Amazon pursuing me for buying US books outside of USA

[Pushka]

Dammit, now we are back to square one. Are you sure your address didnt slip back to your UK address?

[arvsinha]

Try changing the address to another country for a few days and then change back to US. It worked in my case.

[ChristopherTD]

I have emigrated to the UK and will emigrate back in a few days and see if my delinquent status is removed!

I apologise also for mentioning SSN - looking at the list now it doesn't include that, just passport, military ID etc. Phew.

Here is the text of their message:

I see that you attempted to purchase "Swords & Dark Magic: The New Sword and Sorcery (Kindle Edition)" while in a different country than United States listed on your Amazon account. Certain Kindle titles are not available everywhere. We are reaching out to you to ensure the best possible service for your account.

If you have moved to a different country, you can easily update your country for your Amazon account at www.Amazon.com/manageyourkindle

If this is not the case, and you would like to share information that you live in United States, we can be reached by fax at 001-206-266-1838 from outside the US, or 206-266-1838 from within the US. Helpful information includes:
– Passport
– Military ID
– Permanent Resident Card
– Driver’s License
– Other state photo identity card

We want to assure you that we handle this information in a secure manner: these are dedicated fax lines, staffed in an area with limited employee access. The fax is never printed, just converted to an electronic image that is used to check the country, then the image is deleted.

[arvsinha]

I think they charge an extra 2 dollar wireless delivery charges for books outside the US even if you just download the book onto the computer and upload to kindle. It is unfair cause I have a kindle 2 US Version, which does not receive whispernet coverage (I dont live in the US ) anyways and i always need to download the books via the computer.
Just there way of ensuring that you pay the extra 2 dollars for the free books that they give off from time to time.
Would love to hear what happened about your delinquent status - In a few days.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by arvsinha

I think they charge an extra 2 dollar wireless delivery charges for books outside the US even if you just download the book onto the computer and upload to kindle.

Depends where you live. The $2 is no longer charged in the UK, for example.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by ChristopherTD

Here is the text of their message:

I see that you attempted to purchase "Swords & Dark Magic: The New Sword and Sorcery (Kindle Edition)" while in a different country than United States listed on your Amazon account. Certain Kindle titles are not available everywhere. We are reaching out to you to ensure the best possible service for your account.

If you have moved to a different country, you can easily update your country for your Amazon account at www.Amazon.com/manageyourkindle

If this is not the case, and you would like to share information that you live in United States, we can be reached by fax at 001-206-266-1838 from outside the US, or 206-266-1838 from within the US. Helpful information includes:
– Passport
– Military ID
– Permanent Resident Card
– Driver’s License
– Other state photo identity card

We want to assure you that we handle this information in a secure manner: these are dedicated fax lines, staffed in an area with limited employee access. The fax is never printed, just converted to an electronic image that is used to check the country, then the image is deleted.

That's the standard e-mail they send in this situation. It's entirely legit.

[cruff]

Originally Posted by ChristopherTD

They want my Social Security Number or some other proof that I live in the USA!

I can't imagine that Amazon has any possible legal authority to have your SSN, you should definitely refuse to give it to them.

[guyanonymous]

Originally Posted by pietvo

Which law would that be?

I'm of the mind that the only legal limitation is due to geographic limitations put into contracts between the authors and the publisher.

An author would much rather sell the US rights, the CDN rights, the UK rights, the NK rights all separately, I suspect, and the publisher wants a guarantee, in return, that no other publisher will be selling books in their territory....all contractually bound in writing. IANAL but doubt there are any laws that prevent international sales of items IF the contract originally signed had permitted them. I'd blame the authors and the agents, here, as much as publishers.

[Pushka]

Amazon is just a shop. I would never provide any of those details to a shop. Maybe that means they might close my account. Then so be it.

[pietvo]

Originally Posted by guyanonymous

I'm of the mind that the only legal limitation is due to geographic limitations put into contracts between the authors and the publisher.

An author would much rather sell the US rights, the CDN rights, the UK rights, the NK rights all separately, I suspect, and the publisher wants a guarantee, in return, that no other publisher will be selling books in their territory....all contractually bound in writing. IANAL but doubt there are any laws that prevent international sales of items IF the contract originally signed had permitted them. I'd blame the authors and the agents, here, as much as publishers.

The point is: why do they say that the sale is in the country where the company/webshop is located when a pbook is sold en that the sale is in the country of the buyer for an ebook? Wouldn't it be simpler to always say that the sale is in the location of the seller? Or is there a law that says that the sale of an ebook is in the location of the buyer? I rather doubt that because that should then be a kind of international law. Or is there some kind of international agreement about this? I really would like to know why this is so.

[Pushka]

Originally Posted by pietvo

Wouldn't it be simpler to always say that the sale is in the location of the seller?.

Interesting question. Who is committing the offence, the seller or the buyer? Surely if the books are registered for SALE (which includes distribution) in the US (and I suspect that is the case) then it is irrelevant who buys it.

[Terisa de morgan]

It's the same reason for having a different VAT for paper books and ebooks, diferent kind of good. I don't know exactly the law but you're asking for logic in laws. Pleeeeease

[Terisa de morgan]

Originally Posted by Pushka

Interesting question. Who is committing the offence, the seller or the buyer? Surely if the books are registered for SALE (which includes distribution) in the US (and I suspect that is the case) then it is irrelevant who buys it.

Paper? Yes. eBook? No. It depends on the buyer, sorry, ilogical but true.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by pietvo

The point is: why do they say that the sale is in the country where the company/webshop is located when a pbook is sold en that the sale is in the country of the buyer for an ebook? Wouldn't it be simpler to always say that the sale is in the location of the seller? Or is there a law that says that the sale of an ebook is in the location of the buyer? I rather doubt that because that should then be a kind of international law. Or is there some kind of international agreement about this? I really would like to know why this is so.

Ridiculous though it is, it really is the case, it would seem. Amazon employ whole legions of lawyers; if they could sell you a product, do you really think that they wouldn't want to do so if there was any way that they could? Amazon are in the business of selling. The fact that they won't sell to you indicates that there must be some excellent - almost certainly legal - reason preventing them from doing so.

[harryE123]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Ridiculous though it is, it really is the case, it would seem. Amazon employ whole legions of lawyers; if they could sell you a product, do you really think that they wouldn't want to do so if there was any way that they could? Amazon are in the business of selling. The fact that they won't sell to you indicates that there must be some excellent - almost certainly legal - reason preventing them from doing so.

I am sorry, I honestly don't mean any offense but this is a garbage comment, it presupposes not only amazon's will to change this, but also their infallibility in going about doing so. This if they could they would is rubbish. DRM for example was an issue in audio files, and one could have said apple if they could they would reomove it way back when so the fact that they were not removing it for a while meant that they never could? They ultimately managed to by re-negotiating deals.


Amazon should get it together and start lawyering up for the benefit of the consumer (as apple did with drm) and throw this garbage rules to us. For the time being I just think it's an issue of them not caring enough to do anything about it since they will already sell the books anyway. Just like they are doing with the ridiculously high prices of buying both an e and p book version, ridiculous...