license vs DRM

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by dsvick

I was not even thinking of a 'registration' more like a simple activation. An actual registration where you need to give up your name and other information would be too onerous and I think a lot of people would be resistant to that as well.

They have to give that information to get DRM'd ebooks now. Apparently, a great many people have no problems handing that info over to several DRM server sites.

[Shaggy]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Publishers won't go for it. They want to lock people into 1 purchase=1 reader.

Exactly. Solving the problem of consumer rights for eBooks is not a technical question, it's a business model question.

[ficbot]

Originally Posted by dsvick

I was envisioning something where you have piece of software on your pc very similar to the Adobe Digital editions, but where you can transfer the license/key with the book to another person.

I don't get why this would be a benefit to the user, though. Why would we *want* this if the alternative was not to have it? There are so many hardware systems, you never know which users might have conflicts or why, and it would raise the price of the book if part of the cost of doing business was supplying tech support to all these people.

You use ADE as an example, but imho that software is no great prize. I had it installed on my computer and it kept popping up wanting me to download updates or wanting me to make it my default reader even after I went into the preferences---repeatedly---and told it I didn't want to. It was a nightmare. I wound up uninstalling it and now I use the Sony software to authorize my library books.

I can see why the publishers may want DRM but you have not adequately explained to me why I customer should 'want' it. I am not sure why you are so ardently campaigning for it. What possible benefit could there be to an end user to have to go through such things? I just don't get where the benefit would be for the customer to the point that they should willingly choose to embrace DRM and *want* it.

[Shaggy]

Originally Posted by ficbot

I can see why the publishers may want DRM but you have not adequately explained to me why I customer should 'want' it. I am not sure why you are so ardently campaigning for it. What possible benefit could there be to an end user to have to go through such things? I just don't get where the benefit would be for the customer to the point that they should willingly choose to embrace DRM and *want* it.

I'm pretty sure the original poster doesn't really want DRM either, but the assumption is that the Publishers will never go for a completely open system. He's offering a compromise that attempts to still give the Publishers what they want, but is more lenient in honoring consumer rights as well.

As I said previously though, I don't think this is really a technical question. Coming up with different schemes/systems isn't where we should be focusing our attention. The current system could theoretically do what he's talking about, if Publishers wanted it to. This is really a business model question. The technical specifics of HOW to do it are fairly irrelevant.

[DawnFalcon]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Since that takes effort (miniscule, but effort), the DRM server company could charge a fee for it--perhaps a dollar to transfer ownership of the file. This would allow people to sell used ebooks for, say, $2-3, and make a small profit.

Publishers won't go for it. They want to lock people into 1 purchase=1 reader.

And they are not, legally, entitled to charge such a fee. Only for original artwork.

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by DawnFalcon

And they are not, legally, entitled to charge such a fee. Only for original artwork.

Artwork? What artwork?

I'm talking about DRM servers transferring authorizations between users. Why wouldn't they be allowed to charge for that? They charge publishers for putting the DRM in place & keeping active servers to authenticate uses of those books.

[DawnFalcon]

You have a right in the EU to resell your property, and eBooks do not fall into ANY of the exemptions. Any costs cannot be put onto you, it's their problem under the doctrine of exhaustion of rights.

There is a specific EU artist resale right which DOES create a charge for reselling origional artwork which is paid to the creator. It needed to be specifically created.

[Shaggy]

Originally Posted by DawnFalcon

You have a right in the EU to resell your property, and eBooks do not fall into ANY of the exemptions. Any costs cannot be put onto you, it's their problem under the doctrine of exhaustion of rights.

Exactly. First sale and fair use are "supposed" to be rights that the consumer already has. They're not supposed to be a revenue opportunity for the Publishers. We should not let the Publishers put themselves in a position of saying "we will let you have your first sale rights, but only if you pay us a fee". Yes, that's better than the current position they're in of denying them completely (which, IMO, should be illegal), but not by much.

[susan_cassidy]

If an ebook is going to have DRM (I would prefer it not to), I prefer schemes that the reader (program or device) can validate within itself, not require connection to another piece of software or a server. I also don't like the eReader scheme requiring a credit card. If I change devices, I might not remember the credit card used to buy the book.