Dune. Arrakis. eBook.

[RickyMaveety]

Originally Posted by wallcraft

Frank Herbert wrote 6 Dune novels, the last two are Heretics of Dune and Chapterhouse Dune. See Dune (novel) from Wikipedia.

Aha!!! I wonder how I managed to miss those?? Although, I think I must have known about Heretics, because I own a copy ... but I don't think I ever read it.

So, then ... the last two are not yet available for the Kindle.

[JSWolf]

1. Dune (1965)
2. Dune Messiah (1969)
3. Children of Dune (1976)
4. God Emperor of Dune (1981)
5. Heretics of Dune (1984)
6. Chapterhouse: Dune (1985)

Those are the Dune books written by Frank Herbert.

[C6REW]

Hi All,

Damn confusing all of this!

I had managed to track the list of Dune stories including short stories to be in this order:

1. Hunting Harkonnens
2. The Butlerian Jihad
3. Whipping Mek
4. The Machine Crusade
5. The Faces of Martyr
6. The Battle Of Corrin
7. House Atreides
8. House Harkonnen
9. House Corrino
10. Dune
11. A Whisper of Caladan Seas
12. The Road To Dune (Which I guess should not be here as it is the collection of the first six listed above)
13. Dune Messiah
14. Children of Dune
15. God Emperor of Dune
16. Heretics of Dune
17. Chapterhouse Dune
18. Hunters of Dune

I understand that they are not just by Frank Herbert, but they appear to be the logical order of the stories. Can anyone else clarify if this is true as I have been collecting the stories in paperback to read from the beginning.

Best regards

Chris

[JSWolf]

This is the list in chronological order that I have been able to come up with.

01. The Butlerian Jihad (Legends of Dune, Book 1) by Brian Herbert & Kevin J. Anderson
02. The Machine Crusade (Legends of Dune, Book 2) by Brian Herbert & Kevin J. Anderson
03. The Battle of Corrin (Legends of Dune, Book 3) by Brian Herbert & Kevin J. Anderson
04. House Atreides (Dune: House Trilogy, Book 1) by Brian Herbert & Kevin J. Anderson
05. House Harkonnen (Dune: House Trilogy, Book 2) by Brian Herbert & Kevin J. Anderson
06. House Corrino (Dune: House Trilogy, Book 3) by Brian Herbert & Kevin J. Anderson
07. Dune (Dune Chronicles, Book 1) by Frank Herbert
08. Paul of Dune by Brian Herbert
09. Dune Messiah (Dune Chronicles, Book 2) by Frank Herbert
10. Children of Dune (Dune Chronicles, Book 3) by Frank Herbert
11. God Emperor of Dune (Dune Chronicles, Book 4) by Frank Herbert
12. Heretics of Dune (Dune Chronicles, Book 5) by Frank Herbert
13. Chapterhouse Dune (Dune Chronicles, Book 6) by Frank Herbert
14. Hunters of Dune by Brian Herbert
15. Sandworms of Dune by Brian Herbert
16. The Road to Dune by Brian Herbert

I hope this is complete and correct.

[Krystian Galaj]

Both of the lists are roughly in the order in which the events described in them happen.

I only read the 6 books by Frank Herbert, but I read in numerous places on the Net that prequels and sequels written by Brian Herbert (son of Frank Herbert) and Kevin J Anderson aren't worth the time spent reading them, if you expect something like the first 6 books.

So if you really have to read them as the events in Dune universe unfold, don't stop before the original Dune - it's a must read.

[BlackVoid]

I recently read The Butlerian Jihad and decided that I will not read any more books by Brian Herbert and/or Kevin J Anderson. They joined my "do not touch" list with C J. Cherryh, David Brin and Robert Asprin (and some others).

It is just stale. I did not really care for any of the characters. Events were very predictable.

A long time ago I started reading Dune Messiah, but gave it up after 1/3 as nothing much was happening, too many characters and politics. I wonder if the other 5 by F Herbert are worth reading.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by BlackVoid

I recently read The Butlerian Jihad and decided that I will not read any more books by Brian Herbert and/or Kevin J Anderson. They joined my "do not touch" list with C J. Cherryh, David Brin and Robert Asprin (and some others).

Hmmmm. What don't you like about Cherryh and Brin?

Cherryh is hit and miss for me. I liked the Chanur series, for instance, but didn't care for some of the others. I'm quite fond of Brin's "Uplift" novels.

It is just stale. I did not really care for any of the characters. Events were very predictable.

A long time ago I started reading Dune Messiah, but gave it up after 1/3 as nothing much was happening, too many characters and politics. I wonder if the other 5 by F Herbert are worth reading.

Dune, Dune Messiah, and Children of Dune should properly be read as one long book. If you like them, consider the others. If not...

I've passed on the Brian Herbert/Kevin Anderson collaborations, but did read all of Frank's. Joanna Russ reviewed Dune for F&SF years ago and called it "carefully worked up third rate". I'd give it a higher rating, and consider the original Dune a classic, but I think I understand why she wasn't impressed.
______
Dennis

[montsnmags]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

...
Cherryh is hit and miss for me. I liked the Chanur series, for instance, but didn't care for some of the others. I'm quite fond of Brin's "Uplift" novels.
...

I've read some of the Uplift novels a while back. Let me just check which ones...

Okay, I've read:

• Sundiver
• Startide Rising
• The Uplift War
• Brightness Reef

Obviously, having read four, I was enjoying them enough to keep reading. I'd say I read them in 1995, because I'm pretty sure I would have kept reading on to Infinity's Shore if it was available at the time.

However, I can't say I found them in the realm of SF books I've enjoyed the most. I remember feeling that the "alien" races were a bit "Mr Potato Head" (just add different parts together to make a whole), and the big mystery that tracked behind the series reminded me of SF television series that run episodes which are self-contained, but have an ongoing plot behind them ("The truth is out there"). I found that a bit...annoying, as I do with television. I liked the concept of "uplift", but I also got the idea that humanity was almost a "chosen species" (it's been a while, so my memory, always suspect, may be misguiding me), and that probably would have annoyed me too. Note, though, that once one thing starts to annoy, I can completely overlook any subtleties and positive attributes in a book.

The thing is, they were good enough that I read four of them in a row, so they must have been pretty good (I'm a constant reader, but not a voraciously quick "read-five-books-a-week" reader, and so I tend to be fairly selective in what I purchase because I almost never put a book down once started - making a bad decision is going to take too much of my time). I would recommend the Uplift books to friends, if I thought their tastes and preferences in SF were compatible, but I don't have them on my universal SF-recommendation "You should read this!" list.

Going back to my comment about SF television series, the Uplift Universe, and these stories, would, in my opinion, make a brilliant television series, or a series set in the Uplift universe with movies (even "straight to tv"), perhaps, for some or all the books. Start the series with a movie version of Startide Rising?

Cheers,
Marc

[nekokami]

Of Brin's books, I actually think I like Earth best, but I regularly re-read Sundiver and The Uplift War. The rest of the series was reasonably good, but not as good as those two specific books, I thought. (I liked the first half of The Postman a lot, but didn't care for the rest.)

I like most of Cherryh, too, though I found Downbelow Station and 40,000 in Gehenna less engaging than some of her other books. The Chanur books are probably my favorites of hers, but I also really liked Finity's End. I think she was in top form on that one-- good strong characterizations, sweeping milleau, and plenty of action.

As far as Dune goes... I quite liked the original, and have read it several times. Dune Messiah was ok. Children of Dune was where I started to get bored. I haven't worked up the interest to read any of the others by Frank Herbert, much less the rest of them. A close friend was reading them and giving me his impressions, and while he liked them, it didn't seem to me that I would like them as well. That was a long time ago, though. I suppose I could give them a try again....

[JSWolf]

Supposedly Kevin J. Anderson is good on his own. Don't count him ou till you've read some of his solo work.

[WillAdams]

I agree w/ Nekokami, _Finity's End_ was one of Cherryh's best books --- unfortunately, a lot of the appreciation of it is tied up in the history, so it work much better if one has read _Downbelow Station_, _Merchanter's Luck_, &c.

To get back to the main topic, Frank Herbert's _Dune_ books are quite good, but the prequels and sequels are pretty awful and worse still, are inconsistent w/ what Herbert wrote (in Dune it's noted that Duke Leto Atreides had only entered the arena once, to kill the bull which had killed his father, but in the prequel they have it gunned down w/ lasguns)

William

[BlackVoid]

The original Dune book is a classic, I read it at least 2 times, seen the film (by David Lynch) 2 times as well.

Cherryh - I read Downbelow station - was not impressed. Then started Cyteen. Uh. It is so boring, watching the ceiling is more fun. Way too many characters introduced, then nothing happens.

I had the same problem with David Brin - Startide Rising. It just drags on and on and nothing happens.

Asprin: Phule's company. Bleh. It is not funny at all. Superhero type is more clever than everyone else and succeeds in everything for the first try.

The Vorkosigan series is the same. Where is the suspense? All problems are solved instantly by genius superhero. Unbelievable crap.

Dune Messiah - I had the same impression. No plot. Ending spoiled at the start. Too many dull characters. Nothing happens. Eh.

I love many other authors: G Bear, Asimov, A Reynolds (best SF writer today), V Vinge, J Vinge, L Nagata, C R Wilson and many others.

[nekokami]

BlackVoid, the "too many characters" problem isn't in all of Cherryh's books, though it's something I'm not too fond of either. I'd recommend the Chanur stories, starting with The Pride of Chanur. One main viewpoint character, plenty of action from the start. That's the "other" Cherryh style. If you don't like that one, you probably won't like anything else she's written, but I wouldn't give up on her just yet.

Similarly, most of Brin's books are written from multiple viewpoints, but Sundiver is much more focused.

[bill_mchale]

BlackVoid,
Just curious, have you read all of the Vorkosigan series or just one or two? Yes Miles does tend to be very smart, but in many of the books his smarts gets him into huge amounts of trouble before he ultimately gets out of trouble... Also there is a few books where he is the one that needs rescuing.

Anyway, just curious. Everyone has their own tastes.

As for Brin, I thought Startide Rising and the Uplift War were great. I read Sundiver sometime later and its obvious that his Uplift Universe hadn't been as fully realized as it is in his later works. The Second Uplift Trilogy, well.. I think it was solid, but I think the first book started too slow.

To keep this post on topic... my opinion is that Dune is great, Dune Messiah is ok, and the rest of the Dune novels need editing. Its one of my pet peeves, sometimes authors who have written a really great book that sells millions of copies start believing that everything they write deserves to be published. I can think of several authors whose early work was great and whose later work was merely ok because it lacked the focus a good editor can bring.

--
Bill

[C6REW]

Hi All,

Great to hear the same story about the other Dune books. Having read all the original ones some years ago when I was working in the Middle East, I reckon I may not bother with all the others after all.

Will re-read the originals when I get to them in my list of must reads!

Regards

Chris