Glo Minimum line spacing unadjustable, fix?

[dickloraine]

I hacked the modify epub plugin to perform the dirty solution mentioned above to strip line-height and font-family from the css. This way it is only one click. But as mentioned, in some special cases, this leads to small problems. I think I uploaded my modified version somewhen here, maybe you find it with a search. It is an older version of the plugin, but it should still work and it is even very simple to copy the few changes to a new version.

[Ripplinger]

Originally Posted by dickloraine

I hacked the modify epub plugin to perform the dirty solution mentioned above to strip line-height and font-family from the css. This way it is only one click. But as mentioned, in some special cases, this leads to small problems. I think I uploaded my modified version somewhen here, maybe you find it with a search. It is an older version of the plugin, but it should still work and it is even very simple to copy the few changes to a new version.

This sounds quite useful to me, and I hunted down the thread to play with:
https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...&postcount=897

Thanks for the work on it.

[meeera]

Originally Posted by GeoffR

It is a compromise, there can be no perfect solution as long as there are publishers who continue to produce crappy ebooks, but the difference is that publisher Y can always fix their ebook so that the line spacing is adjustable on the Kobo (by setting the default line-height in body and letting the paragraph syles inherit), whereas there may be nothing publisher X can do to get their book to display correctly on a Nook if they have features that depend on line-height being honoured.

I don't know - I can envisage what I see as solutions as perfect as they can get. The solution could be implemented in two different ways.

One is, if you try to change the line-height in a book where the book currently would silently override your choice, you get a little popup: "Do you really want to override publisher-specified line-height within this book? Y/N", possibly with a "Learn more" link to see what sort of problems it can cause. This should pop up once per book only. (It may need to come with a "Stop overriding publisher line-height" option once chosen.)

Alternatively, an Advanced Settings area in Settings where the user could pick and choose which publisher settings to override and which to leave in place.

[leftright]

Kobo should at least give the user a decent indication that the books line height cannot be adjusted, I suggest greying out the line height slider if the line height cannot be adjusted.

This would prevent OCD folks like me from spending hours trying to locate the fault which isn't a fault at all.

[Ripplinger]

It's actually pretty common for readers not to be able to override some settings if they're specified in the book's stylesheet. As much as I loved the Sony 350, it also couldn't overwrite defined fonts even with your own stylesheet (and I never considered it a flaw of the Sony, it's just how readers work and what they're capable of). You had to edit the book's stylesheet to remove the font specific lines.

So it's something most of us are used to dealing with, Kobo readers are no different in that regard. And I'm happy just opening the problem book up in Sigil and deleting the lines that get in the way of how I like to read. Or use the modified plugin that dickloraine was nice enough to make changes to for the "quick and dirty" fix if you really don't want to open up the problem book.

[leftright]

yes, but, how many ebook users know which books line height is unadjustable ?, how many users delve into sigil to fix the problem ?.

[Ripplinger]

Short of opening up each book, I'm sure they'll find out like I do... when I open the book to read it on my Glo HD.

As for how many bother to then open up the book and fix the spacing or fonts or whatever, only those readers that it really annoys. Like me . Those who don't bother to fix it are the ones it just really doesn't bother, because it's not difficult at all to fix and takes just a few minutes even if you do it manually in Sigil.

Still it's a common problem with most readers that I've ever tried, not always being able to override a particular item within the book's stylesheet.

[leftright]

my point is this,

I converted a book in calibre with line height settings, When I opened the book in my Glo I was confused as to why the line height slider wouldn't work, I then spent hours with calibre converting the book with different line height settings trying to establish what the issue was, to no avail. Frustrated and confused I came here and through this forum I discovered that it's a complex issue dependant on the publisher and how calibre converts the CSS properties, and that the only way to rectify the line height issue is by modifying the code and CSS properties.

I don't see why calibre can't be more specific on how each eReader handles the flattened CSS "stuff" by incorporating in Calibre's conversion thingy a message which instructs the user what to do to enable the eReader's adjusters to work, after all if you guys know that Calibre flattens the CSS stuff, whatever that means, surely the dev's could build in some type of feedback which notifies the user that some reader settings wont work.

My anger at this lack of feedback stems from the fact that I have a large collection which I've been converting in batches as I go along, I now have to return to each book and individually reconvert with remove "line-height", very very annoying and time consuming.

[Ripplinger]

I wouldn't recommend blindly converting every book without seeing if it first needs any tweaks to get it to how you want it to look on your reader. You could be really messing up some nicely formatted books.

But if that's the way you insist on going, why not just select all your books in the Calibre library by hitting Ctrl-A, use dickloraine's modified plugin mentioned above with Remove line-height settings checked, click OK and then go to sleep. Not time-consuming at all as long as you don't intend to sit and stare at the screen while Calibre is working on the changes.

Or in the Look and Feel tab of your preferences in Calibre, find out which line-height spacing you prefer and leave it set to that, then you no longer have to be bothered making any adjustment on the reader. For myself, I find 120% with the font I prefer works well. And again, you can set Calibre to convert all your books at once while you're away from the PC.

Calibre is a great tool that makes library management and converting your books as easy as possible. It's not however meant to teach you everything there is to know about the inner workings of how epubs are put together, how publishers can create either a very nicely formatted book or a real mess of a book, and how each brand of ereader hardware and reading apps handle the books differently from each publisher. That's far beyond the scope of what Calibre or any program can do.

Being angry about it is just a waste of time better spent learning more.

[cybmole]

Originally Posted by leftright

yes, but, how many ebook users know which books line height is unadjustable ?, how many users delve into sigil to fix the problem ?.

many many books have fixed line heights, so much so that I run all new books through sigil and remove all instances with a single regex, before even putting book on device.

line-height: 1.2;
line-height: 1.2em;

are particularly common, and are often scattered throughout the CSS

i was given this regex in another thread, way back. be sure not to have minimal mode ticked & it will find all entries
line-height: [^;}\r\n]*;?

i take out font family definitions at that stage also.
even an innocuous
font-family:serif;
is enough to prevent on-device font selection

[leftright]

Originally Posted by cybmole

i was given this regex in another thread, way back. be sure not to have minimal mode ticked & it will find all entries
line-height: [^;}\r\n]*;?

THanks for the information.

Originally Posted by cybmole

i take out font family definitions at that stage also.
even an innocuous
font-family:serif;
is enough to prevent on-device font selection

wait, that's something else I didn't know. I've converted all my books to Calibri.

ok, so what do I have to place in calibre's CSS remove thingy to ensure that fonts are read from the book, the line height and fonts adjustable ?. I'm guessing that the syntax is something like this,

line-height: [^;}\r\n]*; font-family:serif;

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by leftright

my point is this,

I converted a book in calibre with line height settings, When I opened the book in my Glo I was confused as to why the line height slider wouldn't work, I then spent hours with calibre converting the book with different line height settings trying to establish what the issue was, to no avail. Frustrated and confused I came here and through this forum I discovered that it's a complex issue dependant on the publisher and how calibre converts the CSS properties, and that the only way to rectify the line height issue is by modifying the code and CSS properties.

I don't see why calibre can't be more specific on how each eReader handles the flattened CSS "stuff" by incorporating in Calibre's conversion thingy a message which instructs the user what to do to enable the eReader's adjusters to work, after all if you guys know that Calibre flattens the CSS stuff, whatever that means, surely the dev's could build in some type of feedback which notifies the user that some reader settings wont work.

My anger at this lack of feedback stems from the fact that I have a large collection which I've been converting in batches as I go along, I now have to return to each book and individually reconvert with remove "line-height", very very annoying and time consuming.

So, what happens in a house where people share the library but use different ereaders? Or when someone upgrades from one brand to another?

Except in one case, a Calibre conversion explicitly stays away from any device dependent options. This is to give the best experience to as many people as possible. Personally, if calibre did implement device specific settings like you want, I would be complaining at least as loudly about them as you are about the lack of them.

The only place it does is the image size. There are profiles to set the maximum image size to be used. These probably made sense for older devices, but all the currently available devices will resize the images properly.

And to handle what you want, you can set the default options for a conversion. Any new conversion will use these. But, calibre stores the selected options when you convert a book. You need to clear these, if you convert it again.

And finally, I can't think of the last time I had a book whose line height didn't adjust without me editing it. Admittedly, I always have it set to the minimum height on the device, but I haven't had a book recently that didn't respect this.

[leftright]

Originally Posted by davidfor

So, what happens in a house where people share the library but use different ereaders? Or when someone upgrades from one brand to another?

I'm merely suggesting that the eReader should give the user feedback when the sliders are used with no visible effect. I'm not suggesting a fundamental paradigm shift.

Originally Posted by davidfor

And to handle what you want, you can set the default options for a conversion. Any new conversion will use these. But, calibre stores the selected options when you convert a book. You need to clear these, if you convert it again.

Yes, I have done exactly that only to discover that all is not as it seems re-the line height and fonts. Again I blame the lack of feedback from the software.

Originally Posted by davidfor

And finally, I can't think of the last time I had a book whose line height didn't adjust without me editing it. Admittedly, I always have it set to the minimum height on the device, but I haven't had a book recently that didn't respect this.

I note your point, but I wouldn't be here if I didn't have the line height issues, which I've subsequently discovered can be rectified by adding a line command to the CSS remove thingy. Trust me it isn't obvious to click and play users like me of whom there are many I'm sure.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by leftright

I'm merely suggesting that the eReader should give the user feedback when the sliders are used with no visible effect. I'm not suggesting a fundamental paradigm shift.

All my comments were in response to your comments about calibre, not what happens on the device. You stated that calibre was in the wrong because it didn't assist you here. But, if you want to discuss the device, how and when should it do this? What if there is only one class that won't adjust and it is used in only one place? Or only one class that can be adjusted? Should Kobo disable the slider in these cases? Or popup a warning that it couldn't so something? Personally, I'd put the decision in the to-hard basket and go and fix a bug in area that is more likely to affect others.

I note your point, but I wouldn't be here if I didn't have the line height issues, which I've subsequently discovered can be rectified by adding a line command to the CSS remove thingy. Trust me it isn't obvious to click and play users like me of whom there are many I'm sure.

The fact you care about this makes you unusual. Most users I see don't ever make any adjustments. Or change it once and never again. Quite a few don't even know they can adjust the fonts until I show them. Kobo's, and Amazon's, market is not the likes of us (the denizens of this forum). They are much more interested in the masses who just pick up the device and read.

With all this, here's the strange thing: As far as I can tell, a Kobo ereader is the best at respecting the books design. Everything else seems to stuffs around with it more than a Kobo does. Or ignore parts (eg. line height). This means that if the books creator actually puts thought into the design, a Kobo is the most likely to display it the way they intended. The unfortunate consequence if this is that if the book creator doesn't know what they are doing, and especially if they rely to heavily on automated tools, bad things happen. And the over-use of line height in the CSS is one of these things. Or setting a font in places it shouldn't be set. The real thing here is to make sure the creators learn how to do this properly. And the book creation tool writers understand what they are doing. And is important to note that calibre is NOT a book creation tool.

[leftright]

Originally Posted by davidfor

All my comments were in response to your comments about calibre,

I stand before you cap in hand and Apologise for the misunderstanding as I'm deeply appreciative of the efforts of the developers who have devoted their time to enable editing of books. I'm merely trying to make a good product better with my feedback and issues.

Originally Posted by davidfor

The real thing here is to make sure the creators learn how to do this properly. And the book creation tool writers understand what they are doing. And is important to note that calibre is NOT a book creation tool.

Please inform the kind and generous folks at Gutenberg of this fact.

so to remove line height and font issues is the following syntax correct ?

line-height: [^;}\r\n]*; font-family:serif;