Would you buy an e-book with DRM?

[FizzyWater]

Afa,

I bought my first computer in 1996. Fourteen years later and I'm on my...sixth, or is it seventh...computer. One Acer. One Packard Bell (forgive me, I know better now). One computer store "home" brand. And three Toshiba laptops. Imagine if the Acer "Word" docs couldn't be read on the Toshiba, or vice versa.

I'm on my second PDA. My third or fourth cell phone. And my fourth ebook reader (I'm such a gadget slut!)

My first ebook reader was my first PDA. I bought eReader formatted books for it (although they were called Peanut Press...then something else I could remember if I was at home...then eReader). I could read those on the PDA or home computer.

Then I bought an eBookwise. Oops. None of my ebooks worked on it. And if I bought books from eBookwise for it? They were only good for that machine - even if I bought another one, they wouldn't have been any good.

Now I have Sony #3...oh, god, #4. My original LRX books don't work anymore. Luckily, they converted them (mostly) to ePubs, but they certainly didn't have to.

Today there's the nook that would read my old eReader books, if I wanted a nook (I don't like the dual screen). And I can still read them on my PDA (2nd edition) or computer. The DRM version they use is tied to me having eReader software, not to what computer I'm reading on.

DRM sucks if you're a re-reader. If you only read the books once (and pretty much right away after you buy them), it's really no big deal. But when I think about how long books sit on my TBR pile before I eventually get around to reading some of them? DRM sucks.

[BenLee]

Electronic books read on a personal computer or an e-book reader typically use DRM restrictions to limit copying, printing, and sharing of e-books. E-books are usually limited to a certain number of reading devices and some e-publishers prevent any copying or printing. Some commentators believe that DRM is something that makes E-book publishing complex.[33]

Two software programs to view e-books are Adobe Reader and Microsoft Reader.[34] Each program uses a slightly different approach to DRM. The first version of Adobe Acrobat e-book Reader to have encryption technologies was version 5.05. In the later version 6.0, the technologies of the PDF reader and the e-book reader were combined, allowing it to read both DRM-restricted and unrestricted files.[34] After opening the file, the user is able to view the rights statement, which outlines actions available for the specific document. For example, for a freely transferred PDF, printing, copying to the clipboard, and other basic functions are available to the user. However, when viewing a more highly restricted e-book, the user is unable to print the book, copy or paste selections.[34] The level of restriction is specified by the publisher or distribution agency.[35]

Microsoft Reader, which exclusively reads e-books in a .lit format, contains its own DRM software. In Microsoft Reader there are three different levels of access control depending on the e-book: sealed e-books, inscribed e-books and owner exclusive e-books. Sealed e-books have the least amount of restriction and only prevents the document from being modified.[34] Therefore, the reader cannot alter the content of the book to change the ending, for instance. Inscribed e-books are the next level of restriction. After purchasing and downloading the e-book, Microsoft Reader puts a digital ID tag to identify the owner of the e-book. Therefore, this discourages distribution of the e-book because it is inscribed with the owner’s name making it possible to trace it back to the original copy that was distributed.[34] Other e-book software uses similar DRM schemes. For example, Palm Digital Media, now known as Ereader, links the credit card information of the purchaser to the e-book copy in order to discourage distribution of the books.[36]

The most stringent form of security that Microsoft Reader offers is called owner exclusive e-books, which uses traditional DRM technologies. To buy the e-book the consumer must first open Microsoft Reader, which ensures that when the book is downloaded it becomes linked to the computer’s Microsoft Passport account. Thus the e-book can only be opened with the computer with which it was downloaded, preventing copying and distribution of the text.[34]

Amazon.com has remotely deleted purchased copies of George Orwell's 1984 and Animal Farm from customer's Amazon Kindles.[37] Commenters have widely described these actions as Orwellian, and have alluded to Big Brother from Orwell's 1984.[38][39][40][41][42] After an apology from Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos, the Free Software Foundation has written that this is just one more example of the excessive power Amazon has to remotely censor what people read through its software, and called upon Amazon to free its e-book reader and drop DRM

So basically, depending on the DRM, the book you "buy" could end up locked to your specific device and never be allowed to transfer elsewhere, even if you buy a new device. Totally not cool.

[BenLee]

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

DRM sucks if you're a re-reader. If you only read the books once (and pretty much right away after you buy them), it's really no big deal. But when I think about how long books sit on my TBR pile before I eventually get around to reading some of them? DRM sucks.

Exactly.

I tend to buy books that take multiple reads to digest. It'll probably be read 5-20 times over the course of years. Knowing that, I'm sure there will be device or software changes. What happens then? I'm basically screwed with DRM.

[Maggie Leung]

I'm a big re-reader, too. I'd rather not deal with DRM, but I buy DRM books because content is my priority. I buy 'em from Amazon and others that support reading on multiple devices. I don't buy iBooks or any others tethered to any one company's device(s).

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by afa

That's scary.

I'm sorry to go a little off-topic, but since I'm a little new to the whole ebook world, I'm not sure how this works. So, could you explain what you mean by "lose access"? I mean, once it's on your reader, it's on your reader, right? (unless you have a Kindle, of course...) And the files on your hard drive? Does it mean they refuse to open, or what? Do DRMed files 'check' with the provider via your Internet connection every time you open them?

Thanks. And again, sorry for going off-topic.

there have already been some interesting examples in reply to your question, here's what happened to me.

i had to reinstall my OS (windows). it turns out (i discovered afterwards...), the MS Reader app gets a new ID number (or whatever) when you reinstall. so all the books i had downloaded on the previous installation were no longer recognized, and i can't open them. also, this id is apparently stored in my account online, so when i try to download those books from my bookshelf (which, by the way, you can ONLY do via Internet Explorer, which means if i switched from windows to a system which doesn't support IE, i'm out of luck as well), the drm server checks my ms reader id, sees it doesn't match, and the connection is blocked as being illegitimate.

in theory, i should be able to just re-authorise my MS Reader, link the new id to my account, and re-download the books. except that my MS Reader is linked to an MS Passport.net account, which apparently i created specifically for the purpose (doubtless because i didn't have the choice, i wouldn't have added that ridiculous extra step just for fun) and never logged into again, and i can't for the life of me figure out what my login / password is (i usually use one of a specific few for throwaway accounts like that, but it's not any of the obvious ones, i've tried them all). and when i click on the "forgot my password" link i get sent from link to link around in a circle and end up back where i started.

so i'm well and truly stuck, as you can see. since i *did* remove the drm immediately after buying those books i do have copies i can read, which is a lucky thing since when i lost access i hadn't quite a few of them at all yet. but if i lose those copies i think i'm out of luck. thank you, drm !

[Lady Fitzgerald]

Originally Posted by afa

That's scary.

I'm sorry to go a little off-topic, but since I'm a little new to the whole ebook world, I'm not sure how this works. So, could you explain what you mean by "lose access"? I mean, once it's on your reader, it's on your reader, right? (unless you have a Kindle, of course...) And the files on your hard drive? Does it mean they refuse to open, or what? Do DRMed files 'check' with the provider via your Internet connection every time you open them?

Thanks. And again, sorry for going off-topic.

If an e-book has DRM encumbrance limiting it to a certain reader and the reader gets discontinued, you will be stuck with a book you can't read. Of course, you know about Amazon pulling that book off the Kindles. The Sony's may be able to do the same. Same for any other reader that talks to its store.

[afa]

Wow, this is actually worse than I thought. I had assumed that even if the ebook is locked to one reader, if you upgrade to another, you could just re-register that reader with your account. So, that's not the way it works? That's just stupid. And when you think about it, it's bad for the manufacturers, too. Sales of devices are dependant on manufacturers coming out with newer, better tech over time. If I have books that can't be read on any device other my current one, then that would obviously discourage me from buying a new e-reader, which is not what they want. This is hurting them, too, isn't it? What a dumb system.

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

DRM sucks if you're a re-reader. If you only read the books once (and pretty much right away after you buy them), it's really no big deal. But when I think about how long books sit on my TBR pile before I eventually get around to reading some of them? DRM sucks.

So, you can only read ebooks a certain number of times or for a limited time? Wow, this just gets dumber and dumber. I have several books that I've read multiple times. Man, this DRM business is worse than I ever thought. I better teach myself how to strip it, pronto.

Oh, and thanks to everyone for the info. I appreciate it.

[FizzyWater]

Originally Posted by afa

Man, this DRM business is worse than I ever thought. I better teach myself how to strip it, pronto.

Oh, and thanks to everyone for the info. I appreciate it.

It gets complicated, because today, if you bought books on your Kindle 1, then upgraded to a Kindle 2 or DX, your books are still available.

But there are people who remember that Amazon and B&N sold ebooks maybe 8-10 years ago, then decided to stop. Download your bookshelf now or forever hold your piece. And those are the people who bought the Microsoft LIT and/or Adobe PDF books that no longer are tied to their current computers for one reason or another.

Adobe epub books are tied to an authorization that is limited to up to six machines. Oh, today, if you have problems and re-authorize and re-authorize and you need more than six, you can contact them. But there's no guarantee they'll expand you beyond six, or that they will tomorrow or next year or whatever.

Amazon may allow you to download your Kindle books for the rest of your life, but they may not. In the past, they definitely haven't. So we're wary of trusting the "promise" of an eternal digital bookshelf.

One of the big discussions you'll see here is the wish (longing, yearning) for a single format - one that reads on anything you play it on (like a CD). That would allow some of the fear ease - but it still depends on the form of DRM.

When I decided to start buying digital books (before most of the hacking tools were around), I chose to limit my DRM purchases to eReader format. The DRM is built into the book, and uses my name and credit card number to unlock the book. But as long as I have a copy of eReader software, I can read those books (I still have the same credit card number, but others have complained about books tied to credit cards they haven't used in a decade of years!)

Even that's not perfect. If eReader goes away, then those books are only as good as my own backups of that software (assuming they'll continue to installable on newer versions of Windows down the road).

Some people say, so what? The 8-track tapes we bought in the 70s don't play in anything today! They've repurchased favorite music on cassette tapes, then CDs, now MP3s. I have paperback books from the 70s that are falling a-part. And I have some that are in almost pristine shape. Eventually, that paper will rot or mold or whatever.

I don't care. I want to buy my books once and read them on whatever gadget I'm reading on today, tomorrow, next year. And I'd love to be able to pass them on to a young fan when I go (although I doubt that'll ever be legal!)

The sad thing is, DRM is a fact of life right now, if you want books by the mainstream publishers. If you're adventurous, you can try to independent ebook publishers and buy books with DRM. But if you're looking for the latest John Grisham or Janet Evanovich (or Dennis Lehane, to stick with my earlier example!), you're stuck with DRM at this point.

And then...you're having to decide whether you're going to trust your ebook store to be there tomorrow, or whether you're going to be willing to rebuy books when your current versions become obsolete, or - to become a hacker and law-breaker!

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

I hate it. I selected "Yes, if I think I can remove the DRM after purchase" in your poll, although my actual position is "Yes, if I'm sure I can remove the DRM after purchase"

Completely agree with this.

Every book I buy, DRM or no DRM I download and store at two different locations (the DRM books will have the DRM stripped).

[Clancy_s]

Yes, if I think (almost sure) I can remove it after purchase. If I'm offered a choice of buying with or without (at about the same price) I'd always go with the one without.

[Fbone]

I voted yes although I dont own a device. My usual MO is to throw the book away after reading. I've never read a book twice. Recently, I realized the library exists and started utilizing it to save money. Although, anticipated library budget cuts may affect me and have started researching suitable ereaders.

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by Stinger

I will not purchase any ebook wrapped in DRM, out of principle.

I did ponder this question when the first drm-removal script for Mobipocket appeared. In the end, I decided that there was no way that there would be enough people interested in DRM to make such a stand actually noticeable. I had previous sent publishers emails telling them that I wasn't buying a particular book because of the DRM. I don't think that had any effect either.

And, of course, there were some DRMed books that I really wanted. What can I say? Once I could strip the DRM, I bought them...

[alecE]

I automatically strip DRM off any books I buy which have that detestable imposition, so I voted for "yes if I can strip off the DRM".

I'm not going to go on a copying & illicit distribution spree, but neither will I allow publishers to lock me to a device or to endanger my future ability to read a text I've paid good money for.

[Freeshadow]

definitrely NO

btw. not only music, but also RPG-(book) sellers learned that lesson already:
the RPG pdfs being sold are being watermarked but they are not getting any drm

Originally Posted by Fbone

I've never read a book twice.

well this is something where POV are lying galaxies avay from each other.
for me a book which is not worth to be re-read isn't worth to be read once too...

[BearMountainBooks]

Originally Posted by rhadin

I selected yes because it is the closest correct response. I do buy ebooks with DRM, largely from the Sony store. That's because I can read the ebook on a lot of different dedicated reading devices.

What I won't do is buy a DRMed ebook that I can only read on a single device or on devices other than my e-ink dedicated reader, not even if I can strip the DRM. Consequently, I would never consider buying an ebook from Amazon.

Of course, there is another caveat: price. I am willing to buy ebooks at Sony with DRM because I can buy them at a 40% discount, at least until I use up my gift card credit (I bought $250 worth of gift cards for $150 when Target had them on sale). Once that runs out, I won't be buying there because of pricing.

If a book comes with DRM I am unwilling to pay more than $2-$3 for it; if it is both laden with DRM and from an unknown author, I am unwilling to pay more than 99 cents.

So yes is the correct answer but with lots of caveats.

In all fairness there are books on Amazon without DRM--mine and many other backlist/indie authors who have selected the No DRM option when publishing.

Maria