CC and the cloud: discussion

[kaufman]

Originally Posted by chaley

I think you mean Calibre Cloud.

Oops, that's it.

Originally Posted by chaley

The problem here is that by encouraging someone to use calibre cloud we are also encouraging them not to use CC. It is true that the searching capabilities of calibre cloud are minimal, but those along with the library capabilities of the reader could easily be enough for a lot of people.

I can't imagine any sane person preferring calibre cloud to calibre companion. It's a nice little app for the limited use case, but it certainly isn't going to change anyone's life like calibre companion has. And frankly, if there is someone who prefers it, then that just not a person I want to associate with.

Originally Posted by chaley

There is a second issue: CC would show up along side all of the reader apps such as Moon+ and the like, making it look like a reader. We already get a fair amount of static because CC doesn't contain a reader app, and this would make it worse.

That's a good point. That's reason enough not to do it. Never mind.

Originally Posted by chaley

This isn't true. A calibre user must take special steps to update the metadata in the book stored in the library (polish etc) and many people do not. For example, I don't.

That's interesting, because I run a plugin to clean up the epub every time I add a book or make changes. Partially it's so I know I will have correct metadata where ever I send the book, and partially it's my OCD. Don't you want your book reader to have the correct information?

Originally Posted by chaley

We don't mind writing the app if we get something for it. That is why the separate pay-for app is as attractive as it is.

Well, count me in for a copy when you release it, and sign me up to beta test it while you are working on it. Will it be a paid add-in for CC or a standalone app? IMO, built in is better except that "Contains IAP" scares people off sometimes.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by kaufman

That's interesting, because I run a plugin to clean up the epub every time I add a book or make changes. Partially it's so I know I will have correct metadata where ever I send the book, and partially it's my OCD. Don't you want your book reader to have the correct information?

My book reader always has the correct information -- because Send-to-device adds it in. Embed Metadata requires an extra step to do every time you update metadata in the GUI, and besides does not use plugboards (thus making it useless for me).

And send-to-device/save-to-disk already does it.

[kaufman]

Are you sure? Because I have seen the wrong cover in moon+Reader when I have forgotten to resend the epub

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by kaufman

Are you sure? Because I have seen the wrong cover in moon+Reader when I have forgotten to resend the epub

What do you mean? If you didn't resend it, isn't that exactly why send-to-device was unable to send the updated version with the updated cover?

[kaufman]

Sorry, I meant to say "... when I forgot to rebuild the epub with the new metadata"

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by kaufman

Sorry, I meant to say "... when I forgot to rebuild the epub with the new metadata"

The only thing I can think of is that the book did not have a valid cover. In such a case, neither Embed Metadata nor Send-to-device will update the cover -- but Polish Book, designed primarily to do non-invasive changes (contrasted to conversion which mulches the ebook internals) has a feature to update covers which does not actually update them. What it does is creates and defines a cover if there isn't one... and if there is, it falls back to updating it.

I assume, therefore, that you were using Polish book, not Embed metadata.


Keep in mind that fixing the cover is a one-time thing; once fixed, embed/send-to-device will locate the cover and update it.

What you did was fix a broken book.

[kaufman]

Actually, I dont use either. I use a plugin called (I think) "fix epub" which, among other things updates the embedded cover in the file. This happened a while ago, but I am pretty sure I continued to get the old cover until I remembered to run the plugin.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by kaufman

Actually, I dont use either. I use a plugin called (I think) "fix epub" which, among other things updates the embedded cover in the file. This happened a while ago, but I am pretty sure I continued to get the old cover until I remembered to run the plugin.

Modify EPUB PI was the basis for Polish book, so in a way it is really the same thing.

[kaufman]

I think so, but I am not sure. I'll check when I get home tomorrow. The one I use definitely makes invasive changes. It has options for lots. Of invasive. Changes, and if definitely updates the covers.

[BetterRed]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Modify EPUB PI was the basis for Polish book, so in a way it is really the same thing.

The Modify PI, bless its cotton socks, has features to get rid of the cover and to strip non dc elements from embedded metadata - neither of which can Book Polish or Embed Metadata do

BR

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

The Modify PI, bless its cotton socks, has features to get rid of the cover and to strip non dc elements from embedded metadata - neither of which can Book Polish or Embed Metadata do

BR

I should have specified that Modify EPUB is Polish on steroids, and that in this particular case the steroids are not being used.

Of course, Modify doesn't work on AZW3, and neither work on other formats like Embed does.
Good thing we have all these tools although sometimes it may get a little confusing which does which and what is actually necessary.

[BetterRed]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

I should have specified that Modify EPUB is Polish on steroids, and that in this particular case the steroids are not being used.

Of course, Modify doesn't work on AZW3, and neither work on other formats like Embed does.
Good thing we have all these tools although sometimes it may get a little confusing which does which and what is actually necessary.

The point of my post was to lend weight to chaley's conjecture that it's unwise to rely on having complete metadata embedded in the format file.

BR

[kaufman]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

The point of my post was to lend weight to chaley's conjecture that it's unwise to rely on having complete metadata embedded in the format file.

I believed him. I was, and am, surprised that everyone who takes the time to organize their books in calibre doesn't take the time to embed that organization into the book file (as much as is possible).

[cybmole]

Originally Posted by chaley

We don't mind writing the app if we get something for it. That is why the separate pay-for app is as attractive as it is.

OK but given that calibre cloud is free (with ads). or just over £1 for ad-free pro version you ain't going to get rich competing!

But if you can write such an app AND get it accepted by amazon ( unlike c cloud) then I'll buy a copy

PS to clarify: c cloud pro IS in amazon store but it labelled incompatible with kindles & I cannot buy a copy onto my Kindle fire. IF I search app store using my Kindle fire then it is hidden. Amazon are lying, as usual, if I side load the free version from Google play it works fine.

[chaley]

Originally Posted by kaufman

I believed him. I was, and am, surprised that everyone who takes the time to organize their books in calibre doesn't take the time to embed that organization into the book file (as much as is possible).

I really don't care if my books contain the metadata, because:

• I never look at it. The calibre GUI, calibre content server, and CC show me what I want to see.
• I don't need embedded metadata as a backup. I have backups of my library on physical media, two different clouds, and on my local NAS (RAID).
• There is no guarantee that I would always remember to update the books after making changes.