly, but you still have em and % backwards.

Modify an ePub to use a text indent of 5%. Then view this ePub in Calibre viewer. Change the width of the window and watch the indents change.

[Argon]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Modify an ePub to use a text indent of 5%. Then view this ePub in Calibre viewer. Change the width of the window and watch the indents change.

No, that's what I want.

[Argon]

Originally Posted by jhowell

When converting to KFX (Enhanced Typesetting) Amazon "fixes" text-indent expressed as a percentage. A value set by the publisher of 5% will be changed to 1.6em in KFX. That may be a factor in what you are seeing.

So I might as well just find the em value I prefer and call it a day? Is that "fixing" reflected in the final stylesheet? The book I bought from Tor Publishing directly as a KFX in the Kindle Store (though downloaded as an AZW3 to open in Calibre) says 5% in Calibre's CSS editor without any changes made to it, and that's what I'm using as a reference standard. Is that 5% there not actually 5%, or is it the other book I modified myself and then converted to KFX?

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Modify an ePub to use a text indent of 5%. Then view this ePub in Calibre viewer. Change the width of the window and watch the indents change.

Okay, I've attached two sets of images. One from a em set paragraph indent and one from a % set paragraph indent. Notice how the % changes to match the viewport while the em set does not. I personally prefer the % and ragged right.

[JSWolf]

In the above samples, the % is too big and looks awful.

What I've done is found an em value I like and set indents to that.

[jhowell]

Originally Posted by Argon

Is that "fixing" reflected in the final stylesheet? The book I bought from Tor Publishing directly as a KFX in the Kindle Store (though downloaded as an AZW3 to open in Calibre) says 5%...

The fixing is only in KFX. A copy of the same book downloaded in KF8 (azw3) will have the publisher's original value.

Originally Posted by Argon

Is that 5% there not actually 5%, or is it the other book I modified myself and then converted to KFX?

If you take a book coded in EPUB with an indent of 5% and convert it to KFX it will instead use 1.6em in that format. You can see this if you convert from KFX back to EPUB by using the KFX Input plugin for calibre.

[Argon]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Okay, I've attached two sets of images. One from a em set paragraph indent and one from a % set paragraph indent. Notice how the % changes to match the viewport while the em set does not. I personally prefer the % and ragged right.

Oh, you know what, I actually, actually disagree with you and what I said earlier. I think the % indentation that you get with such a narrow window is way too small. Em is best, I was wrong.

Now, do I want 1.2 or 1.25 or 1.3?

[Argon]

Originally Posted by jhowell

The fixing is only in KFX. A copy of the same book downloaded in KF8 (azw3) will have the publisher's original value.



If you take a book coded in EPUB with an indent of 5% and convert it to KFX it will instead use 1.6em in that format. You can see this if you convert from KFX back to EPUB by using the KFX Input plugin for calibre.

Oh, wow, thank you so much! So what is the functional value for my book downloaded from the Kindle Store directly as KFX whose AZW3 style sheet reads 5%? On my Kindle, it's way less than 1.6.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Argon

Oh, you know what, I actually, actually disagree with you and what I said earlier. I think the % indentation that you get with such a narrow window is way too small. Em is best, I was wrong.

Now, do I want 1.2 or 1.25 or 1.3?

I think you should try them all and see what works best for you.