Question for those who edit .CSS files

[Mr_H_Poirot]

I've realised that when I created the TOC I assigned heading 1 to all the chapter titles rather than heading 2. Seems to show up ok on the kobo, the calibre viewer and Thorium though so doesn't matter too much

[Sirtel]

I have certain preferences in formatting and I want all my books formatted that way. I don't care about clean code - all I care about is what the book looks like while reading. So I only edit the css/html as much as I need to achieve my goal, I don't replace the entire stylesheet. That's overkill for me.

[Mr_H_Poirot]

Originally Posted by Sirtel

Not always. It depends on the book - sometimes publishers do really stupid things and insert rules in the css that shouldn't be there. Kepubs ignore many css rules, yes, but epubs don't, and there's also the fact that I might read on some other device in the future, not on a Kobo. I'd still want my books to look uniform.

Moreover, there are things that Kobo cannot make look nice even with kepubs - huge text indents, huge white space around chapter headings, spaces between paragraphs etc. The only way to fix those is to edit them manually.

I tend to get all my books from either kobo or standardebooks so I am guessing I haven't come across these issues to date as the books I am getting are already very well formatted. But useful to know about for future so thanks

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by icallaci

I edit CSS to satisfy my OCD, lol. Unlike JSWolf, I want things spelled out, so I add class="whatever" to bare tags so that I know exactly what each one is supposed to do without traipsing back and forth in the CSS to find the parent class. If I run across a problem while I'm reading (and in some books, there are LOTS of problems--different font sizes, paragraph indents, header spacing--you name it), I want to be able to go directly to ONE class, edit it, and be done. Also, even though most ereaders handle errors by ignoring them, I like my books to be as error free as possible, even if the problems are not visible. I don't want to run into problems in the future if at some point a particular error causes problems. I really don’t care how a book is formatted, as long as it is consistent: I don’t want to “notice” anything while I am reading. It is amazing to me how inconsistent the formatting in some books is, almost as if different people have worked on different parts of it without adhering to any particular standard. And, of course, once I notice something like this, my brain is looking for it, so I can’t concentrate on what the book is actually saying. It sounds like a lot of work, but most of the time it’s not, especially after you develop a routine.

I know what the bare tags do. I know what <p>, <hr/>, and <h2> do. I know what a <p> does after an <h2>. I know what a <p> does after <hr/>. I don't need classes to tell me what these do. I know what my own CSS does. You'd get used to it. You don't need classes to satisfy your OCD. You just need to know what the CSS does when there is no class.

If you decide to change <p>, you just go to the CSS and edit p. It's as simple as editing your one class.

I find less classes makes the code look better. I go by the rule that hardly ever gets followed because the rule gets broken. Keep it simple.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Mr_H_Poirot

Thanks Sirtel

I might look into how to edit (assume I can do in calibre) to remove the excerpts etc.

On making them look uniform, I find my kobo unifies all my books formatting as far as I can tell in terms of font etc. But I may be missing something! I'll have a look on youtube for some examples!

How does Kobo handle indents that are not what you like? How does Kobo handle different font sizes? How does Kobo handle no indents? How does Kobo handle paragraph spaces? How does Kobo handle excess space for chapter headings?

I don't know if the margin slider overrides the L/R margin or it just adds to it. Same with line height. I should test for this. But if these are not handled by Kobo, how would Kobo handle them?

[Mr_H_Poirot]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

How does Kobo handle indents that are not what you like? How does Kobo handle different font sizes? How does Kobo handle no indents? How does Kobo handle paragraph spaces? How does Kobo handle excess space for chapter headings?

I don't know if the margin slider overrides the L/R margin or it just adds to it. Same with line height. I should test for this. But if these are not handled by Kobo, how would Kobo handle them?

I haven't compared all my books side by side but when I open any of my books they all look readable

The font is set by the e-reader as it is the same on all my books (I installed Bookerly)

I think the paragraph spacing and indents and spaces around chapter headings are either controlled by the kobo or else the defaults they come with are pleasant enough that I just don't notice.

If I ever get a book from another source and find it looks 'odd' I'll investigate some more. But for me, I think just being able to add a TOC when I split a book may be enough for me for now

[JSWolf]

One thing I forget to mention, when I am done editing my eBooks, I have no structural errors.

[icallaci]

I've run across ebooks where the publisher sometimes uses bare tags and sometimes uses a class with the same properties as the bare tags. So I don't know if <p> and <p class="indent"> do the same thing unless I set it myself. I want everything, and I do mean everything, to use a class with a name that tells me what it does. If I decide to change what "indent" does, it's not any harder than going to the CSS and editing the <p> tag. Plus, I find my code looks better if every tag tells me specifically what it does. Simple to me means consistent. If other <p> tags have classes (for nonindented, blockquoted, centered, hanging, etc.), then ALL my <p> tags have classes. Simple and consistent. Works for me.

Edited to add: Plus, I don't have to "remember" anything. The name of the class tells me its basic function. The less I have to remember these days, the better.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I know what the bare tags do. I know what <p>, <hr/>, and <h2> do. I know what a <p> does after an <h2>. I know what a <p> does after <hr/>. I don't need classes to tell me what these do. I know what my own CSS does. You'd get used to it. You don't need classes to satisfy your OCD. You just need to know what the CSS does when there is no class.

If you decide to change <p>, you just go to the CSS and edit p. It's as simple as editing your one class.

I find less classes makes the code look better. I go by the rule that hardly ever gets followed because the rule gets broken. Keep it simple.

[Jaws]

Originally Posted by Mr_H_Poirot

I see that some on here edit .CSS files to make changes to formatting of books. I have fewer books than most of you but I was wondering why there is a need to format given that things like font and line spacing and justification can usually be set on the e-reader itself

Is it mainly to take out acknowledgement pages etc and shorten the book?

Yes, some of it is to remove garbage (if I have a 2012 e-book from a still-living-and-writing author, I don't need a page of "Also by" entries stuck in 2012... and the less said about RandomPenguin's "NextReads" trash the better).

That said, many reading systems cannot set "font and line spacing and justification," and more to the point (a) require the human reading to know that in advance, and (b) are easily overridden by (often poorly chosen) publisher hardcoding anyway. For example, if the publisher hardcodes all paragraphs to be flush left, unindented, and with a full blank line between each paragraph, the settings of an e-reader, whether a program or a device, won't overcome that — and that gets very difficult to follow for books that have block quotations, or interspersed poetry, or multicolumn layouts (like annotated speeches).

Put another way, not all books — probably not the majority of books I have — are straight narrative text like the average mystery novel. That means editing the CSS, especially for anything that was ineptly transcoded by the publisher from a previously-available-only-in-print version.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by Mr_H_Poirot

I see that some on here edit .CSS files to make changes to formatting of books. I have fewer books than most of you but I was wondering why there is a need to format given that things like font and line spacing and justification can usually be set on the e-reader itself

Is it mainly to take out acknowledgement pages etc and shorten the book?

Too many publishers force line height, font size, text justification, etc. I can change the base font size but what if I am looking at chapter headers that take up a full page since the original CSS sets the font size as 10em? What if every paragraph definition specifies a line height of 1.5? Or a top margin of 1.2em? What if there are 47 instances of widows: 3; orphans: 3; in a single stylesheet which lets you enjoy multiple blank lines on many pages—these example are from one book my wife recently purchased. It almost seemed as if the publisher was trying to force you to read more pages though the book was not in KU. I won't even mention that number of fonts that were stuffed into the ePub, most of which looked fugly on an eInk screen

For me, it is more to get a consistent appearance on the books I am reading. Chapter headers are restricted in size, first paragraphs in a section are flush, subsequent paragraphs are indented. I don't use font-family settings in the body text. Headers can use a sans-serif font, monospace text uses a monospace font.

On several occasions, my ideas of an ideal layout have been described as boring. Oddly, I agree. I want boring layouts that let me concentrate on what I am reading, not on the author deciding to use different fonts for every character.

[DNSB]

I should also mention that I use a collection of automations and saved searches in Sigil which automate 90% of my work.

[Mr_H_Poirot]

So if you take an average 300 page novel that you've got from say Gutenberg or from Amazon, how long does it take you to make your changes? I can't work out if some of you are spending a couple of hours per book or if it's quicker?

[Sirtel]

On average, 15-30 min per book for me. It used to be faster, but formatting has gotten fancier and more elaborate these days than it was a decade ago. OTOH, there are fewer really badly made books.

[icearch]

I edit CSS because I am making and distributing my own books.

If I read, I only control formatting via reader app settings. Except for some really nasty ones. However, the most editing I have done to already made books are often TOC.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by icearch

I edit CSS because I am making and distributing my own books.

If I read, I only control formatting via reader app settings. Except for some really nasty ones. However, the most editing I have done to already made books are often TOC.

I've seen this before, that people who edit books professionally don't want to do it for their own personal pleasure. For them, editing is a job and they want to avoid it in their free time. For me, it's a hobby, one that I enjoy indulging in.