Dealing with Amazon can be a right pain

[Josieb1]

Originally Posted by Timboli

Of course they are perfectly aware, how could they not be.

Collecting data, and then sitting on it for whatever reason, is a perfectly reasonable thing to do.

The fact that DRM removal that was created more than a year ago, still works after a few Kindle updates, proves they aren't currently actively trying to stop it. They've given up, doesn't have the ring of truth to me.

And who can truly say what the future might bring.

P.S. And we have all heard of people who have had their Kindle wiped, all supposedly unfairly and never a reason given apparently, or rarely so. A wise person shows a measure of caution.

I buy books from independent publishers, Kobo and Amazon. As soon as I buy a book it is loaded into Calibre and liberated from whatever DRM it 'may' have had. Books from Amazon are never sent back into my account so how would Amazon even know that's what I've done? All they know is that I downloaded each file for transfer by USB. Amazon purchases are downloaded to my kindle and read as AZW files, as intended by Amazon.

Purchases from other sources are sent into Amazon as mobi files. Since the publishers, and Kobo, sell them DRM free again I can't see a problem from Amazon's perspective.

I do what I do for backup. I, from personal experience, have little faith in Amazon plus I've had ebook retailers close, multiple times. It's my own responsibility to back up my own files and that is what I do. The day Amazon, or any ebook retailer, stops me doing that is the day I stop buying from them after all Fan fiction is free and I don't have to spend money buying that.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by Timboli

P.S. And we have all heard of people who have had their Kindle wiped, all supposedly unfairly and never a reason given apparently, or rarely so. A wise person shows a measure of caution.

I'm not afraid of having my Kindles wiped, because all the books on them are sideloaded and backed up several times. There's nothing there anyone can wipe that I cannot restore.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by latepaul

Regarding DRM removal and the possibility of an identifying watermark - I'm not concerned about this because I only ever remove DRM for personal use anyway. I don't distribute them.

Yes, that's it exactly. I have some Estonian books with watermarks. They're actually removable, but I've never bothered. There's just no reason to.

[Timboli]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

One quick question. Did you buy the first three books before the 4th one was published?

The three books you speak of are not really books, they are segments of a short story or novella. I bought them as they were released, and never saw the 4th one because of its erroneous restriction, that was hiding it from me.

If yes, then there is no reason for Amazon to give you a refund. There was never a guarantee the 4th book would be published. (I have been burned like that by a couple of "authors". )

While there was no guarantee, it has in fact been published as promised by the author, and there is no fair sensible or logical reason to exclude it from me.

Now since you have talked to the author, how about asking him for a review copy.

Review copies usually happen on release, not 6 months later. That said, I am still waiting to hear back from him. However, for reasons I have stated in previous posts, it is about more than one author or ebook.

So if I read right, you are using Amazon. Com instead of Amazon.au so you can buy geo-restricted books and now you want Amazon to refund the money on 3 ill-gotten books because you can't buy the 4th that wasn't even published when you bought the first 3.

That is not correct. I started with Amazon.com and was never under any obligation, and still aren't, to move to Amazon.com.au. How on earth are they ill-gotten books? If they were, then so are the other almost 100 I fairly bought, that they advertised to me. I did not do anything sneaky or underhanded to get them, so to imply they are ill-gotten is just absurd. I bought them the same way every legit customer does.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by Timboli

Some people obviously don't pay attention to all I write or just cherry pick.

Cinisajoy in particular, you need to fully read what I said, as you have said things that don't tally, and show you don't really understand. Sorry, but it stands out like dog balls, no offense.

Ok. Let's see if the mutt can clarify since I don't have balls unless you are talking about yarn.
Did you buy the books before the 4th book was published?
Did you read the books?
If yes to either, then why should you be entitled to a refund?
Is that simple enough arf arf?

[DiapDealer]

I don't believe there are any verified cases of users' Kindles being remotely "wiped." The most popular story was the woman whose Amazon account was closed and no longer had access to her online library. But even in that case, her Kindle had not been "wiped." It was merely broken.

[Timboli]

Originally Posted by Josieb1

Books from Amazon are never sent back into my account so how would Amazon even know that's what I've done?

They wouldn't, unless as I stated they are on a reader that syncs back to the store.

Don't get me wrong, I am not against DRM removal and I may even do it myself privately. In fact I see DRM as morally & ethically wrong. It is there, more to prevent someone getting something for free, rather than protecting profits, and the customer pays the penalty for it.

All I did was ask if anyone had considered the possibility of ID embedding.

We all know what has been happening with Copyright and music/movies and how corporations are always trying to get Laws introduced to further restrict and allow them to sue etc.

[Cinisajoy]

My apologies on the ill-gotten comment. It was a bit of misinformation.
It sounds like the first 3 were just published on Amazon first and later moved to Kindle Worlds.

And I have gotten books from authors after they have been out for a while.

But my point is and was and always will be you knew when you bought the first three that they were segments not a full book. So no guarantee you would be able to get the fourth part.

Yes, I think it is unfair but should I be able to get a refund on a book because the author, publisher or distributor decided not to make the second or later part available to me?

We both knew going in there was that possibility.

Yes, Amazon should open KW to more areas. Especially since Hugh and company have a huge following.

[Timboli]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

...It is also highly possible the OP got the first 3 due to a glitch in the system.

Wilson Harp was late to writing his story in the Silo Saga, and Kindle Worlds was well and truly big time when he entered the picture.

If you had read what I stated previously, you would know I have bought almost 100 of these Kindle World books. So it isn't just three I got due to a glitch.

That so called glitch is still in existence for those three and the other 90+

My recollection is that Hugh's Fan Fiction authors happened around about the same time Kindle Worlds did, and that he was one of a small handful of authors involved initially. For sure, the greater majority I have were labelled Kindle World, if not all.

[Timboli]

Let me state once and for all, that Kindle World doesn't appear to have anything to do with my situation. None of the actual facts add up to that in any kind of manner.

I bought nearly 100 of them, all of which as far as I know, still show a purchase button when I go to their web pages. Certainly all the ones I have checked thus far, including the first three parts by Wilson Harp. I have even gone to newer Kindle World ebooks and they show a purchase button too.

Amazon have made an error or allowed one to happen without fixing it.

So whether I should feel entitled or not, is really a mote point. Errors need fixing.

I did not ideally want the refund, but they called my bluff, which wasn't a bluff.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by Timboli

Wilson Harp was late to writing his story in the Silo Saga, and Kindle Worlds was well and truly big time when he entered the picture.

If you had read what I stated previously, you would know I have bought almost 100 of these Kindle World books. So it isn't just three I got due to a glitch.

That so called glitch is still in existence for those three and the other 90+

My recollection is that Hugh's Fan Fiction authors happened around about the same time Kindle Worlds did, and that he was one of a small handful of authors involved initially. For sure, the greater majority I have were labelled Kindle World, if not all.

Hmmmm 6 months is late. His first was published September 2013. Kindle Worlds started in May 2013.

It is odd that KW isn't supposed to be available to you but you have bought many.

I was there when Hugh said ok to fan fiction. I have talked to him many times. I was facebook friends with him before he got huge.
His was the first world. I love Hugh Howey.
I avoid Kindle Worlds. That has more to do with money than anything. I would go broke in a hurry on two other worlds.

I also thought we were talking big money on the refunds but it appears to be less than $10.

[Timboli]

Originally Posted by Josieb1

...I do what I do for backup. I, from personal experience, have little faith in Amazon plus I've had ebook retailers close, multiple times. It's my own responsibility to back up my own files and that is what I do. The day Amazon, or any ebook retailer, stops me doing that is the day I stop buying from them after all Fan fiction is free and I don't have to spend money buying that.

I can't say I disagree, and I too have little faith or none in big companies, so I do all I need to, to ensure future happiness and security.

That said, when something happens, I believe in going through the right channels and steps to fix things. How else can things improve if one doesn't do that. These companies get away with enough as it is, and I trust them about as far as I can dribble ... saliva, not a basketball.

And this is the day and age, when where a company misbehaves, you tell the world. That can be a good thing in several ways.

[Cinisajoy]

Oh can I guess that the first 3 were so good that you really wants to know what happens?

[issybird]

A personal attack has been deleted. Please remember to limit comments to the post and not the poster.

[Timboli]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

I also thought we were talking big money on the refunds but it appears to be less than $10.

It isn't about the money, never has been really. It is about the principle, their need to fix something that is wrong, an error, that is impacting me, their good customer.

Me, I am big on Justice and Fair Play.

And I am against Bureaucracy when it becomes too big and inflexible.

When you engage in an agreement with a company, which is what I did when I bought my Kindles from Amazon, there is a certain expectation, above the unreadable regulations etc that no-one reads. That expectation is Fair Play and Honesty, plus Respect and Ethical behavior. I believe in enforcing that rigorously.