Going Rogue

[desertgrandma]

Originally Posted by kennyc

It actually pre-dates that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_a...s_a_free_lunch

well, excuuuuuuse me!

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

What if the government pitches the bill of rights out of the window. Don't say impossible. The 10th amendment is basically dead letter....

Certainly that is possible and that is why the 2nd amendment is there. To allow the people to correct the problem, by force if necessary.

The government only exists a the behest of the people.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

well, excuuuuuuse me!

No! No! Not the STICK!

[desertgrandma]

Originally Posted by kennyc

Certainly that is possible and that is why the 2nd amendment is there. To allow the people to correct the problem, by force if necessary.

The government only exists a the behest of the people.

Yes, but the point is to keep things from getting that point to begin with.....right?

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

oh come on now... quit being so picky! Heinlein popularized it in literature

Certainly true. Just wanna make sure we stick to the facts here.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

the need is HUGE Right now! OBGYNs and regular GPs are fleeing private practice due to huge malpractice costs! they cannot afford to stay in practice which is so sad! in my case my Doc(s) are a married couple, he is the DOCTOR, and she is the ARNP. works very well!

See. Just one more piece that needs some fixin'

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Yes, but the point is to keep things from getting that point to begin with.....right?

Absolutely! No one wants to overthrow the government by force, but it has to be there as a final option. Them's was very smart and experienced men that set this all up.

[desertgrandma]

Originally Posted by kennyc

Absolutely! No one wants to overthrow the government by force, but it has to be there as a final option. Them's was very smart and experienced men that set this all up.

What........those White European males so many are up in arms about?

[Spartacus2112]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

16% of the people in the US are uninsured. I would guess 99% would like to see the cost of health care decline.

BOb

more like 100.

[kazbates]

Originally Posted by pilotbob

That is actually a good point... and I think it would be one way to bring costs down... and actually allow Drs to make more money. We should get used to seeing health car professionals that are less trained or perhaps Drs in training. Sort of how the hospital has Interns, which are taught and supervised by Residents which are taught and supervised by Attendings, which are taught and supervised by chiefs and or peers.

Why does that only happen in the hospital. A Drs practice could perhaps have two or three Nurse Practitioners supervised by Physicians assistants, supervised by a single Dr. It would cost less money to see a Nurse, then a bit more to see the Assistant, then more to see the Dr. Generally there would be a reporting hierarcy just like you have in any other business. The CEO doesn't do all the work. He has VPs, which have managers. Etc.

This would be a good way to:

1. Keep costs down because you don't have to see the Dr every time.

2. Allow for a bigger pool of health care professionals. I think more people would get into health care if they didn't see the long Pre-Med, Med School, Residency ahead of them.

Bottom line, there are lots of ideas I think. We just do it the way we do it because of tradition.

BOb

My doctor's office does have Nurse Practitioners and I like to see them when I have a problem like a sinus infection, bronchitis, whatever. They take more time and talk to me to find out what's going on. I see my doctor for my yearly physical, but for the rest, a nurse is fine with me. Of course, I'm pretty healthy (even for an overweight person) and my mom was a nurse, so I tend to be a bit biased.

[kindlekitten]

Originally Posted by kennyc

Certainly that is possible and that is why the 2nd amendment is there. To allow the people to correct the problem, by force if necessary.

The government only exists a the behest of the people.

indeed

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Yes, but the point is to keep things from getting that point to begin with.....right?

just call it the National Insurance Clause

Originally Posted by kennyc

Certainly true. Just wanna make sure we stick to the facts here.

not sure if I can grasp the facts without a liberal translation by Tina Fey

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

What........those White European males so many are up in arms about?

Could be....

[Ea]

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

....

Kindlekitten; I think it would be much easier to answer your posts if you didn't write answers within the quotes - please write outside them. But you stated (in orange):
"I couldn't tell you, I've never gotten anything for free. I don't understand welfare mentality, welfare families or anything remotely resembling that status."
Do you know that I have never gotten anything for free either even if I live in a welfare state? "welfare family"... eugh!

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

Ea, I don't think we have enough common concepts to communicate the view effectively. Neither your fault or mine. (The term you were seeking in English is "scattershot", at least that is one term for it. There are many, many, similar words in English.) I guess I'll have to ask some Socratic questions.

Have you every seen a person deliberately hurt another person?

Have you ever seen another person deliberately take advantage of another person?

Um, I have once experienced someone deliberately hurt someone. I don't think you mean 'seeing'? It doesn't seem to cover all possibilities.

I can't say if I have experienced someone taking advantage of someone. I am being quite honest, but I don't think so. I can't remember or I don't know.

I do have a neurological condition, which makes it more difficult for me to recognise other people's feelings - not that I don't know they are there - it's like they're less visible than to most people. It might have hindered me in this case. It might hinder me in understanding you. I am not sure.

BTW, the term 'scattershot' matches what I was searching for. One reason I didn't feel they worked as arguments were that some issues you mentioned are reality to me, some I didn't get at all, and some where 'so what'. Too scattershot to form the basis of a common idea in my mind - that is, I wasn't sure what you were saying with the examples.

[Ea]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

What........those White European males so many are up in arms about?

What joke is it that I'm not getting?

[kindlekitten]

Originally Posted by Ea

Kindlekitten; I think it would be much easier to answer your posts if you didn't write answers within the quotes - please write outside them. But you stated (in orange):
"I couldn't tell you, I've never gotten anything for free. I don't understand welfare mentality, welfare families or anything remotely resembling that status."
Do you know that I have never gotten anything for free either even if I live in a welfare state? "welfare family"... eugh!


.

sorry, I do that to focus on specific statements that I want to comment on.

so, we seem to have gone into a loop on people regarding people getting things for free