My suggestions on getting the device to look blacker. - Page 3

Sunspark · 12-08-2009, 09:42 PM

So I was in a different store this evening and I compared a different Sony 300 again.

Definite difference.. the 300's screen was whitish grey. Mine is green tinged. The text was black, mine is dark grey.

Either this is a firmware thing, or Sony cherry picked the best screens. This bugs me.

I have emailed Astak to ask about it.. I suppose I'll find out what kind of answer I'll get back..

omro · 12-08-2009, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunspark

So I was in a different store this evening and I compared a different Sony 300 again.

Definite difference.. the 300's screen was whitish grey. Mine is green tinged. The text was black, mine is dark grey.

Either this is a firmware thing, or Sony cherry picked the best screens. This bugs me.

I have emailed Astak to ask about it.. I suppose I'll find out what kind of answer I'll get back..

I think it's a firmware thing, as some elements, mentioned earlier, are much darker than others.

Obvious case in point:

Go to the Main screen. Everything, the bars, icons and text, is the same dark grey as the status bar on the bottom on the page.

Look at the status bar and at the battery indicator. The battery bar blocks are a much darker solid black by comparison.

jusmee · 12-08-2009, 11:28 PM

People, the thing has 8 levels of grey. You can't say the screen is darker or lighter unless you are sure you are looking at something painted in the darkest of those levels.

Sunspark · 12-09-2009, 01:19 AM

In the font sizes thread, people posted scans of their screens.. I used a digital eyedropper to examine them at extreme pixel level zoom.. it was interesting.. The headings that are "bold" what I'm seeing is they tend to keep "dark" on the curves, etc. but on the body text it's like there's a center line that is dark, and then on both sides of it, light grey.

This makes me think that the font aliasing is screwed up. A curve is a curve, I don't think edges should look darker on one than the other. It's aliasing, I think it's just picking the wrong shade to alias with compared to the headings.

Sunspark · 12-09-2009, 01:40 AM

I was right!!

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/04/kindle-2-displa/

Seems like the Kindle 2 people had the same problem.. click on link to see sample image.. damn..

The top image is how the fonts look on the Kindle 2 (and ours as well though ours are slightly worse). The bottom image is the SAME screen after the guy hacked the device to use both a bolder font and disabled anti-aliasing.

VERY interesting 4 page article on the font problem our devices have in common with the Kindle 2, screenshots galore:

https://sites.google.com/a/etccreati.../kdesignworks/

I still think I have a bum screen though.. seems like some Kindle screens are more faded than others, even when fixing the stupid antialiasing.

mrsquash · 12-09-2009, 05:06 AM

I think you're onto something, Sunspark. The Kindle problem surfaced when they went from the 4 gray levels of the Kindle 1 to the 16 levels of the Kindle 2. The Kindle guy in your link (Ted Inoue) says that the Kindle's problems are due to font-smoothing algorithms which take advantage of those extra gray levels for better text and graphics rendering. This works great on backlit devices like monitors but decreases contrast on reflective screens like e-ink.

I've got a 4-level grayscale Astak EZReader Basic. Epubs look fine on that. But on my 8-level grayscale Astak Pocket Pro, those same epubs look somewhat washed-out.

On my 8-level grayscale Sony PRS-300 (a 5-incher like the Pocket Pro), the epubs look great; noticeably darker and sharper than on the Pocket Pro. I decided to run a little test to look at the influence of the font, so on both devices I loaded up JSWolf's excellent epub production of Agatha Christie's "The Secret Adversary", v1.2, with embedded Fontin fonts, available here at MobileRead. On the Sony, the text looked very good. On the Pocket Pro, it was noticeably lighter, lower contrast, whatever you want to call it. Since both devices are 8-level grayscale, using the same font, this test implicates the font-rendering of the Astak as the cause of the difference. If that's the case, then the better solution (for Jinke) to this issue would be to improve the rendering, rather than to just make it easier for us to change fonts (though that would be nice, too).

Basically, what Jinke needs to do is to buy a Sony 300 or 505 and clean-room reverse-engineer its font-rendering engine. Or maybe just hire a disgruntled Sony software engineer.

omro · 12-09-2009, 07:10 AM

It can't be that hard to tell the software to temporarily render black as black, darkest grey as black, next darkest grey as darkest grey, next next darkest grey as next darkest grey, etc and see what difference that makes initially.

Or allow us to turn off anti-aliasing as a quick fix, interim measure. My DR, which had 16 levels of grey, did not have this issue. I've gone through a ton of pdfs that I would have read frequently on my DR and they all seem lighter to me. I still wish I had my DR to compare to for definite, but with all the complaints people have about the DR series, faint text would have cropped up by now more if it had been a real issue for the device.

omro · 12-09-2009, 09:06 AM

Look at this screen grab from newegg's website. They are the people I bought my EZ Reader from.

Look at the purple rings, they clearly show the text is the same dark grey as the bar at the bottom of the screen.

Look at the blue ring, that clearly shows that the battery icon shows as black compared to the dark grey.

Black is possible

slm · 12-09-2009, 09:10 AM

Install ArialBlack and use it. The text comes out really, really, black

omro · 12-09-2009, 09:12 AM

I have tried to make feedbooks epubs work on a different font and each time I've tried, it's failed, so I've given up. I'd rather this just be fixed in device settings.

However, Feedbooks' custom PDF 76x102mm using New Century Schoolbook 11pt is pretty clear to read and dark.

Unfortunately the files are always more than twice the size of the ePubs

jusmee · 12-09-2009, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slm

Install ArialBlack and use it. The text comes out really, really, black

For ePub? How? I mean, without editing each and every book's stylesheet.

slm · 12-09-2009, 04:46 PM

I stick the extra css into Calibre's conversion box. If need be, I convert out of e pub and back in.
Of course this assumes you aren't trying to read a DRM'd epub.

omro · 12-09-2009, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slm

I stick the extra css into Calibre's conversion box. If need be, I convert out of e pub and back in.
Of course this assumes you aren't trying to read a DRM'd epub.

Will that screw up a Feedbook epub?

jusmee · 12-09-2009, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slm

I stick the extra css into Calibre's conversion box. If need be, I convert out of e pub and back in.
Of course this assumes you aren't trying to read a DRM'd epub.

I still don't agree with having to edit the css of every book like this. The device has a setting to set the default font, and it should damn well work in each format

DaleDe · 12-09-2009, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jusmee

I still don't agree with having to edit the css of every book like this. The device has a setting to set the default font, and it should damn well work in each format

What people are providing is a work around. Nobody says it is the best way and no one in this forum can fix it, only make suggestions. I hope this is damn clear.

12-09-2009, 01:40 AM	#35
Sunspark Zealot Posts: 122 Karma: 2600 Join Date: Sep 2009 Device: EZ Reader Pocket PRO	I was right!! http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/04/kindle-2-displa/ Seems like the Kindle 2 people had the same problem.. click on link to see sample image.. damn.. The top image is how the fonts look on the Kindle 2 (and ours as well though ours are slightly worse). The bottom image is the SAME screen after the guy hacked the device to use both a bolder font and disabled anti-aliasing. VERY interesting 4 page article on the font problem our devices have in common with the Kindle 2, screenshots galore: https://sites.google.com/a/etccreati.../kdesignworks/ I still think I have a bum screen though.. seems like some Kindle screens are more faded than others, even when fixing the stupid antialiasing. Last edited by Sunspark; 12-09-2009 at 02:12 AM.

12-09-2009, 07:10 AM	#37
omro Addict Posts: 375 Karma: 452000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hamilton, On Device: Kobo Aura HD	It can't be that hard to tell the software to temporarily render black as black, darkest grey as black, next darkest grey as darkest grey, next next darkest grey as next darkest grey, etc and see what difference that makes initially. Or allow us to turn off anti-aliasing as a quick fix, interim measure. My DR, which had 16 levels of grey, did not have this issue. I've gone through a ton of pdfs that I would have read frequently on my DR and they all seem lighter to me. I still wish I had my DR to compare to for definite, but with all the complaints people have about the DR series, faint text would have cropped up by now more if it had been a real issue for the device. Last edited by omro; 12-09-2009 at 07:15 AM.

12-09-2009, 09:06 AM	#38
omro Addict Posts: 375 Karma: 452000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hamilton, On Device: Kobo Aura HD	Look at this screen grab from newegg's website. They are the people I bought my EZ Reader from. Look at the purple rings, they clearly show the text is the same dark grey as the bar at the bottom of the screen. Look at the blue ring, that clearly shows that the battery icon shows as black compared to the dark grey. Black is possible Attached Thumbnails

12-09-2009, 09:12 AM	#40
omro Addict Posts: 375 Karma: 452000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hamilton, On Device: Kobo Aura HD	I have tried to make feedbooks epubs work on a different font and each time I've tried, it's failed, so I've given up. I'd rather this just be fixed in device settings. However, Feedbooks' custom PDF 76x102mm using New Century Schoolbook 11pt is pretty clear to read and dark. Unfortunately the files are always more than twice the size of the ePubs Last edited by omro; 12-09-2009 at 12:47 PM.

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12-08-2009, 09:42 PM	#31
Sunspark Zealot Posts: 122 Karma: 2600 Join Date: Sep 2009 Device: EZ Reader Pocket PRO	So I was in a different store this evening and I compared a different Sony 300 again. Definite difference.. the 300's screen was whitish grey. Mine is green tinged. The text was black, mine is dark grey. Either this is a firmware thing, or Sony cherry picked the best screens. This bugs me. I have emailed Astak to ask about it.. I suppose I'll find out what kind of answer I'll get back..

12-08-2009, 11:28 PM	#33
jusmee Wizard Posts: 1,047 Karma: 203682 Join Date: Oct 2009 Device: Libre 2	People, the thing has 8 levels of grey. You can't say the screen is darker or lighter unless you are sure you are looking at something painted in the darkest of those levels.

12-09-2009, 01:19 AM	#34
Sunspark Zealot Posts: 122 Karma: 2600 Join Date: Sep 2009 Device: EZ Reader Pocket PRO	In the font sizes thread, people posted scans of their screens.. I used a digital eyedropper to examine them at extreme pixel level zoom.. it was interesting.. The headings that are "bold" what I'm seeing is they tend to keep "dark" on the curves, etc. but on the body text it's like there's a center line that is dark, and then on both sides of it, light grey. This makes me think that the font aliasing is screwed up. A curve is a curve, I don't think edges should look darker on one than the other. It's aliasing, I think it's just picking the wrong shade to alias with compared to the headings.

12-09-2009, 05:06 AM	#36
mrsquash Connoisseur Posts: 78 Karma: 648 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: USA Device: K4-NT, Sony T1	I think you're onto something, Sunspark. The Kindle problem surfaced when they went from the 4 gray levels of the Kindle 1 to the 16 levels of the Kindle 2. The Kindle guy in your link (Ted Inoue) says that the Kindle's problems are due to font-smoothing algorithms which take advantage of those extra gray levels for better text and graphics rendering. This works great on backlit devices like monitors but decreases contrast on reflective screens like e-ink. I've got a 4-level grayscale Astak EZReader Basic. Epubs look fine on that. But on my 8-level grayscale Astak Pocket Pro, those same epubs look somewhat washed-out. On my 8-level grayscale Sony PRS-300 (a 5-incher like the Pocket Pro), the epubs look great; noticeably darker and sharper than on the Pocket Pro. I decided to run a little test to look at the influence of the font, so on both devices I loaded up JSWolf's excellent epub production of Agatha Christie's "The Secret Adversary", v1.2, with embedded Fontin fonts, available here at MobileRead. On the Sony, the text looked very good. On the Pocket Pro, it was noticeably lighter, lower contrast, whatever you want to call it. Since both devices are 8-level grayscale, using the same font, this test implicates the font-rendering of the Astak as the cause of the difference. If that's the case, then the better solution (for Jinke) to this issue would be to improve the rendering, rather than to just make it easier for us to change fonts (though that would be nice, too). Basically, what Jinke needs to do is to buy a Sony 300 or 505 and clean-room reverse-engineer its font-rendering engine. Or maybe just hire a disgruntled Sony software engineer.

12-09-2009, 09:10 AM	#39
slm Fool Posts: 468 Karma: 4113712 Join Date: Feb 2003 Device: Kindle: Voyage,PW1,KOA, Kobo: Clara Colour, Nook GLP, Pocketbook verse	Install ArialBlack and use it. The text comes out really, really, black

12-09-2009, 04:46 PM	#42
slm Fool Posts: 468 Karma: 4113712 Join Date: Feb 2003 Device: Kindle: Voyage,PW1,KOA, Kobo: Clara Colour, Nook GLP, Pocketbook verse	I stick the extra css into Calibre's conversion box. If need be, I convert out of e pub and back in. Of course this assumes you aren't trying to read a DRM'd epub.

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