Toronto-based e-reader Kobo lays off 63 people

[Solicitous]

Originally Posted by oj829

Then came the Arc which was not competitively priced, and as we all know now, was a black hole of support neediness with a crashing launcher and whatnot. (I love my original Arc, and still use it several times a week, but I personally opined to an indie bookstore owner that he should not even think about selling them, given the retail terms, the glut of 7" wonders on the market, and the caprice of consumers when it comes to simple things like not proving an SDcard slot.)

The Arc was a funny device (well it started with the Vox) when it was released. I never saw exactly what its purpose or intended audience was. Ok funky tapestries but that is about it. What irked me beyond all belief was Kobo released their Android tablets, but the Kobo Android App is so far behind the iOS one it is beyond all reason. Simple features still don't exist such as basic justified (left, center etc) which has been in the iOS version since as far back as I can remember. They sold their flagship android tablet with a substandard reading app. As a consumer why buy one? Could buy a far better supported android tablet...or buy an ipad with a better Kobo app.

Originally Posted by davidfor

Which shops? I've seen all the Kobo e-ink devices in any JB HiFi I have been in. And they have at least one of the Android based devices, but I can't think of which. OfficeWorks always had the Touch and the Glo. They used to have the Mini but I don't think they had the later devices. I don't think I've been in a Harvey Norman since the Aura was released, but they did have all the older devices when I was there.

Online, both Bookworld and A&R seem to list all the devices, both e-ink and Android.

Bookworld and A&R have only recently had the new devices up for sale. Harvey Norman I have only seen the Touch/Glo/Mini (no tablets, Aura or Aura HD). Collins Books don't have any of the new devices. Havent been into a JBHiFi to know but last check the only Aura was pink. I would have thought that a retail partner would have all current generation devices in stock (or available).

But the Kindle PW and PW2 gets released, DSE and BIGW advertise weeks before hand accepting pre-orders. Can walk into any of those stores and there they are. Next Kindle to be released you can bet they'll be advertised. New Kobo gets released and unless one read the forums/news, partner advertising certainly wont inform anyone.

[booklover6]

Originally Posted by ballfresno

So much negativity here. Pity. I love my Kobo devices. Enough said: back to reading on my Kobo...

I couldn't agree more! I find my Kobo(s) to be 100% more satisfactory than any Kindle.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by John F

In the U.S. ...

I thought with the settlement, for the next couple of years, retailers could discount "agency" books, they just can't have an overall loss for a particular publisher.

They can discount BPH titles if they choose to because there can be no agency agreements for a few years.

But discounting does not equal selling below cost. Two separate things...

In the wholesale model the publisher sets a list price and negotiates a retailer cost, usually equal to 50-60% of list. The retailer then sets the consumer price at whatever markup they choose and the difference between their price and the list price is the discount. So, if Kobo gets a book at 50% of list, they could discount it 45% and still be making a profit. More importantly, they could adjust prices at will so they can put it on sale for a day or two, maybe in a themed deal focused on sparkly vampire books or baseball books during spring training, etc.

In other words, they do more than list books and hope somebody buys them. It does, however, require the retailer to actually know how to retail.

One of the most powerful discount mechanisms I've ever seen was Fictionwise's micropay rebates; you bought a book and got a variable rebate credit good for your *next* purchase. So buying books from them incentivized you to return and buy more from them. Agency killed that along with other clever marketing tactics, all in the service of making consumers pay more.

[Barty]

I wish somebody who know what they're doing would get into the ereader business. Amazon cannot be it.

Maybe the market only supports one dedicated ereader platform (in the u.s. anyway). Too bad, really.

[kellynj]

I've been more & more discouraged with the market. As someone that loathes Amazon & purchased from Sony for years, there really aren't any options but Kobo. I just had a conversation with a Kobo rep about my Sony transfers & he was astonished at my volume of books (it's just over 1000). That he mentioned my account caused some lag on his system doesn't encourage me thinking Kobo can handle the type of volume I want to have.

Switching to a tablet hasn't worked (the best battery is simply useless), but the software is so clunky and unmanageable I don't know what to do.

I want a dedicated ereader that lets me manage my collections & place books in the order I want them in, that lets me hangle overall management from my desktop, that I can load 3-4K in books on without freezing the reader for hours and that I can READ on. WHY is this so difficult for these companies?

[ProfCrash]

Because you, and many Mobile Read posters, are outliers. Most people in the US barely read a book a year. I am assuming that my Mother is deemed a heavy reader and she buys about 2 books a month for her Kindle.

E Readers, like pretty much everything, are built for the median user not the extreem users. The median user needs enough memory for 10-30 books a year and probably does not store them all on their device. They need something that they can read on for 30 minutes to an hour a day without having to recharge. They don't care about storage options, adjusting fonts, adjusting margins and the like. They want to buy a book, change the font size, read it in bed, and fall asleep.

To build an e reader that would make the extreem reader, which probably 25% of mobile read users are, would require a faster processor, extra memory, additional firm ware development, additional support, an sd card slot, and speakers. All of which mean an e reader that is more expensive then what is on the market today. There are not enough extreem users to justify making such a device so it doesn't exist.

I appreciate the passion that folks have for books on this site, I just wish that people could see that they really are the minority. Check out some of the smaller companies that make e readers that are more customizable. I know they are more expensive but they probably will fit your needs better then Amazon, Kobo, or Sony.

[Ladyrixx]

What would be nice would be if they do something like the custom phone that I want to say Google is working on. The "base" eReader would have the "normal" features, but for people like us, we could get different modules for all the bells and whistles that we would want. I could care less about speakers, but more storage would be nice.

The one thing that I miss, my old EZ Reader I could put my books in folders, and the reader could see them. I really, really miss that, and physical page turn buttons, otherwise I love my Aura.

[Snow Sciles]

Barty and kellynj, I agree with your sentiments. There's so much scope for ereaders, but it seems these companies have become distracted by tablets and other things. It seems the ereader itself is secondary. It's frustrating.

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Because you, and many Mobile Read posters, are outliers. Most people in the US barely read a book a year. I am assuming that my Mother is deemed a heavy reader and she buys about 2 books a month for her Kindle.

E Readers, like pretty much everything, are built for the median user not the extreem users.

I would have thought keen readers are the ereaders' core audience, as that's what it is, a dedicated reader! It's akin to the playstation or xbox, and it's my understanding that those technologies cater to the keen gamer, or a least above median.

But I take your point. I guess this is why many companies started making tablets. In the long run, that's where the true median readers will be imo, and that's what they're chasing. Imo, the ereader should be for the keen reader, while the tablet for the casual reader.

[latepaul]

It's not so much that they're catering for the median user as they are trying to make the cheapest device they can get away with and still have people buy it. They make money selling the content so they cut the device costs down as much as possible. The fact that even casual readers tend to buy more ebooks than paper books (which was partly novelty but by now is mostly the ease with which it's done) means that you can afford to piss off the heavy readers a little.

This may change as the market shifts again and people scale back their buying more in line with their actual reading. At which point ereaders may become a profitable niche and we might start to see some of these features added again. But whilst Amazon are selling Kindles as cheaply as they are that's unlikely to happen I feel.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by latepaul

This may change as the market shifts again and people scale back their buying more in line with their actual reading. At which point ereaders may become a profitable niche and we might start to see some of these features added again.

Possible.
But if the volume drops that low, don't expect the pricing to stay at "cheap kindle" levels.
Feature-rich, low-volume readers never went away; you can buy them now... at double or triple the costof a cheap kindle.

Good--cheap--feature rich: pick two of three.

[Lady Stardust]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Possible.
But if the volume drops that low, don't expect the pricing to stay at "cheap kindle" levels.
Feature-rich, low-volume readers never went away; you can buy them now... at double or triple the costof a cheap kindle.

Good--cheap--feature rich: pick two of three.

Could you advise on eink touch reader (cost doesn't matter) with software as good as Kindle (meaning not like Kobo), good speed and responsiveness, light, excellent highlighting (doesn't have to be better than Kindle, but not like Kobo), and as good dictionary as Kindle's? Good customer support would be great, if all the above exists. Without card slot is fine.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Lady Stardust

Could you advise on eink touch reader (cost doesn't matter) with software as good as Kindle (meaning not like Kobo), good speed and responsiveness, light, excellent highlighting (doesn't have to be better than Kindle, but not like Kobo), and as good dictionary as Kindle's? Good customer support would be great, if all the above exists. Without card slot is fine.

I haven't bought a new POCKETBOOK reader in a couple years but their firmware used to be very flexible (and hackable) and more stable than average. Some Onyx models also get good comments. Check the appropriate forums here.
User support will depend on locale and the retailer.

Onyx is supposed to be working on an android 4.x eink reader that promises access to all the well-rated android reading apps.

[grumbles]

Keep in mind that the Agency Model remains alive and well in Canada. I think (but am uncertain) that the federal government is going to look at the issue real soon now.

Kobo had (has?) some attractive hardware with absolutely abysmal firmware. For the moment we will continue with our Sony 505, 300, 350, 650, T1, T2 and T3. My next reader will be a general purpose Android tablet.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by grumbles

Keep in mind that the Agency Model remains alive and well in Canada. I think (but am uncertain) that the federal government is going to look at the issue real soon now.

It was found to be illegal and the publishers agreed go abandon it but Kobo protested they could not compete without it and got a temporary extension. They will likely secure longer term protection eventually. Canada is very protective of companies trafficking in "culture".

[ProfCrash]

Originally Posted by Snow Sciles

Barty and kellynj, I agree with your sentiments. There's so much scope for ereaders, but it seems these companies have become distracted by tablets and other things. It seems the ereader itself is secondary. It's frustrating.



I would have thought keen readers are the ereaders' core audience, as that's what it is, a dedicated reader! It's akin to the playstation or xbox, and it's my understanding that those technologies cater to the keen gamer, or a least above median.

But I take your point. I guess this is why many companies started making tablets. In the long run, that's where the true median readers will be imo, and that's what they're chasing. Imo, the ereader should be for the keen reader, while the tablet for the casual reader.

They can charge an insane amount of money for those machines and games because people will pay that money. And even if the XBox or Playstation are made for the more serious gamer, there are probably more serious gamers in the US then serious readers so there is more money to be made on that crowd then there are extreem readers.

Heck, we bought a Playstation because it wasn't that much more expensive then a Blue Ray player at the time and we like to play games. The XBox, Wii, and Playstation have gone pretty much untouched since our son was born almost two years ago, but we have them all. Before Little Man was born, my husband played an hour or so every day and I used the Wii. Not exactly extreeme gaming by any standard.

The difference between the Wii and the other systems is that the Wii caters more to families, kids, and people who don't want to play first person shooter type games. You can find some of those types of games (Sonic, sports, and the like) for the other systems but the Wii was the one to bring in the bowling, tennis, and the like that so many people enjoyed. It was a little less expensive, had a different type of game, and was a hit for people who didn't want to blow stuff up all the time. There was a large enough market that XBox and PLaystation finally jumped into that market as well and have eaten into the Wii market.

Back to e readers...

E readers are pretty cheap to make and I honestly don't think that there is a large enough market to sustain the type of customaization you are talking about. Sony's e reader business took a huge hit when the Kindle came on the market and was about $50 less then the Sony. As that price difference grew, Sony's business shrunk. It helped that Amazon actually advertised and was able to get on Oprah's favorite things list but anyone who did research on e readers saw that the Kindle was less expensive.

The original Kindle had an SD Card slot and speakers. The SD Card slot caused enough problems that Amazon got rid of it (at least that is my theory based on the number of problems I saw posted about indexing and issues around the use of cards). The K2, without a card slot, was less expensive then the K1 and about $100 less expensive then the Sony and had a wait list. So I think Amazon figured out that demand was high enough without a card slot that caused problems and increased customer service calls.

Building customaizable solutions for what is, I am guessing, less then 5% of an already niche market is not going to be profitable. The few attempts at making niche e readers, the DX and 5 inch screens, ended a while back. Kobo doesn't seem to want to put money into hiring people to make the firm ware that allows for a ton of customization to be stable enough that it doesn't cause the problems it does now.

As much as we hate it, e readers are a niche market that does not make the makers moeny. It is the sale of the books that makes them moeny. So the companies are not going to cater to a small minority in a niche market. We simply do not bring the money that gamers bring to the table so we don't fully matter. If we did, the e reader market would look very different then it does today.