Kobo H2O bug

[jackie_w]

Originally Posted by DNSB

I would disagree with you. I use both Sigil and calibre's editor. If nothing else, the FlightCrew and epubcheck plugins make Sigil my first choice for epub2 files -- calibre's error check is pretty much an equivalent to the F7 builtin error checker for Sigil. For epub3? Sigil is pretty much your only choice for a free tool.

There has been an EpubCheck plugin for the calibre Editor for a long time. It works fine for checking epub3 if you want an extra check after calibre's own Check Book.

[jackie_w]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Not quite right. Neither Sigil's internal viewer or calibre viewer use the same code as either of the renderer's used in a Kobo. And yes, I've seen times when there have been differences between all four.

Displaying styles slightly differently in 4 different renderer's may not be unusual but the OP's point was about the text content being different - repeated words, missing words etc.

That's more serious, if true. I can't say I've ever noticed this problem myself, but next time I read a sentence on the Kobo which is obviously wrong or clumsy (it happens in some books) I'll make a point of checking back to the original code to see if the source has the same problem.

[PKFFW]

Well this thread has certainly gone way beyond my simple comprehension! But is interesting none the less, so thanks for the responses.

Some of the books I have on my Kobo I have owned for quite a while so I'm inclined to think the problem is likely due to somehow acquiring different/updated versions of the book without realising it.

Having said that, there could be a problem with space time in my house that is affecting ebook readers because my wife's Sony PRS-T3 is currently having a problem where it randomly chops off anything from a word or two up to a couple of paragraphs at the end of chapters. The chapters display perfectly in Sigil and the book was only purchased 4 days ago so I know for a fact it's the same file. Weird.

[JSWolf]

Please start with the ORIGINAL unmodified version of the eBook. Delete all copies on all Readers. Use Calibre to put them back on. Read from the beginning of the book. Then let us know what's up.

If you find any errors, use the Calibre Editor to fix. Do not use Sigil at all for this eBook.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by PKFFW

Well this thread has certainly gone way beyond my simple comprehension! But is interesting none the less, so thanks for the responses.

Yes, we got carried away with theories before hearing back from you about what you actually saw.

Some of the books I have on my Kobo I have owned for quite a while so I'm inclined to think the problem is likely due to somehow acquiring different/updated versions of the book without realising it.

Downloading the same book from Kobo over time can give a different version. And the epub and kepub versions aren't always in sync.

Having said that, there could be a problem with space time in my house that is affecting ebook readers because my wife's Sony PRS-T3 is currently having a problem where it randomly chops off anything from a word or two up to a couple of paragraphs at the end of chapters. The chapters display perfectly in Sigil and the book was only purchased 4 days ago so I know for a fact it's the same file. Weird.

The missing text don't happen to start with words in italics or something? The epub renderer on the Kobos have a problem with incorrect nesting of tags. A book I was reading had song lyrics scattered through. At one point a chapter ended with a song and the start of the next chapter didn't make sense (the song was part of a seduction and the next chapter started with them waking up in bed, but mentioning something that didn't happen). When I looked at in the calibre editor, I found that the song was only about halfway through the chapter (they'd been interrupted by a friend in trouble). The code for the song lyrics looked like:

<i>
<p>First line</p>
<p>Second line</p>
<p>Third line</p>
</i>

That is illegal code, but most HTML renderers will handle it. The version of RMSDK used on a Kobo doesn't like it and doesn't display anything after the closing i tag. The calibre editor will display this correctly, but the error check will highlight it. I'm pretty sure Sigil will fix problems like this when open the book. At least it used to, but, I don't know if that still happens automatically or you have to trigger it somehow.

The Sony PRS-T3 uses an older version of the RMSDK than recent Kobo firmware does. I would expect it to have the same problem.

[PKFFW]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Please start with the ORIGINAL unmodified version of the eBook. Delete all copies on all Readers. Use Calibre to put them back on. Read from the beginning of the book. Then let us know what's up.

If you find any errors, use the Calibre Editor to fix. Do not use Sigil at all for this eBook.

Unfortunately I've already edited my copy.

But I'll keep an eye out for the problem in the future and if it happens again I'll post a copy of the book(copyright permitting) so others can see if it happens to them.

[PKFFW]

Originally Posted by davidfor

Yes, we got carried away with theories before hearing back from you about what you actually saw.

All good.

Originally Posted by davidfor

Downloading the same book from Kobo over time can give a different version. And the epub and kepub versions aren't always in sync.

Yes, I imagine that was the issue and I just didn't realise I'd picked up a new copy somehow.

Originally Posted by davidfor

The missing text don't happen to start with words in italics or something? The epub renderer on the Kobos have a problem with incorrect nesting of tags. A book I was reading had song lyrics scattered through. At one point a chapter ended with a song and the start of the next chapter didn't make sense (the song was part of a seduction and the next chapter started with them waking up in bed, but mentioning something that didn't happen). When I looked at in the calibre editor, I found that the song was only about halfway through the chapter (they'd been interrupted by a friend in trouble). The code for the song lyrics looked like:

<i>
<p>First line</p>
<p>Second line</p>
<p>Third line</p>
</i>

That is illegal code, but most HTML renderers will handle it. The version of RMSDK used on a Kobo doesn't like it and doesn't display anything after the closing i tag. The calibre editor will display this correctly, but the error check will highlight it. I'm pretty sure Sigil will fix problems like this when open the book. At least it used to, but, I don't know if that still happens automatically or you have to trigger it somehow.

The Sony PRS-T3 uses an older version of the RMSDK than recent Kobo firmware does. I would expect it to have the same problem.

No italics or other special type stuff that I recall.

What's even weirder about her situation is how much of the chapter gets chopped seems to depend on which font style and size is chosen. Furthermore, you'd think that a larger font size might mean more of the chapter is chopped off because less words on the page before the chapter break. However some font styles chop off less of the chapter if the font is bigger compared to other styles in a smaller size.

In the end I installed the Calibre reader application on her little netbook and she is reading the book on that.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by PKFFW

What's even weirder about her situation is how much of the chapter gets chopped seems to depend on which font style and size is chosen. Furthermore, you'd think that a larger font size might mean more of the chapter is chopped off because less words on the page before the chapter break. However some font styles chop off less of the chapter if the font is bigger compared to other styles in a smaller size.

Is it losing everything after the end of a page or after the end of a line?

I've actually have a book that is doing something like this. Basically everything looks OK and then I turn the page and there is no text, but part way down the screen there is a rule and after that, text appears again. When I first saw this, I thought there was a nesting error like described, but when I checked, there were no problems. So, a slightly modified version of the book went back on the device and it happened again. But, this time, I accidentally touched the screen in the blank area for to long and the dictionary popup was shown with the meaning of a word. Turns out the text is there, but in white-on-white or some other invisible mode. And if I change the font size it repaginates and the same thing happens but the rule is in a different part of the page and different amount of text is hidden.

It appears to be is something in the CSS that is laying out the text but ends up with white-on-white or something like that for the top part of a page with a rule on it. But, I cannot see what it is. When I have time, I plan to extract what is needed and post it for the experts here to tell me why it works the way it does. It doesn't happen with the kepub renderer, so I read the book with that. But, I'm curious about what the exact cause is.

There has been another problem RMSDK that I think is seen on the Sony's as well. Occasionally, the last line of text in a chapter is pushed to a new page. If that is all the Sony is losing, then maybe it has a different form of the same error or something related to it.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by PKFFW

Unfortunately I've already edited my copy.

But I'll keep an eye out for the problem in the future and if it happens again I'll post a copy of the book(copyright permitting) so others can see if it happens to them.

Download it again. Then do what I said and see if you get the same problems. You should have bought the eBook and in that case, you can download it again.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by PKFFW

Having said that, there could be a problem with space time in my house that is affecting ebook readers because my wife's Sony PRS-T3 is currently having a problem where it randomly chops off anything from a word or two up to a couple of paragraphs at the end of chapters. The chapters display perfectly in Sigil and the book was only purchased 4 days ago so I know for a fact it's the same file. Weird.

Not sure if this is your wife's issue but I've seen a similar issue in epub3 books, mostly those created with Vellum. It seems to mostly happen around using a <hr class="whatever"> to display a graphic as a separator or at the end of a chapter.

I've been using Sigil to replace the <hr whatever> with a centered paragraph to display the graphic. This makes my wife much happier. Saved search/replace is a very nice feature.

[PKFFW]

Originally Posted by davidfor

Is it losing everything after the end of a page or after the end of a line?

I've actually have a book that is doing something like this. Basically everything looks OK and then I turn the page and there is no text, but part way down the screen there is a rule and after that, text appears again. When I first saw this, I thought there was a nesting error like described, but when I checked, there were no problems. So, a slightly modified version of the book went back on the device and it happened again. But, this time, I accidentally touched the screen in the blank area for to long and the dictionary popup was shown with the meaning of a word. Turns out the text is there, but in white-on-white or some other invisible mode. And if I change the font size it repaginates and the same thing happens but the rule is in a different part of the page and different amount of text is hidden.

It appears to be is something in the CSS that is laying out the text but ends up with white-on-white or something like that for the top part of a page with a rule on it. But, I cannot see what it is. When I have time, I plan to extract what is needed and post it for the experts here to tell me why it works the way it does. It doesn't happen with the kepub renderer, so I read the book with that. But, I'm curious about what the exact cause is.

There has been another problem RMSDK that I think is seen on the Sony's as well. Occasionally, the last line of text in a chapter is pushed to a new page. If that is all the Sony is losing, then maybe it has a different form of the same error or something related to it.

Sounds like it might be that.

When it happens it is everything after a line and then when you turn the page on the Sony there might be anywhere from a cm or 2 at the top of the page up to half a page that appears blank before the next part starts. It sometimes happens at an actual chapter break, other times it happens when there is a scene break with a *** bit between the scenes.

Frankly though, it's an irritating thing but not worth the time and effort to try to fully figure out what is going on. The missus is happy enough to read it on her netbook and it is a read once and forget romance book.

[PKFFW]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Download it again. Then do what I said and see if you get the same problems. You should have bought the eBook and in that case, you can download it again.

The problem lies in the fact that I have no way to find the errors, if there are any in the newly downloaded copy, short of re-reading the entire book again. I bookmark each error, maybe 2 or 3 in a book at most usually, then once I've edited the book I remove the bookmark.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by PKFFW

The problem lies in the fact that I have no way to find the errors, if there are any in the newly downloaded copy, short of re-reading the entire book again. I bookmark each error, maybe 2 or 3 in a book at most usually, then once I've edited the book I remove the bookmark.

The thing is, not to edit first. The thing to do is read from the start. First delete any copy from your Reader. Then load a freshly downloaded copy. We are trying to find out what's wrong and the only way you can do that is to download a fresh copy, put it on your Reader and read it from the start even if you've already read it. Do any editing in Calibre's editor if you come across the errors.

[PKFFW]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The thing is, not to edit first.

No, the thing is the editing has already been done so without a time machine there is nothing I can do to compare the old unedited copy with a new freshly downloaded copy. The old unedited copy simply no longer exists.

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The thing to do is read from the start. First delete any copy from your Reader. Then load a freshly downloaded copy. We are trying to find out what's wrong and the only way you can do that is to download a fresh copy, put it on your Reader and read it from the start even if you've already read it. Do any editing in Calibre's editor if you come across the errors.

I appreciate the help and suggestions. I really do. In future I will always ensure the version on Kobo is completely deleted and a clean fresh version installed, I will use Calibre or Sigil codeview to do edits, I will compare a freshly downloaded copy to the one on Kobo prior to any editing, if I find this sort of thing happening again, I will(copyright permitting) post both the Kobo and freshly downloaded versions here for comments and comparisons.

Having said that I'm just not interested enough to go back and re-read the book all over again to solve this problem. Too many books, too little time as the paraphrased saying goes.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by PKFFW

Frankly though, it's an irritating thing but not worth the time and effort to try to fully figure out what is going on. The missus is happy enough to read it on her netbook and it is a read once and forget romance book.

Sounds very familiar (issue and genre). Could I get you to do a quick check on the book to see if there is a vellum-created.svg in the images?