Choosing a book cover artist

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by gmw

The nearest bar is about 25km, maybe a bit more, the nearest Walmart equivalent is about double that. (In Australia you are always closer to a pub than to anything else.) Not that it matters, there is no way that anyone there could possibly compete with Photoshop ... although, looked at like that, I suppose the pub might sometimes come close.

Well, I've been reading your thread here. Here's my standard spiel, which no author asks for, and I give anway. It's usually spoken, but, it goes something like this:

Every author envisions the cover of their book somewhat like an IMAX screen. They see the saga of their novel, flowing across it--eons, generations, or the events of the tale, moving across it 3 stories high. They see the heroine, her hair, her gowns, the ribbons that her lover gave her, and her little dog, too. They see the burning of her home, the dash for freedom he made, evading captors...they see all these things.

But the reality is, 99.99% of all prospective purchasers will see your cover at 100x150px or maybe, wowz, 200x250 px. That's all that they'll see. Nothing more, nothing larger.

Thus, when you tell some poor cover designer that "there's a man in the mouth of a cave. He's wearing animal skins, but he's also wearing a brocade jacket, and he's carrying a bow and arrows, a sword, and, oh yes, he has a SCEPTER, too. And a crown. And in that cave is a bear. Outside the cave is a hawk, no, a bat flying in the sky, trees, sunshine, and OMG, I nearly forgot, a sabre-tooth tiger. An' a DRAGON!"

(Yes: that's a REAL COVER. I sh*t thee not. It was terrible. I have another story, about a hill, a driveway, a large house, a baby carriage, a rattle...)

The very best thing that you can do for a cover is think of ONE, yes, ONE, strong central element, a single graphic thing that can anchor the cover. Just one. Let your cover designer run with that. You'll be happier, and so will s/he. Busy is, as GMW already noted, the KOD (Kiss o'Death). And it's not worth doing, because from far away, or in small sizes, all you get is "clutter." Nothing more, nothing less, and people just slide on by.

For covers, in the "remotely affordable" category, I like both James Egan at Bookfly and Damon Za at Damonza. Now, that's for genre. I don't know how I feel about them for non-fic.

I do recommend that you make part of the bargain that your cover designer HAS TO put the cover up at covercritics.com, and work through any major glitches or comments. Everybody there donates their time, and it ranges from the likes of yours truly (obviously, a brilliant design mind, (snort, chuckle, wheeze, LOL)) to real designers to graphic artists and so on. It's worth more than you pay for it. Check it out, and if you like it, great. If you don't, do it anyway. ;-)

I wouldn't consider hiring a graphic artist if I couldn't see at least 50 covers from him/her. A handful is too few. Anyone can get lucky a few times. Also, I wouldn't expect to pay under $150, for an eBook cover, not for anyone with some actual talent and experience. The two guys I mentioned above have packages that include wraparounds--so obviously, more work by far than just an ebook cover--and I believe those start at $550 or $650.

I think that the average talent is charging in the $150-$250 range, for an ebook cover.

To be honest, and I'm not dissing anyone, most of the Fiverr covers I've seen look like $5 covers. I'm sure that there are some exceptions, but...

I also don't like the 99 Designs model, where a bunch of people design, and only one gets paid. Don't agree with it. Not saying it's immoral or wrong, but I wouldn't do it.

FWIW.

Hitch

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Well, I've been reading your thread here. Here's my standard spiel, which no author asks for, and I give anway. It's usually sploken, but, it goes something like this:

Every author envisions the cover of their book somewhat like an IMAX screen. They see the saga of their novel, flowing across it--eons, generations, or the events of the tale, moving across it 3 stories high. They see the heroine, her hair, her gowns, the ribbons that her lover gave her, and her little dog, too. They see the burning of her home, the dash for freedom he made, evading captors...they see all these things.

But the reality is, 99.99% of all prospective purchasers will see your cover at 100x150px or maybe, wowz, 200x250 px. That's all that they'll see. Nothing more, nothing larger.

Thus, when you tell some poor cover designer that "there's a man in the mouth of a cave. He's wearing animal skins, but he's also wearing a brocade jacket, and he's carrying a bow and arrows, a sword, and, oh yes, he has a SCEPTER, too. And a crown. And in that cave is a bear. Outside the cave is a hawk, no, a bat flying in the sky, trees, sunshine, and OMG, I nearly forgot, a sabre-tooth tiger. An' a DRAGON!"

(Yes: that's a REAL COVER. I sh*t thee not. It was terrible. I have another story, about a hill, a driveway, a large house, a baby carriage, a rattle...)

The very best thing that you can do for a cover is think of ONE, yes, ONE, strong central element, a single graphic thing that can anchor the cover. Just one. Let your cover designer run with that. You'll be happier, and so will s/he. Busy is, as GMW already noted, the KOD (Kiss o'Death). And it's not worth doing, because from far away, or in small sizes, all you get is "clutter." Nothing more, nothing less, and people just slide on by.

For covers, in the "remotely affordable" category, I like both James Egan at Bookfly and Damon Za at Damonza. Now, that's for genre. I don't know how I feel about them for non-fic.

I do recommend that you make part of the bargain that your cover designer HAS TO put the cover up at covercritics.com, and work through any major glitches or comments. Everybody there donates their time, and it ranges from the likes of yours truly (obviously, a brilliant design mind, (snort, chuckle, wheeze, LOL)) to real designers to graphic artists and so on. It's worth more than you pay for it. Check it out, and if you like it, great. If you don't, do it anyway. ;-)

I wouldn't consider hiring a graphic artist if I couldn't see at least 50 covers from him/her. A handful is too few. Anyone can get lucky a few times. Also, I wouldn't expect to pay under $150, for an eBook cover, not for anyone with some actual talent and experience. The two guys I mentioned above have packages that include wraparounds--so obviously, more work by far than just an ebook cover--and I believe those start at $550 or $650.

I think that the average talent is charging in the $150-$250 range, for an ebook cover.

To be honest, and I'm not dissing anyone, most of the Fiverr covers I've seen look like $5 covers. I'm sure that there are some exceptions, but...

I also don't like the 99 Designs model, where a bunch of people design, and only one gets paid. Don't agree with it. Not saying it's immoral or wrong, but I wouldn't do it.

FWIW.

Hitch

So Fivver covers are on par with their proofreaders. You get what you paid for.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

So Fivver covers are on par with their proofreaders. You get what you paid for.

That's IME (in my experience). Some are fine, I'm sure. I've seen some illustrators that are really great, over there. Of course, they're ON Fiverr; they're not selling their work for Five dollars. Let's just say that Fiverr's Fiverrs aren't, well, Fivers, not really.

I also saw at least one advertising his services using the mocked-up covers from Derek Murphy's DIYBookCovers site, so...you pays your money, you takes your chances. If it were me, and I wasn't completely sure about a designer, I'd be tin-eye-ing "his" cover designs to be sure that I was getting what I expected to get.

(There was another guy, some years ago, who was amazing. Just amazing. Then, he was in a motorcycle wreck, and I suspect that he became addicted to the medicines, because he started flaking out, missing deadlines, and then he just disappeared. Not really on-topic, just...anecdotal.)

Hitch

[Lemurion]

I bought my cover art, which many of you have seen, on Fiverr. While I don't want to discuss specifics, I can tell you that I paid significantly more than $5 for the art alone.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Lemurion

I bought my cover art, which many of you have seen, on Fiverr. While I don't want to discuss specifics, I can tell you that I paid significantly more than $5 for the art alone.

Which artwork I, for one, really love.

Hitch

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by Lemurion

I bought my cover art, which many of you have seen, on Fiverr. While I don't want to discuss specifics, I can tell you that I paid significantly more than $5 for the art alone.

You have a good eye and got a great artist.

[gmw]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Well, I've been reading your thread here. Here's my standard spiel, which no author asks for, and I give anway. It's usually sploken, but, it goes something like this:
[...]
I also don't like the 99 Designs model, where a bunch of people design, and only one gets paid. Don't agree with it. Not saying it's immoral or wrong, but I wouldn't do it.

FWIW.

Hitch

Thanks, Hitch. Fun reading as always.

I will be looking for a print cover version as well, so I will be expecting some additional cost.

I noted to someone else that these $50 offers you see (ebook only) might only pay for somewhere around an hour's work (not that I know what rates they actually look for) which seems - to me - to be very under priced, and so rather dubious. (Mind you, as covers for short stories, the cheap but professional option is probably a better path than the cheap but amateur alternative that I pulled for my current shorts - I don't think they are doing me any favours.)

And I definitely want to work with someone specific, I'm not really a crowd person. My problem being to narrow the choices down.

At the moment I'm mostly window shopping, getting an idea what's out there and what will be involved.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by gmw

Thanks, Hitch. Fun reading as always.

I will be looking for a print cover version as well, so I will be expecting some additional cost.

I noted to someone else that these $50 offers you see (ebook only) might only pay for somewhere around an hour's work (not that I know what rates they actually look for) which seems - to me - to be very under priced, and so rather dubious. (Mind you, as covers for short stories, the cheap but professional option is probably a better path than the cheap but amateur alternative that I pulled for my current shorts - I don't think they are doing me any favours.)

And I definitely want to work with someone specific, I'm not really a crowd person. My problem being to narrow the choices down.

At the moment I'm mostly window shopping, getting an idea what's out there and what will be involved.

Oh! Well, I didn't actually expect that any decisions would be reached any time soon; I thought it was more of an "informational only" type of thread. ;-)

My problem with the group thing is the idea that it's okay to ask 20 or 30 or 50 people to do work for which they shan't be paid. Yes, of course, it's their choice, but it feels a bit exploitative to me.

Hitch

[Lemurion]

I agree with Hitch, it just feels wrong to me to ask for free work like that. As a freelance writer I expect to be paid when a client commissions multiple pieces intending only to use the best one; to expect otherwise from artists would be hypocritical.

[gmw]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Oh! Well, I didn't actually expect that any decisions would be reached any time soon; I thought it was more of an "informational only" type of thread. ;-) [...]

Yes, I did intend this thread mostly to gather some information. But don't get me wrong, I do have a book sitting here waiting for a cover. However, it's only on its second draft. Aside from my other work commitments, I also want to make some real progress on the book that follows from this first instalment before I actually commit to publishing - there may be some adjustments required to the hand over between the books, and until I have an actual page count I can't finalise a print cover.

It's also still possible, depending on comments from eventual beta readers, that this first instalment could get dropped out as a completely private background piece. I like it, and my first (but possibly biased) beta reader likes it, but I think it may be a hard sell: a fantasy book with bugger all fantasy. It's more in the nature of an extended prelude, and on that basis alone I have to look at it with a sceptical eye.

[gmw]

And just to explain the (bad) timing a bit: in the past, having done my own covers, I always started to think about them after completion of the first draft - taking photos I think might be useful and generally considering my options and experimenting.

I am only now learning that the use of a professional artist means that my old timing doesn't fit all that well. Maybe it would if everything I wrote was worth publishing ... but, sadly, that is not the case. So unless I'm willing to pay a professional for a cover that may never get used, I realise I'm going to have to get closer to publication before acting on any cover ideas.

[Steven Lake]

Howdy, it's your friendly neighborhood web lurker here. As for book covers, I get all of mine done by my friend and former business partner, Don Semora. He has done professional quality artwork for some of the big names in publishing, gaming, etc. If you want to at least check him out, his website is www.donsemora.com and trust me, he'll hook you up with some awesome covers. You should see the ones he's done for me! And no, I don't get anything out of saying this or promoting him except to refer fellow writers to a friend of mine who does top quality work for a good price. Believe me, if he didn't do good quality work, I wouldn't hire him for all my cover and publishing needs. And yes, I still do print copies of a couple of my books, but only because people want them. Otherwise I'm all digital these days. The majority I don't, but for those few that I do, he does the layouts and everything for them. But even if all you want is a cover, he'll do you a very good, professional, eye catching cover.

[gmw]

Don Semora ... Wow! I opened the website to have those eyes looking out at me and just Wow! In fact, Wow!!!

I'm not saying that I fell equally in love with all the covers in the portfolio, a bit busy for my tastes, but the artwork is superb. And, perhaps more than anything else, of all the places I've been, there is a style and originality to the work that has been so difficult to find in my searching so far.

Whatever I end up doing, thank you for sharing.

[arjaybe]

Originally Posted by Steven Lake

Howdy, it's your friendly neighborhood web lurker here. As for book covers, I get all of mine done by my friend and former business partner, Don Semora. He has done professional quality artwork for some of the big names in publishing, gaming, etc. If you want to at least check him out, his website is www.donsemora.com and trust me, he'll hook you up with some awesome covers.

I went to his website and it does look nice. As I read, though, I saw many typos and other errors. When I tried to report it, two of the three means of contact that I found returned errors. I think the third one worked, but in case it didn't, maybe you could pass this on. I believe you when you say he does good work, but a lack of attention to detail on his own site undermines that.

rjb

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by arjaybe

I went to his website and it does look nice. As I read, though, I saw many typos and other errors. When I tried to report it, two of the three means of contact that I found returned errors. I think the third one worked, but in case it didn't, maybe you could pass this on. I believe you when you say he does good work, but a lack of attention to detail on his own site undermines that.

rjb

FWIW:

I have found, in my cover-artist travels (which are fairly extensive) that Cover artists have the WORST websites in existence, even worse than most author websites. It never ceases to AMAZE me, but it seems to be fact. Dunno why. Maybe the right-brainers rebel at the idea of keeping a website orderly. ;-)

Moreover--and this part really boggles me--almost inevitably, their portfolio layouts and backgrounds are equally horrible. How someone who can make fab covers can have a crappy portfolio, appearance-wise, eludes me, but it also seems to be prevalent.

Hitch