Amazon Kindle and DRM Removal... - Page 3

ProfCrash · 02-22-2011, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shorttimer1

I recently read that Amazon made a statement that they would NOT delete ANY books on anybody's Kindle in the future. I think this decision was from the fallout of the deleted George Orwell books.

The Harry Potter mess was after the Orwell mess. An email was sent to the people who had bought the Harry Potter books asking the buyers for permission to remove the books. I believe that the folks who had bought them were given a gift certificate to purchase another book in its stead. At the very least they were refunded their money.

People who said they wanted to keep the books were aboe to do so.

Most folks returned the books willingly because the formatting was awful.

This is based on my memory of the event and posts made at Kindle Boards about the books. They were put up for sale through the publish your own work option and were disgustingly cheap, which was a huge tip off that they were not legit. That didn't stop people from downloading them like mad.

JSWolf · 02-22-2011, 11:22 AM

If Amazon started removing eBooks from people's Kindles because the DRM was removed, they would lose business left and right and people would flock over to Sony to buy a reader without wifi or 3G. Amazon would have to leave the eBook world in shame.

FF2 · 02-22-2011, 11:37 AM

I guess I would PREFER if Amazon did not know more about me but until someone provides an easy hack to disable "ET calling home" or one that allows erasing of the log (or whatever info is collected) I guess I will live with it.

I do wonder - if wireless if off, how big or long is the log file that the kindle stores/creates. Will it just keep appending and growing until sent to Amazon when someone finally turns wireless back on? Or will it eventually overwrite itself?

I do wish I knew more about linux and felt comfortable getting to the "hidden partition" (or whatever it is) and could find/delete such info.

abookreader · 02-22-2011, 01:59 PM

A hack that would erase that log file would be wonderful.

FF2 · 02-22-2011, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abookreader

A hack that would erase that log file would be wonderful.

In the 3.1 jailbreak thread in the developer forum, I inquired if the programmer might be able to do such a thing. Maybe we should create a thread over there asking for this very thing.

markbot · 02-22-2011, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

Any laws broken (or not) would depend on where you live, but removing DRM is certainly against the terms of use for both Amazon's website and the Kindle (in both its hardware and software forms).

The Harry Potter story sounds like an urban myth to me, but I think anyone emailing pirate books through Amazon is plain daft anyway.

Also, in the US I believe the Digital Millennium Copyright Act makes it illegal to circumvent DRM even if there is no copyright violation.

cybmole · 02-23-2011, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markbot

Also, in the US I believe the Digital Millennium Copyright Act makes it illegal to circumvent DRM even if there is no copyright violation.

i don't live in the USA, I don't care about "their" laws.

I look in a purchased kindle book & fail to see any legalese saying that I cannot strip the DRM from it. & I don't recall ever signing such an undertaking before being allowed to buy either my Kindle or my Kindle books.

cybmole · 02-23-2011, 10:52 AM

[QUOTE=JeremyR;1408027, I'm sure millions of people have scanned in and OCRed their own HP books.

[/QUOTE]

HP sell books ???

mr ploppy · 02-23-2011, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cybmole

i don't live in the USA, I don't care about "their" laws.

I look in a purchased kindle book & fail to see any legalese saying that I cannot strip the DRM from it. & I don't recall ever signing such an undertaking before being allowed to buy either my Kindle or my Kindle books.

It's in the terms of use that you agreed to abide by when you ticked the box saying you agreed to them when you created your Amazon account, downloaded the program or registered your Kindle. Whether you read them or not doesn't really make them any less binding.

FF2 · 02-23-2011, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

It's in the terms of use that you agreed to abide by when you ticked the box saying you agreed to them when you created your Amazon account, downloaded the program or registered your Kindle. Whether you read them or not doesn't really make them any less binding.

I do have a feeling that "ticking a box" on a computer screen without some form of unhackable identification will be pretty meaningless in a courtroom but I could be wrong.

What if someone else buys you the kindle and buys you the books. Who ticks off what and who is bound, if anyone is bound?

And then if the person who asked the question about "what is in the books" is outside of the US or other direct places Amazon might be located - good luck serving and suing them.

chyron8472 · 02-23-2011, 01:07 PM

I tire of constant reminders about how illegal removing DRM is from people who seem to indicate that the letter of the law is absolute and that the spirit behind it should never be questioned.

If I buy The Hobbit from Amazon (which I did) and it comes without chapter markers (which it didn't) I'm sure as hell going to fix the ebook so that it has them. If I have to break the DRM to do it, then so be it.

mr ploppy · 02-23-2011, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FF2

I do have a feeling that "ticking a box" on a computer screen without some form of unhackable identification will be pretty meaningless in a courtroom but I could be wrong.

Amazon wouldn't need a courtroom to ban you from using their services any more than any other business would. Not that I think they would, but presumably they are gathering information about DRM status for some reason.

LibertyToad · 02-23-2011, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryinOCMD

Maybe a silly question, but I'm just wondering if Amazon knows (or really cares) if you have DRM-Removed content on your Kindle? Just curious...

I have books that I've scanned personally and put on it. My books, my device, not theirs. People need to start standing up for their rights....

LibertyToad · 02-23-2011, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by montalex

Or they are just waiting until a certain critical mass is reached, and they will then send a self-destruct signal to all scofflaw Kindle owners...

I doubt that, that would be illegal. You can't just destroy something someone bought just because you don't like what they have on it or how they are using it.

Alisa · 02-24-2011, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LibertyToad

I doubt that, that would be illegal. You can't just destroy something someone bought just because you don't like what they have on it or how they are using it.

Yep. The worst they, or the publishers, could do is civil action which wouldn't be very worthwhile. Unless they can demonstrate that you redistributed books, they can't argue that you caused much damage. They may suspend your account I suppose, but even that would be a PR nightmare. If they were tracking your non-Amazon documents on your device and people found out, it would be an unwelcome scandal. So while they have the technical ability to do these things, reason dictates it would be pretty foolish. They just don't stand to gain that much.

02-23-2011, 01:07 PM	#41
chyron8472 Groupie Posts: 180 Karma: 558490 Join Date: Jan 2011 Device: Kindle 5, Amazon Fire 5th Gen, Moto Z Play Droid	I tire of constant reminders about how illegal removing DRM is from people who seem to indicate that the letter of the law is absolute and that the spirit behind it should never be questioned. If I buy The Hobbit from Amazon (which I did) and it comes without chapter markers (which it didn't) I'm sure as hell going to fix the ebook so that it has them. If I have to break the DRM to do it, then so be it. Last edited by chyron8472; 02-23-2011 at 01:09 PM.

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02-22-2011, 11:22 AM	#32
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 79,798 Karma: 146391129 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	If Amazon started removing eBooks from people's Kindles because the DRM was removed, they would lose business left and right and people would flock over to Sony to buy a reader without wifi or 3G. Amazon would have to leave the eBook world in shame.

02-22-2011, 11:37 AM	#33
FF2 Wizard Posts: 1,105 Karma: 1025784 Join Date: Oct 2010 Device: WiFi Kindle3	I guess I would PREFER if Amazon did not know more about me but until someone provides an easy hack to disable "ET calling home" or one that allows erasing of the log (or whatever info is collected) I guess I will live with it. I do wonder - if wireless if off, how big or long is the log file that the kindle stores/creates. Will it just keep appending and growing until sent to Amazon when someone finally turns wireless back on? Or will it eventually overwrite itself? I do wish I knew more about linux and felt comfortable getting to the "hidden partition" (or whatever it is) and could find/delete such info.

02-22-2011, 01:59 PM	#34
abookreader Wizard Posts: 1,516 Karma: 2567610 Join Date: Oct 2009 Device: Kindles - Keyboard, Fire, 2-US, iPhone, iPAD	A hack that would erase that log file would be wonderful.

02-23-2011, 10:52 AM	#38
cybmole Wizard Posts: 3,720 Karma: 1759970 Join Date: Sep 2010 Device: none	[QUOTE=JeremyR;1408027, I'm sure millions of people have scanned in and OCRed their own HP books. [/QUOTE] HP sell books ???

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