Digital Disruption: Change Keeps Happening

[Rbneader]

Originally Posted by gmw

I am not sure what you mean by "treated POD different" and "kept them out of most B&M bookstores", or how any change last year "opened the door for POD titles". You appear to be referring to something other than the articles referenced in the OP.

My POD titles have been available for ordering from B&M stores since they were first released, and have definitely been present in the online facet of those stores. But being available is different to actually being stocked on shelves for people to grab as they walk by. B&M will never stock everything that's available via POD, that's part of the point of POD. If there is a change happening now, it may simply be that more B&M stores are taking notice of the popularity of some POD titles and actively stocking them, where they had not bothered in the past. The publicised success of "The Rabbit ..." may help this to happen more often.

As I understand it, until recently the ordering system for bookstores kept POD books in their own category and made it hard for bookstore owners to stock POD books. That also bureaucratically impacted the ability of libraries to order POD books I think?

I think there was a post by Ms. Rusch about it, I'll see if I can find the link.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Rbneader

As I understand it, until recently the ordering system for bookstores kept POD books in their own category and made it hard for bookstore owners to stock POD books. That also bureaucratically impacted the ability of libraries to order POD books I think?

I think there was a post by Ms. Rusch about it, I'll see if I can find the link.

This referenced it:
http://kriswrites.com/2013/05/15/the...hifting-sands/

We investigated, and discovered this:

Earlier this year, Baker & Taylor changed its policies in regard to self-published titles. Instead of segregating them to a different part of their website (as if all POD books smelled bad), B&T mixed the books into the general population. Then, B&T changed its discount policy on POD books. Now, POD books qualify for the hassle-free returns policy. Certain bookstores—those with good credit, who ordered a lot of copies through B&T—qualify for as much as a 45% discount on any POD title. These gold-plated bookstores can get another 6% discount off their bill if they pay within 30 days.

DWS also refered to the change here:
http://www.deanwesleysmith.com/the-n...ctive-on-2013/

The biggest event for indie publishers in 2013 was the silent removal of all labels about POD printed books from the Baker and Taylor and Ingrams catalogs. This allowed bookstores, depending on their credit, to get indie published paper books at varying discounts from 25% to 42%. So indie books starting in the summer of 2013 started slowly making their way through normal channels into bookstores. And many indie published books found their way into the ABA Indie Bound book program this last fall, mostly without the indie publisher even knowing it was happening.

This one change last summer will turn out to have a large impact for many indie publishers in 2014 and beyond.

Noting that THE RABBIT... took two and a half years to go viral it was probably released while Ceatespace titles were still flagged as POD (and hence Indie) but lost the flag later. As word of mouth spread and people asked for it it moved through the distribution system just like any tradpub title.

Both KKR and DWS are great resources for those interested in tracking the ongoing disruption and evolution of publishing.
Highly recommended sites both.

[Sydney's Mom]

This is fascinating, as are most things on MR. As few as 10 years ago, you heard about a book from a friend, or by reading something else. You stopped by the book store, waited for the "research" clerk to be free, at which point they told you they didn't have the book, but they could order it, and you could pick it up in 3 days. But it was Thursday, and you wouldn't be downtown on Saturday, so you wouldn't get the book until next week. This very scenario happened to me countless times before my kindle. It seemed they didn't want me to read the book! And it was very likely something else would catch my eye when I was in the bookstore, or the library would call with some of my holds, and I wouldn't get that book anyway.

If you think back, as little as 10 years ago, life was very different. When we went on our ski vacation, we always made a trip to the bookstore in advance, and I packed 5-10 paperbacks in my suitcase. I have a (decorative) bin next to my bed, and it used to be full of paperbacks I meant to read. Now it has magazines. I was one of those voracious readers that probably spent $500-$1000 a year on books (I buy a lot of knitting books, as well). Now I am at $50-$100, and they are all knitting books.

Now, the publishers can get some short term profit by publishing stuff like 50 Shades, and get people that really aren't readers. But buying that book doesn't turn you into a reader, and you are unlikely to buy the next big book. Readers (with a capital R) are the ones that asked for the special orders, and laid out money for books that weren't 25% off because they were on the best seller list.

I have less than a decade left in my career, but if I were younger the new AI robots that are being introduced to do legal tasks would really concern me. If I were in publishing, I would be downright panicked.

[fjtorres]

3 days?!
You were lucky.
I usually had to wait three weeks on special orders.
Once, three months.

So, yeah. You young whippersnappers don't know how good you have it.

[ekbell]

I've been buying independently produced niche market books for the last dozen years and the physical improvement and increased availability of the print books over this time period has been quite noticeable.

I now have to check the publishers to see which ones were published by a teeny, tiny one person/family company and which were published by a main-stream publisher. Some of the teeny-tiny companies even have good illustrators and quite nice covers.

From a consumer point of view between the Internet, improved printing technology and ebooks it's never been easier to find books on whatever topic I choose.

[Phogg]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

3 days?!
You were lucky.
I usually had to wait three weeks on special orders.
Once, three months.

So, yeah. You young whippersnappers don't know how good you have it.

When I was in college in the late eighties I ordered a copy of Robert Service's first autobiography "Ploughman Of The Moon" (which had been out of print since 1957) from a specialty shop near the university. A copy came in...after the first Gulf War.

Today I can get a copy from an online retailer or a used bookstore that is part of a network in a few days.

[gmw]

Rbneader and fjtorres, thanks for the info/links. It is curious to compare that to what I saw from the outside as a self-published author. (My first novel came out at the end of 2012, so perhaps I was already seeing the "change" that those links speak of as happening in 2013.) On the websites for the B&M stores I was checking when my books came out, there was no sign that my books were POD - although some sites made the books ridiculously expensive - way WAY over RRP (I wanted to claim a percentage!).

It also turned out that some those Australian sites were ordering the books from the UK and having them shipped out here, which seems ridiculous when there are Lightning Source (Ingram) printers in Melbourne (and the books had to becoming from LS/Ingram, they are the only print service I use). It is still generally (significantly) cheaper to order from BookDepository and have it shipped from the UK than it is to order locally - whether POD or tradpub - all you need is patience.

[fjtorres]

A lot of indie stores and some B&N's will feature local authors, regardless of how they get to market.
That is not the rule, though. Not in the US.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by gmw

Rbneader and fjtorres, thanks for the info/links. It is curious to compare that to what I saw from the outside as a self-published author. (My first novel came out at the end of 2012, so perhaps I was already seeing the "change" that those links speak of as happening in 2013.) On the websites for the B&M stores I was checking when my books came out, there was no sign that my books were POD - although some sites made the books ridiculously expensive - way WAY over RRP (I wanted to claim a percentage!).

It also turned out that some those Australian sites were ordering the books from the UK and having them shipped out here, which seems ridiculous when there are Lightning Source (Ingram) printers in Melbourne (and the books had to becoming from LS/Ingram, they are the only print service I use). It is still generally (significantly) cheaper to order from BookDepository and have it shipped from the UK than it is to order locally - whether POD or tradpub - all you need is patience.

Could you go to the B&M and pick them up or would you have to special order?

[gmw]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

Could you go to the B&M and pick them up or would you have to special order?

You would have to order them. I didn't (and don't) have enough marketing/backing (or willingness to spend what it takes to get them) to encourage B&M to invest in stocking them. Also, when setting up the books for sale I set them with a no-return policy - whereas, as I understand it, most tradpub books can be returned if not sold. That, I imagine, makes a big difference to what B&M stores would be willing to stock on spec.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by gmw

You would have to order them. I didn't (and don't) have enough marketing/backing (or willingness to spend what it takes to get them) to encourage B&M to invest in stocking them. Also, when setting up the books for sale I set them with a no-return policy - whereas, as I understand it, most tradpub books can be returned if not sold. That, I imagine, makes a big difference to what B&M stores would be willing to stock on spec.

Thanks. I asked because I knew I could special order most POD's from any B&M.
I was hoping I could just walk in and buy yours.