I'm looking for a new device

[sheygetz]

Originally Posted by HarryT

...nice to read on, but certainly nothing even approaching as nice as the eInk devices I now use.

Well, Harry, I guess you're right, but guess is the keyword here. Many of the devices mentioned here and in other places are not easily available in Germany to buy, let alone look & try. Yes, I know with sufficient determination I could buy one stateside, pay duties and stuff, but no, not really. Secondly, I find the prices for anything beyond the "Ebookwise" (?) - who make a point of not selling outside the US of A - totally out of proportion for a single-purpose device. I wouldn't dream of coughing up 4-500$ for an MP3-player either. And thirdly, and in the same vain, I find these devices to cumbersome for single-purpose - I'm looking for combination gizmos to help me cut down on number of devices plus associated wall-plugs, memory thingies etc. A question of priorities, no doubt. But, show me the 200g, 8" screen device which I can easily mail-order for say 150EUR and I'll take it - single-purpose or not . (Oh yes, and it's gotta do PDF and MS Reader, as that's what I've already got a lot of.)

Hendrik

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by sheygetz

Secondly, I find the prices for anything beyond the "Ebookwise" (?) - who make a point of not selling outside the US of A - totally out of proportion for a single-purpose device.

I guess it depends on your priorities, Hendrik. Reading is my main interest - I spend a lot more time reading than I spend watching TV, for example. For me, therefore, spending $500 on an eBook reader is money well-spent, just as many people would think nothing of spending $500 on a TV, which is an equally "single-purpose device".

We all have our own idea about what the important things to spend money on are.

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by HarryT

many people would think nothing of spending $500 on a TV, which is an equally "single-purpose device".

excellent analogy !

[eno]

Quite a few people have been mentioning the various versions of the Nokia tablet. Now, I understand this has a 4.13" screen with 800x480 Pixel. If one is willing to make do with that

"Make do"?

The screen is really very clear and easy to read. There is no "making do". Most people don't realize how good it is until they use one up close.

why not go with a pda? HP will be offering a new Ipaq 214 from sometime in Feb which has a 4"-TFT-display with 64k colors and 480x640. In Europe this will sell for about 330EUR, roughly the same as the N810. But, it will be a much more versatile machine.

Define "more versatile". The Nokias all run Linux and have active developer communities which makes them very versatile IMHO.

[eno]

Let's face it, most people do not have your ability (or, if they did, the time) to program this or any other device, but rather have it work out of the box. Especially given the fact, that at least in Europe this "raw" N810 is more expensive than the Ipaq.

"Raw"? Actually its a very polished device with a great browser. There's nothing "raw" about it. Most people would *not* know it runs Linux because it does not look "raw". Sounds like all your posts are made without any actual serious experience using the Nokia devices.

As I mentioned earlier, the N800 is cheaper than any iPaq and it can be flash upgraded to the same software as the N810.

[wallcraft]

I think it is fair to say that a Windows Mobile 6 device like the iPAQ 214 is more "versatile" in that it has a wider range of software available than the Nokia Internet Tablets. This includes a wider range of e-book reader software. However, the Nokia's have enough software available to make them very capable for many application areas. Also, 800 pixels wide is much better for some web pages than 640.

The Nokia's 4.1" screen is almost exactly 1/2 the size of a 6" E-Ink screen, but its pixels per inch is higher and it is in color. For e-books, a Nokia would typically be in landscape mode and you then have the same width as the 6" screen but need twice as many (very fast) page turns.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by sheygetz

Quite a few people have been mentioning the various versions of the Nokia tablet. Now, I understand this has a 4.13" screen with 800x480 Pixel. If one is willing to make do with that, why not go with a pda? HP will be offering a new Ipaq 214 from sometime in Feb which has a 4"-TFT-display with 64k colors and 480x640. In Europe this will sell for about 330EUR, roughly the same as the N810. But, it will be a much more versatile machine.

Hendrik

HP makes good devices. From what I've seen so far, I'm impressed by the HP210.

But it depends upon what you need to do. If PIM functionality is a requirement, the Nokia is not the best choice. Native PIM functionality isn't really there yet. (Though you can run the Access Garnet Virtual Machine and get "oldstyle" Palm PIMs with a quirk or two.)

If PIM functionality isn't a requirement, I'd go with the Nokia. Of course, I'm biased: I vastly prefer Linux under the hood to Windows Mobile.
______
Dennis

[tompe]

Originally Posted by wallcraft

I think it is fair to say that a Windows Mobile 6 device like the iPAQ 214 is more "versatile" in that it has a wider range of software available than the Nokia Internet Tablets. This includes a wider range of e-book reader software. However, the Nokia's have enough software available to make them very capable for many application areas. Also, 800 pixels wide is much better for some web pages than 640.

The Nokia's 4.1" screen is almost exactly 1/2 the size of a 6" E-Ink screen, but its pixels per inch is higher and it is in color. For e-books, a Nokia would typically be in landscape mode and you then have the same width as the 6" screen but need twice as many (very fast) page turns.

I really like my new N810 and I am very impressed how good the standard programs work. Before I got the N810 the Cybook was the best gadget I had ever bought but now it has competition. And just installing openssh get you something you can log into which for me is very useful. And getting my ebooks to the N810 was just a checkout using subversion.

I think it is better to read in portrait mode since you can use a smaller font and in landscape mode you then get too long lines.

Getting information from pdf file when you have scrolling and fast zoom is also very easy. My use for this is bus time tables.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

But it depends upon what you need to do. If PIM functionality is a requirement, the Nokia is not the best choice. Native PIM functionality isn't really there yet. (Though you can run the Access Garnet Virtual Machine and get "oldstyle" Palm PIMs with a quirk or two.)

If PIM functionality isn't a requirement, I'd go with the Nokia. Of course, I'm biased: I vastly prefer Linux under the hood to Windows Mobile.

I have now tested GPE (PIM applications) on my N810. It will work for me and since I do not synchronize to other applications I will not have any problem with that. The program is not as good as the Palm alternative but having nore than 16 categories and being able to assign more than one category to items is very useful.

[sheygetz]

Seems like the sh** hit the fan(boy)

Originally Posted by eno

"Make do"? The screen is really very clear and easy to read. There is no "making do".

Given that most threads here, and this one, concentrate on e-ink devices with 6"+ displays, I thought the expression would be appropriate because of its factual accuracy. It was absolutely clear from the context, that I was thinking size not clarity, no reason whatsoever to get all worked up.

Originally Posted by eno

Define "more versatile".

Don't you have a dictionary running on your cutesy Nokia ? How about "having or capable of many uses" for a start. PDAs, as Wallcraft kindly pointed out, have multiple uses out of the box. The Ns may easily be more flexible, in that you can write your own code for them, or use whatever is our there in the community. But I think you will agree (then again, maybe not...) that the majority out there prefers ready-made from recognizable sources instead of rough-around-the-edges-stuff from "active developer communities". The majority may not know what it's missing, but c'est la vie. Then again, I can imagine for someone who can program or likes, maybe even prefers, open source this may well be a dream-machine.

Originally Posted by eno

"Raw"? Actually its a very polished device with a great browser. There's nothing "raw" about it. Most people would *not* know it runs Linux because it does not look "raw".

"Raw" in the sense that while it may have a marvellous browser, most other things have to be added on from the a.m. sources, out of the box it is an unpolished diamond at best, if that expression suits you better.

Originally Posted by eno

...without any actual serious experience using the Nokia devices"

So actual would not be sufficient, it has to be serious, too . But, you're spot on. Unfortunately, I do not have the time nor funds to first buy everything to then find out it doesn't do what I expected it to. Rest assured I spent about 3-4 hours reading it up on the web. I found out the PIM options available where rough-hewn indeed and would not sync with Outlook. It doesn't run any well-known, reliable navigation. End of story for me. (Plus the praised reader doesn't do bookmarks if I got that right.)

The cheaper N800, to round this up, is not available in Europe anymore. Either the situation is different where you live or you have to get them on Ebay, which again, is not an option for many people, though it kind of goes well with the open source theme.

I am sorry that this has strayed (strewn?) rather far from the original topic. This is not the thread and probably not even the forum to discuss the merits of PPCs vs web-tablets - Hendrik

[tompe]

Originally Posted by sheygetz

Don't you have a dictionary running on your cutesy Nokia ? How about "having or capable of many uses" for a start. PDAs, as Wallcraft kindly pointed out, have multiple uses out of the box. The Ns may easily be more flexible, in that you can write your own code for them, or use whatever is our there in the community. But I think you will agree (then again, maybe not...) that the majority out there prefers ready-made from recognizable sources instead of rough-around-the-edges-stuff from "active developer communities". The majority may not know what it's missing, but c'est la vie. Then again, I can imagine for someone who can program or likes, maybe even prefers, open source this may well be a dream-machine.

Well, I have not dicovered enything I could do on my PDA that I cannot do on my N810 yet and that is only using programs that are easily downloaded from standard places. So what kind of functionality are you talking about that is missing?

You are right the synchonization is a problem but it seems to be on the way to be solved. I could not synchonize with my Palm PDA since I do not use Windows and the Linux programs was not working at least not when I bought the PDA.

Since you are connected all the time to the new through WiFi or through bluetooth via your phone you do not have to have all the funcitonality locally. I started to look at how to put the whole WikiPedia on my N810 today but after while I decided not to bother with it since I always have net.