Dual firmware announcement

[Snuffi]

Originally Posted by Godzil

But why do you think theses bugs are related ? Maybe bookeen try something on that firmware update that totaly failed on the power managment but are totaly not related with buttons.

And explain me a thing, How can you poll a key when your device is sleeping and the only way to get wake the device is to generate an interrupt?

Since all eInk device stay for the majority of time in (deep) sleep mode, explain me how you will poll a key when the CPU is off

You are right, of course it *could* be two unrelated bugs. It's just that polling would be a fitting explanation for the symptoms (missing *a lot* of key presses like in the early FWs is hard to explain with an interrupt model plus the polling would also explain the battery drain) but it is not necessarily the only possible explanation.

Of course, polling is not possible when the device sleeps but as far as I know there is no sleep mode in the Cybook. If you refer to the On/Off button, that one obviously cannot be polled but for the rest of the buttons I see no problem. When you turn your Cybook on and leave it on without pressing any buttons it still uses battery and will eventually run empty. So there is, obviously, some code running at all times even if all unnecessary processes are shut off. I would think that that is the part of the code which does the polling and which - in turn - wakes up all the other functions as soon as it registers some user interaction.

I cannot talk about the majority of EInk devices because I haven't dealt with other devices in depth. I had to impression that all or most work like the Cybook which does not go into *deep* sleep (i.e. CPU off) but rather *light* sleep (if I may call it that) where the functions are reduced to a minimum and therefore only very little energy is consumed (althought there *is* still some energy consumed)

[tompe]

Originally Posted by Godzil

But why do you think theses bugs are related ? Maybe bookeen try something on that firmware update that totaly failed on the power managment but are totaly not related with buttons.

Well, then they would have been able to fix it. The first firmware update only had 2-3 days battery time. When people reported that they released an update that had 4 days battery time. That indicates that it was impossible to get back to 7 days and one possible reason is that the fixing of another bug made it impossible. I have a hard time coming up with another plausible reason.

[Godzil]

Originally Posted by Snuffi

but as far as I know there is no sleep mode in the Cybook.

So you know bad. The cybook and other devices are in sleep mode until you press a new button.


There is actually no device that go in deep sleep mode (ie CPU and RAM set to off) they all keep some informations in RAM. Of the Sony's PRS the only differences between the "off" and "wait" mode is the button that are disabled, and the screen that is blanked. But otherwise they are in the same mode, that what allow them to start "instantly" (or nearly)

Bookeen's use another approach, you completly turn off the Cybook when you press the power Button, that's why it need ~15s to start each times. They could set an "off" mode like the sony, but the battery duration will be shorter than when in off mode.

Tompe; And for the difference between the "old" and "new" battery life, do you try by yourself? I had a bunch of cybook at a time, and do some measurement when they sleep, and some have a slight difference consumption that could led to large differences of battery life, and they where all with the same firmware. I had a discution with some Bookeen's programmers during the latest RendezVous MobileRead and they explain me that for the firmware that cut battery life they try some new things about power management, but failed to test correctly it, and that led to the shorter battery life. They promptly remove that (non) feature. And now the battery life should be the same as before (for the same device)

[tompe]

Originally Posted by Godzil

Tompe; And for the difference between the "old" and "new" battery life, do you try by yourself? I had a bunch of cybook at a time, and do some measurement when they sleep, and some have a slight difference consumption that could led to large differences of battery life, and they where all with the same firmware. I had a discution with some Bookeen's programmers during the latest RendezVous MobileRead and they explain me that for the firmware that cut battery life they try some new things about power management, but failed to test correctly it, and that led to the shorter battery life. They promptly remove that (non) feature. And now the battery life should be the same as before (for the same device)

Well, it was not and I tested it myself with my VCybook and I tested it both before and after new firmwares. I later got a new Cybook since the first one broke and it had the same battery time as the one before.

So if they think they have fixed this problem they are wrong.

I have reported this problem but have not got any response. So they thought they had solved the problem but did not bother to tell the customers that had reported the problem so they could have got feedback telling them they were wrong. Oh, clever.

[Godzil]

The replacement you got is a 400Mhz one or a 200Mhz one ? If it's a 400Mhz don't expect exactly the same CPU duration.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by Godzil

The replacement you got is a 400Mhz one or a 200Mhz one ? If it's a 400Mhz don't expect exactly the same CPU duration.

I did the measurement on the old device also but I think it is a 200MHz.

[pieter]

Is this discussion about the question whether bookeen sold us buggy hardware or sold us buggy software?

They should make the software open source, maybe somebody else would fix things sooner than "soon". (yeah yeah "contracts" make this impossible... like I as a consumer care)

[peterbbb]

I think Bookeen have magically upgraded my Cybook with the latest firmware. It is a very light version. So light that there is no effect. But at least I can be pleased that I have had an upgrade.

Ok, so I am bored waiting...

[EowynCarter]

Neither. (Ah well, save for the ePub firmware..)

They should make the software open source, maybe somebody else would fix things sooner than "soon". (yeah yeah "contracts" make this impossible... like I as a consumer care)

Yeah, well, companies usually care about that thing call "LAW".
Though yeah, open source firmware would be cool.

[pieter]

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

Yeah, well, companies usually care about that thing call "LAW".

Since I'm not a company but a consumer I don't care in the sense that I expect companies to fix the problem with the "LAW" instead of just telling me "sorry, contracts blah blah blah... "

[roncri]

I'm looking for a new reader for a few reason. First of all I hate the button arrangement on they Cybook and have from the day I got it. Second I consider the Cybook to be a little to fragile, I've already had one screen "shatter" spontaneously and third it doesn't work when the temps get close to freezing. Waiting for the bus on a cold winter day I can read for about 10 minutes and then the unit will stop responding.

I also never said I was looking for a new reader for folder support, I said I'd upgrade the firmware if Bookeen ever got around to releasing a firmware with folder support so I'm not sure what you think is "stupid".

As for why I'll never purchase another product from Bookeen. It's because I have absolutely no faith in them, in my opinion, to properly support their existing customer base or hardware. It is painfully obvious that the reason we didn't get a firmware update earlier is because they shifted resources to the Opus. That is their decision to make and maybe it even makes business sense in the long term but they pretty much burnt the bridge behind them with a lot of their existing base.

Originally Posted by EowynCarter

Why would you go looking for an other reader ? Your cybook still works right ?
And it would be stupid to get a new reader just for folders now as the cybook will be updated for that.
Unless you have other reason for a change, don't waste you money

And once again "we will" , is to take "as things are now, that's what we want to do, and how we expect thing to go" , not a "we promise".
Don't take any word from any company as granted unless it's actually done. Who know what can go wrong.

[EowynCarter]

It is painfully obvious that the reason we didn't get a firmware update earlier is because they shifted resources to the Opus.

The opus took them some time, but firmwares for gen 3 and opus will be the sames

[Seventh Son]

The blogpost about the new FW to be released soon was a month ago (Aug 27). Anyone still hoping it will appear at all?

[K-Thom]

Sure it will appear. As sure as the sun goes up in the west and salmons are swimming downstream.

[EowynCarter]

Originally Posted by Seventh Son

The blogpost about the new FW to be released soon was a month ago (Aug 27). Anyone still hoping it will appear at all?

Yes. My opus and my gen3 run a version of that update. It's almost done, would be stupid from bookeen not to release it.