Windows 8 Metro: No Flash - Page 3

elcreative · 09-17-2011, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben Thornton

Given that the release of Windows 8 is a year away (according to what I've read), I don't think that we can be certain of what is in or out.

It sounds like they will have the full desktop OS available at least on Intel systems, and a more tablet oriented experience across the board. It seems ironic to me that they are saying that this isn't becoming a "post PC era" while at the same time planning to make their PC interface of over 20 years' standing into a kind of compatibility mode, while the front end becomes a finger friendly, tablet style interface.

It could be a stroke of genius. If they had delivered a separate metro-like interface on tablets alone, they may have been too late to compete with android/iOS. By making the same apps work on their tablets and desktops through the metro interface, they have the potential to offer developers access to a massive installed desktop/laptop user base as well as a fledgling tablet market. So, it will be interesting to see what happens.

Actually MS have said that you will need differing versions of apps to work on differing processors so ARM support doesn't mean Intel Office will work etc. and it's MS who've said they're not supporting Flash... and I think that Win 8 is being released by MS so they may know what they're talking about...

kennyc · 09-17-2011, 10:19 AM

Well, Harry clearly has an opinion on it. Let's review. I said

Flash is still and may continue to be an necessary part of web browsing and media downloading.

Will it always be? Who knows, the future is uncertain, eat dessert first!

This undeniably TRUE. It is not speculation, it is not an opinion, it is true. There are websites and downloads that REQUIRE flash. End of story.

And Continuing Will it always be? Who Knows.

That's not an opinion either, it's a statement of fact.

Harry is WRONG. He was wrong in his initial accusation and he's still wrong. Start a poll if you like, but the statement I made is true, it is not opinion I don't care how many time Harry continues to repeat it.

kennyc · 09-17-2011, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben Thornton

.
Why are you so vehement about it being a fact? Surely we don't disagree about the underlying facts (i.e. that some sites require flash, some not, some people are bothered by that, some not). ...
/

It has nothing to do with iPad you brought that up. The reason I care is that Harry accused me of stating an opinion -- implying that my statement was not true. I vehemently disagree and you do to apparently because of the above. Clearly there are sites that require flash thus it's a necessary part of web browsing (if you want to see those sites). I addition it is damned wide-spread.

Again, will it be in the future, I don't know, you don't know.

HarryT · 09-17-2011, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kennyc

Well, Harry clearly has an opinion on it. Let's review. I said

Flash is still and may continue to be an necessary part of web browsing and media downloading.

Will it always be? Who knows, the future is uncertain, eat dessert first!

This undeniably TRUE. It is not speculation, it is not an opinion, it is true. There are websites and downloads that REQUIRE flash. End of story.

The statement "there are websites that require Flash" is certainly true, but that's very different to saying "Flash is ... a necessary part of web browsing". It is (self-evidently) only necessary if you want to view those view sites which use Flash and don't provide a non-Flash alternate.

One could equally well say "Microsoft Silverlight is a necessary part of web browsing", since there are also sites which use Silverlight, and can't be viewed without it.

None of these web content application framework clients is "a necessary part of web browsing"; one can perfectly happily browse the web without them. They are only "necessary" for people who need to view sites which rely on them.

So yes, I reject your statement as an (erroneous, IMHO) opinion.

kennyc · 09-17-2011, 11:19 AM

And I reject your opinion on my statement as erroneous.

Now can we get back to the topic at hand.

HarryT · 09-17-2011, 11:21 AM

We are discussing the topic at hand: whether or not the lack of Flash support in Windows 8 is significant.

kennyc · 09-17-2011, 11:23 AM

Not really, you were discussion opinions and statements and meanings of words like "necessary"

You wanna discuss that for a while?

Dylrob · 09-17-2011, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thebestjeter

There will be only one version of Windows 8. There is not such thing as Windows 8 tablet. Windows 8 is an integrated system, metro and desktop at the same time.

Guess again.

TimW · 09-17-2011, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

We are discussing the topic at hand: whether or not the lack of Flash support in Windows 8 is significant.

Windows 8 will support flash, just not on the Metro side...according to Engadget.

HarryT · 09-17-2011, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimW

Windows 8 will support flash, just not on the Metro side...according to Engadget.

Thank you for the clarification.

elcreative · 09-17-2011, 11:45 AM

Actually, as the original poster in this thread, it was a comment on the incredible bias of certain users of this forum and the net against Apple... and my original thoughts have been borne out in that, despite MS doing the same as Apple with their Metro on tablets and going without Flash, there has been no rush of condemnation like Apple received but a whole series of "rationalisations" & "excuses"as to how MS are perfectly reasonable for doing this as opposed to nasty Apple doing it...

And as far as the Flash battle now going on is concerned, I find HarryT to be more on target than kennyc... personally, if I find a site has to have Flash to use it then I prefer to use another site... Flash activities have caused more problems with crashes than almost anything else regardless of platform... I'm tired of fixing up systems where they demand that you install the latest Flash when it's already installed...

And before the MS/Win "fanbois" start accusing me of being an "Apple cultist" note that I an platform neutral using various Windows, Unix, Apple and various Androids as appropriate for my needs at the time... but I have wanted a good excuse to return the "fanbois"comment to the normally rude and rabid users. Platforms are irrelevant... I use desktop and laptop computers, tablets etc to do things not for the sake of the platform...

Also, why all the people keen to point out that this applies to Metro... are you only semi-literate or just glance at a thread title without reading the 1st post??? I said, in the original post, that this applied to Metro...

HarryT · 09-17-2011, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elcreative

Actually, as the original poster in this thread, it was a comment on the incredible bias of certain users of this forum and the net against Apple... and my original thoughts have been borne out in that, despite MS doing the same as Apple with their Metro on tablets and going without Flash, there has been no rush of condemnation like Apple received but a whole series of "rationalisations" & "excuses"as to how MS are perfectly reasonable for doing this as opposed to nasty Apple doing it...

Presumably MS would want to encourage the use of Silverlight, not Flash. I'd be surprised if there wasn't a Silverlight client in Win 8 Metro.

Dylrob · 09-17-2011, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Presumably MS would want to encourage the use of Silverlight, not Flash. I'd be surprised if there wasn't a Silverlight client in Win 8 Metro.

The metro version of IE is said to be completely plug-in free. That would suggest no Silverlight either.

HarryT · 09-17-2011, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylrob

The metro version of IE is said to be completely plug-in free. That would suggest no Silverlight either.

Thank you - I'm both surprised and pleased to hear that. The sooner both Flash and Silverlight are replaced by HTML5 the better.

Ben Thornton · 09-17-2011, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kennyc

There are websites and downloads that REQUIRE flash.

That certainly is true - but your original statement was more broadly phrased. Still not sure why there's any contention here, really.

On topic, I think that the anti-MS brigade can be just as rabid as the anti-Apple faction. Personally, I've found Apple's restrictions and control-freakery to be occasionally irritating, but on balance a positive thing.

09-17-2011, 11:45 AM	#41
elcreative Wizard Posts: 2,888 Karma: 5875940 Join Date: Dec 2007 Device: PRS505, 600, 350, 650, Nexus 7, Note III, iPad 4 etc	Actually, as the original poster in this thread, it was a comment on the incredible bias of certain users of this forum and the net against Apple... and my original thoughts have been borne out in that, despite MS doing the same as Apple with their Metro on tablets and going without Flash, there has been no rush of condemnation like Apple received but a whole series of "rationalisations" & "excuses"as to how MS are perfectly reasonable for doing this as opposed to nasty Apple doing it... And as far as the Flash battle now going on is concerned, I find HarryT to be more on target than kennyc... personally, if I find a site has to have Flash to use it then I prefer to use another site... Flash activities have caused more problems with crashes than almost anything else regardless of platform... I'm tired of fixing up systems where they demand that you install the latest Flash when it's already installed... And before the MS/Win "fanbois" start accusing me of being an "Apple cultist" note that I an platform neutral using various Windows, Unix, Apple and various Androids as appropriate for my needs at the time... but I have wanted a good excuse to return the "fanbois"comment to the normally rude and rabid users. Platforms are irrelevant... I use desktop and laptop computers, tablets etc to do things not for the sake of the platform... Also, why all the people keen to point out that this applies to Metro... are you only semi-literate or just glance at a thread title without reading the 1st post??? I said, in the original post, that this applied to Metro... Last edited by elcreative; 09-17-2011 at 11:49 AM.

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09-17-2011, 10:19 AM	#32
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,904 Karma: 119230421 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	Well, Harry clearly has an opinion on it. Let's review. I said Flash is still and may continue to be an necessary part of web browsing and media downloading. Will it always be? Who knows, the future is uncertain, eat dessert first! This undeniably TRUE. It is not speculation, it is not an opinion, it is true. There are websites and downloads that REQUIRE flash. End of story. And Continuing Will it always be? Who Knows. That's not an opinion either, it's a statement of fact. Harry is WRONG. He was wrong in his initial accusation and he's still wrong. Start a poll if you like, but the statement I made is true, it is not opinion I don't care how many time Harry continues to repeat it.

09-17-2011, 11:19 AM	#35
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,904 Karma: 119230421 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	And I reject your opinion on my statement as erroneous. Now can we get back to the topic at hand.

09-17-2011, 11:21 AM	#36
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,549 Karma: 93383099 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	We are discussing the topic at hand: whether or not the lack of Flash support in Windows 8 is significant.

09-17-2011, 11:23 AM	#37
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,904 Karma: 119230421 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	Not really, you were discussion opinions and statements and meanings of words like "necessary" You wanna discuss that for a while?

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