Just ordered the EXOPC Slate

[timezone]

Yes the GPS is out for now. I got the 64gb. I have GPS on my smartphone. For me it might have been a nice to have but unless you have a minivan or SUV I think it is overkill. The WeTab looks interesting but you have to hope enough developers write applications for it. From what you describe that may not be an issue. I hope all these devices are successful. It will mean lively competition which always helps the consumer.

I do think this will be serious competition to the eReaders. It should mean color will finally be around the corner and maybe they will improve the refresh rates

[harryE123]

Originally Posted by timezone

I call the Windows mobile 6.5 and the soon to be released Wndows phone 7 a partial OS as is Android and the iPhone OS. I am not calling Unix or the Mac a partial OS. I have worked with Unix and Linux at work and like those systems. Jail breaking while now considered legal by the courts will still be for the few and brave. It is closed because Apple decides what goes into the App store. To be fair the new Microsoft phone will have a store that will also be closed. On a Slate that is not a phone and a real computing device I don't want my arms tied. When Apple decides to come out with a Slate that is based on the Mac then they can call it a full computing device.

Certainly there are advantages and disadvantages to a light OS or full OS on these new devices. There are rumored Slate devices that may come out using the new Windows phone 7 OS. I would be critical of these Slate devices with a Win Phone 7 OS in them.

You don't get it. Os x, as any other desktop os, is not an os for mobile multitouch devices, it wasn't developed to be one. Ios is a paradigm shift, it's different os for a different device. It has the same unix kernel as os x, optimized for mobility, and an interface made specifically for touch based mobile devices. It's under no definition a light OS. Desktop os's can't go into multitouch mobile devices because they were developed for a mouse paradigm, that's why microsoft who could not (again) muster some vision for a new os for touch mobile devices has being so badly beaten.

Google managed to steal enough java code from sun and copy all the functionality and interface of iOS to come up with android. Which is by no way commendable, but it's something.

If you think that open computing means viruses, trojans, spyware an malware and with a desktop mouse oriented os be my guest and expect a windows 7 tablet.

As for open or closed, it's ludicrous to suggest that just because you can buy (or most often -not for you but in general- steal) a developers work independently from something other than an app store doesn't make the os any more open or closed. Apple's business idea of an app store has made people probably for the first time willing to spend money on apps because they find a unified interface where they can get them from. Apple makes a small cut, developers finally start making some money, consumers can have a simple way to view, chose and compare apps, and the system is safeguarded against all sorts of nasties and it remains as secure as possible too. Everyone is happy.

I ll quote Dan Dilger from roughly drafted, who said better than I could have:

Google controls what vendors and users can do with its "with Google" apps; Android phone makers control what users can do (and when they get OS updates, usually months after they're ready) and Android service providers control what users can do, what non-removable software is loaded, and so on. Your giddy fantasy that "Android=open" is delusional and tiresome.

And of course as a last resort users can legally jailbreak and do whatever the crap they want to with the devices. Apple hasn't stopped them and they won't. If they are so tech inclined that whatever the os offers or several hundred thousand apps offer don't suit them, then they it will be a piece of cake to jailbreak and do as they please. 10 year olds and soccer moms can jailbreak, it's hardly something hard for a techie.


Having said all that I don't mean to be a killjoy and of course you can like whatever you like and prefer whatever you prefer, provided that in the process you don't try to re-define what is open or closed, and what is or isn't an os going against logic. If you want a desktop os (like the ones that have doomed tablets for more than 10 years) with a mouse interface where you will use a stylus to click on menus created for mouses fair enough. Since you like it I am sure you 'll enjoy it.

[timezone]

We can go back and forth and things will never change. I do realize other desktop OS's are not for mobile devices. This Slate has the power to handle it and it does multitouch very well. Windows 7 was also built for multitouch. There are desktop monitors already that take advantage of it.

Apple has gone out of their way to stop the jailbreakers. Each upgrade has patches to shut them down. Also most people will not jailbreak their device so it is an issue.

The doomed tables of a devade ago didn't have a processor that can handle it. This Slate is multitouch. Sounds like you are living in the past.

[HamsterRage]

It's lightweight because it doesn't multi-task.

It's closed because the ONLY place you can buy apps is from the Apple store. What do you think "closed" means?

[timezone]

As for open or closed, it's ludicrous to suggest that just because you can buy (or most often -not for you but in general- steal) a developers work independently from something other than an app store doesn't make the os any more open or closed. Apple's business idea of an app store has made people probably for the first time willing to spend money on apps because they find a unified interface where they can get them from. Apple makes a small cut, developers finally start making some money, consumers can have a simple way to view, chose and compare apps, and the system is safeguarded against all sorts of nasties and it remains as secure as possible too. Everyone is happy.


It is closed if you can't buy an App you want if not found in the App Store. Hey. it will be the same issue with the new Windows phone. I am not attacking you. I am just as critical of Microsoft for some of the things they have done and are doing.

[timezone]

Originally Posted by HamsterRage

It's lightweight because it doesn't multi-task.

It's closed because the ONLY place you can buy apps is from the Apple store. What do you think "closed" means?

Thank you

[harryE123]

Originally Posted by HamsterRage

It's lightweight because it doesn't multi-task.

It's closed because the ONLY place you can buy apps is from the Apple store. What do you think "closed" means?

I 've had it with you being uninformed yet having such conviction in what you say: iOS devices do multitask, and the ipad will do so in early November too catching up with the ipod touch and the iphone. No, it's lightweight because of the miniscule flash arm cpu and gfx, and because the unix iOS was compiled for this particular tech in mind.

Closed means a rubbish buzzword by moron tech pundits that some of the public have been chewing upon thoughtlessly. Re-read Danny's quoted comments about open and closed, and mine. You don't have to buy them from apple, jailbreak and get them from anywhere (along with the viruses and the security leaks). Apple just offers the store front and pretty much any app gets accepted unless it's porn or specifically interferes with something the os sets out to do in a different way.

How is the leading market with hundreds of thousands of apps closed just because instead of the developer selling them from their site they sell them via apple's store? Windows is closed too in as much as you can't install on it something that doesn't run there. Should we also say windows is close because people can't tweak the win kernel or interface to their heart's desire? Apple is the single mainstream tech company who's contributed the most to the open source community in terms of drivers, technologies etc. etc. Almost all mobile browsers (except for the great opera) use apple's open source webkit project based on the kde browser, now how is apple closing and manipulating people there? All this is utter rubbish. Just because apple made the right choice and realized that a highly mobile device should be safeguarded against malicious attacks by means of an approval system for apps and they did it first pundits have jumped all over them because apple thought this first and made tons of fans and money in the process. Finally developers get something for their money and average people don't have to scour the internet to find an app when they are all neatly categorized in the app store, which is a huge success. The average person never pays a dime in the open and fair to developers pc world, yet the very same people pay loads of cash for apple's evil closed system to the same developers.

But having said all that apple has implicitly said, you don't like it jailbreak it and put any crap you like on it. See if that makes any difference. Maybe you can then put in a couple of antiviruses, some antimalware software, firewalls and counter trojan measures, and see how great it will run after that. Heck windows 7 needs merely 500mb minimum of ram to just start up, why not replicate this lovely open model to the mobile platforms too...

[timezone]

You are very defensive. I have nothing against Apple and never said those OS's can't multitask. The new Windows Phone will not multitask so Microsoft will be behind Apple in that regard. You really need to chill.

You have to buy all Apple products as you do with Microsoft. Microsoft has contributed to the open source community but I would never call Microsoft open source as Apple also is not. Linux, Perl, MySQL, Javascript to name a few are open source.

You are not comparing apples to apples..pun intended. Both Mac and Windows are not closed because you can goto any store online or brick and mortar and buy a program. In both cases you can't buy a program for one that was exclusively written for the other. That doesn't make either OS closed.

[harryE123]

I wasn't replying to you in terms of the multitasking.

MS has never contributed to the open source community as much as apple, and they are always aiming at a close source solution to tie people down: see silverlight, see wmv, and tons of other tecs. Actually were did ms give something back to the fos community, I can't seem to recall.

This whole closed business is, like I said, a buzz word from tech pundits to bash apple for no other reason that they made the app store such a huge success against everyone of those shortsighted know alls predictions and expectations. And now everyone is going down the app store route in mobile devices. What exactly would you buy from a brick and mortar store for a device that has no cd input, would you stick a flash in port just to get something you can download online in an app store in minutes? Would that make sense. Mobile devices are different beasts, they are much less secure, and they are far more exposed having to join all sorts of public wireless networks. Opening up any app without prior consent from the manufacturer is a pandora's box. And still apple's "consent" isn't restrictive at all, it's a simple safeguard against the havoc of opening up a mobile device to every sort of malware from every developer in the globe with an eye to manipulate or steal personal data. Haven't we had enough of this in the desktop? If it's worked so badly in far less exposed systems how could this anything goes work well for mobile devices. Do you think apple are doing it for the 30% cut? Itunes and the app store are break even affairs, apple is a hardware manufacturer and they are merely supporting their hardware sales with them, it's not that they make much money from them, it's not about them making money. It's about giving the developers a platform from where they can easily reach the most people they can so the developers can make money and consequently develop great apps and make apple's devices more appealing to the buyer.

That's all there is to it to me.

[timezone]

You make a good point about how the App store is an easy way to find applications. I disagree with the PC world full of free apps. Especially in this world of the internet where almost all programs have to be provisioned. I have paid for all of my programs throughout all the decades. I never called the Apple App store evil. It has pluses and minuses like everything else. You see everything as an attack to Apple and therefore to you. I apologize if that is the case and made you upset.

I just started this thread to say I am buying the EXOPC and I think others might like it. If some prefer the iPad than that is great. I have seen the iPad and iphone and they are great devices. I just prefer others. This isn't a zero sum discussion. There are tech products for all product segments, price points and for all of us. Enjoy the iphone and ipad and be happy there is competition to keep all of them on their toes.

Finally developers get something for their money and average people don't have to scour the internet to find an app when they are all neatly categorized in the app store, which is a huge success. The average person never pays a dime in the open and fair to developers pc world, yet the very same people pay loads of cash for apple's evil closed system to the same developers.

[timezone]

Microsoft's Open Source Contributions in code and dollars

Information week
Microsoft's contribution of 20,000 lines of source code to the Linux operating system Monday is not an isolated incident. It's the first step in what will be an ongoing set of contributions to ensure interoperability between Windows and the open source operating system.
The drivers contributed to the Linux kernel were ones used by virtual machines to connect to the Hyper-V hypervisor, telling it to use its library of drivers to connect directly to an IDE or iSCSI disk drive or to network device. Those three drivers represent the devices most frequently addressed by a virtual machine outside the server's CPU, said Greg Kroah-Hartman, lead maintainer of Linux drivers, in an interview Monday.

eWeek.com
Microsoft may have helped its status with the open-source community by reiterating its pledge to deliver $100,000 to the Apache Software Foundation over the next few years.

Intel.com
Microsoft recently announced the creation of a non profit foundation, CodePlex, designed to "enable the exchange of code and understanding among software companies and open source communities." Microsoft contributed $1 million to help get the organization started, and right now the board of directors has several Microsoft employees, but the CodePlex Foundation is an independent entity. The two non-Microsoft board members are Miguel de Icaza (Novell) of Gnome and Mono fame and Shaun Bruce Walker from DotNetNuke. They also have a board of advisors with many open source industry experts, including Larry Augustin, Aaron Fulkerson, Monty Widenius, and others. Microsoft has also announced that Sam Ramji is leaving Microsoft and will serve as interim President of the Foundation in addition to joining the leadership team of a new California startup.


MSDN - Microsoft site 7/08
Sam Ramji, Senior Director of Platform Strategy, just announced in his blog (from the OSCON conference in Portland, Oregon) that we are stepping up our participation and contribution to Open Source.

1.First of all we are going to provide monetary sponsorship to the Apache Software Foundation “This sponsorship will enable the ASF to pay administrators and other support staff so that ASF developers can focus on writing great software”.

2.We are also supporting the ADOdb effort by contributing a patch for it “This is our first code contribution to PHP community projects but will not be the last”.

3.Finally, we are putting an increased number of protocols under Open Specification Promise “We have established a clarification to the OSP that guarantees developer rights to build software of any kind and for any purpose using these specifications, including commercial use”
I think this is one more proof of us Microsoft being extremely serious in partnering with the community and wanting to expand interoperability between Open Source and Microsoft technologies which will provide enormous benefits for businesses and users (which is the ultimate reason for our industry to exists

[timezone]

Funny, the new windows phone is suppose to be easier to develop programs and has better tools to develop programs with than Apple. The truth to this statement will be know by this time next year. Again, despite the gentle jab I hope Apple does well and continues to succeed. There is room for both Apple and Microsoft.

[Sweetpea]

I'm looking forward to your review, timezone! I am glancing towards the tablet, but I personally don't care too much about capacitive touchscreens... Unless it has a wacom screen underneath (which is what a lot of touch-enabled laptops have, atm).

On the other hand, I'd use it mainly for comic reading, some internetting, some reading and other stuff that I use reguarly if I would be able to install it...

[EowynCarter]

Apple, microsoft = closed.

When i think "open", to me it means "free", in the sense of "non proprietary". That would be linux, android, open office, Firefox and so on.

That's the definition of open.

[Sweetpea]

For me, open is that I can install any program I'd like to install. And be able to create my own programs and distribute them as I'd see fit. Which means, in my book, almost all is open (don't know Android, at all, so I don't take that into account), and Apple is as closed as closed can be. And Microsoft is open. Naturally, this only goes about OS's. Not applications themselves.