Errors Galore! Validator

[PeterT]

The CSS class WILL center the text, however, you have to DEFINE the class before it is usable.

[DiapDealer]

And link the CSS file to the appropriate (x)html files. So they know they're supposed to governed by it.

[oiver55]

WOW!!! I never knew you had to link the css, I figured it just knew to use the css.

It Works and on top of that all my paragraph indents are there instead of everything looking justified.

I will take a look through the Quick and Dirty tut and save it will all my other tuts.

Thanks yet again

[DiapDealer]

Now you're cooking with gas!

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by theducks

There is a second advantage to using: <h2 class="optional">Introduction</h2>

Lime green on a grey background is hard to read. If you really want people to read your post, please change the lime to a color that works.

[Notjohn]

Originally Posted by oiver55

I have done as thou has commanded.

I put this code in

  <p class="center"><b>INTRODUCTION</b></p>

And when I switch to book View mode the text is aligned to the left but when I now select the text and click on the center button, its centered and the code looks like this

 <p class="center" style="text-align: center;"><b>INTRODUCTION</b></p>

Before, that style tag wasn't there. I had the expectation that p class="center" would actually center the text but it seems like the style tag is whats actually doing it

Yes, Sigil will do that if you add a manual styling to a defined style, in this case adding the boldface tag. I don't know if there's a reason for this, but anyhow it does no harm.

Sometimes Sigil will also add a fresh new style to the CSS to cover just such a situation. Again, no harm done, and indeed there may be a good reason for it.

Sigil is a wonderful software, and the help on this forum is likewise without price, if sometimes over one's head.

[oiver55]

I have a new question but I'm going to start a new thread as it will be a new topic. Thanks for all the help

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Notjohn

Oliver, your basic problem is piling in-line styles on top of the style sheet. See Diap's first reply for the way out of the wilderness. Instead of

<p align="center"><b>INTRODUCTION</b></p>

You can use

<p class="center"><b>INTRODUCTION</b></p>

and get the exact result you are seeking. p class calls upon the appropriate paragraph style in the style sheet.

However, I probably would have used:

<h2>Introduction</h2>

instead. If you refer to the style sheet, you'll see that that would yield a centered and italicized (and effectively boldfaced) heading half again as large as the body text, which IMHO is more desirable than all caps. Or if you want a smaller heading, you could substitute h3.

I feel compelled to note that heading styles should NOT be used in lieu of properly-formatted STYLING. Headers are not for stylistic purposes. I have seen this used, randomly and incorrectly, in far too many eBooks. It's particularly rampant in books that have (obviously) been coded in India, who fall prey to this particular wrongness.

Headers are not for looks. Headers are structural. ELEMENTS are structural. A word, for example, is subordinate to a sentence; a sentence is subordinate to a paragraph; the paragraph to the first heading in which it is enclosed, etc. This is one of the first things that Cap taught me, way back, when I first ventured into ePUBs, rather than MOBI. Id' used header styling (for something, it's been so many years, I can't recall now--pre-2010, for a certainty) and I was sternly lectured. Rightly so.

Headers tell documents--I don't care whether we're talking about Word, LibreOffice, OO, Scrivener, Bob's Big Word Processor, ePUBs, MOBI's, etc., that this particular element defines a structural part of a document. An H2, for example, is not necessarily smaller than an H1; but it is subordinate to it in the structure of the document. You can make an H2 LOOK any way you want it to; you could make it twice the size of an H1, for that matter.

Do not think about how something LOOKS, particularly when you use headings; think about what it IS. The SELECTOR (p, h1, blockquote) is what something IS, and how it relates, structurally, to the entire file/document. The DECLARATION (color:red;text-align:center to mooch from w3schools, tells the document what the ELEMENT looks like.

SEE? This is a PARAGRAPH, no matter how BIG IT IS.

PLEASE, oiver: do not use headings, blockquotes, etc., in lieu of proper styling, just to achieve an appearance. That's incorrect coding.

</lecture>

I think you need to get a basic understanding of HTML and CSS.

Take a read through Pablo's My Quick and Dirty ePub Tutorial. (While it covers an older version of Sigil, the basics are still applicable).

^^^ + 100

Is there any damned way we can make this STICKY, at the top of the forum? Or move these "I don't know anything about html/css/ePUB" threads to the Workshop, where they belong? That's where folks ought to be, who don't know anything about HTML or CSS. It's not banishment; I'm not trying to be mean, or cranky; it's just that they're likely to get more help, over there, than here, as that's what it's for, and the posters there are looking to answer just these types of questions. I've just spent 30 minutes reading through the Sigil forums, and about 80% of the new(ish) posts have NOTHING to do with Sigil; they're basic HTML/CSS/how-to-make-an-ePUB type questions. I mean, one of them was a question about tables, and it turned out the poster's CSS was all Calibre classes!

Ducks, my one Twoo wuv, perhaps you could consider a sticky, telling folks to take beginner questions to the beginner's forum? ?????

Hitch

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Hitch

Is there any damned way we can make this STICKY, at the top of the forum? Or move these "I don't know anything about html/css/ePUB" threads to the Workshop, where they belong? That's where folks ought to be, who don't know anything about HTML or CSS. It's not banishment; I'm not trying to be mean, or cranky; it's just that they're likely to get more help, over there, than here, as that's what it's for, and the posters there are looking to answer just these types of questions. I've just spent 30 minutes reading through the Sigil forums, and about 80% of the new(ish) posts have NOTHING to do with Sigil; they're basic HTML/CSS/how-to-make-an-ePUB type questions. I mean, one of them was a question about tables, and it turned out the poster's CSS was all Calibre classes!

Ducks, my one Twoo wuv, perhaps you could consider a sticky, telling folks to take beginner questions to the beginner's forum? ?????

Hitch

We have a beginners forum?

IMHO xHTML/CSS questions probably belong in EPUB and it would not hurt for THAT to have a 'beginners' sub forum

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by theducks

We have a beginners forum?

IMHO xHTML/CSS questions probably belong in EPUB and it would not hurt for THAT to have a 'beginners' sub forum

We have a Workshop forum. Isn't that the Beginners forum?

ETA: the description/sub-heading for the Workshop says:

Scanning your first book? Need general conversion tips? Or just confused over the plethora of formats? Let us know and we'll do our best to help

Am I dense, or doesn't that sound like the Beginners forum?

Hitch

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Hitch

We have a Workshop forum. Isn't that the Beginners forum?

ETA: the description/sub-heading for the Workshop says:



Am I dense, or doesn't that sound like the Beginners forum?

Hitch

Color ME dense

[Toxaris]

Originally Posted by Hitch

...

Headers are not for looks. Headers are structural. ELEMENTS are structural. A word, for example, is subordinate to a sentence; a sentence is subordinate to a paragraph; the paragraph to the first heading in which it is enclosed, etc. This is one of the first things that Cap taught me, way back, when I first ventured into ePUBs, rather than MOBI. Id' used header styling (for something, it's been so many years, I can't recall now--pre-2010, for a certainty) and I was sternly lectured. Rightly so.

Headers tell documents--I don't care whether we're talking about Word, LibreOffice, OO, Scrivener, Bob's Big Word Processor, ePUBs, MOBI's, etc., that this particular element defines a structural part of a document. An H2, for example, is not necessarily smaller than an H1; but it is subordinate to it in the structure of the document. You can make an H2 LOOK any way you want it to; you could make it twice the size of an H1, for that matter.
...
do not use headings, blockquotes, etc., in lieu of proper styling, just to achieve an appearance. That's incorrect coding.
...

So true, so true. There is a big difference between structure and styling. If anything, I feel there is too few structure option for eBooks (although DocBook is way too much).
That is also part of the reason why I detest the <em> and <strong> tags over the <i> and <b> tags. The one is about structure, the other about styling and mean something different. They are not the same! I don't mind the tags themselves, but their incorrect usage.

[Notjohn]

Originally Posted by Toxaris

That is also part of the reason why I detest the <em> and <strong> tags over the <i> and <b> tags. The one is about structure, the other about styling and mean something different. They are not the same! I don't mind the tags themselves, but their incorrect usage.

Bravo!

(Actually, I mind the tags, and I never use them. It's <i> and <b> for me!)

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Toxaris

So true, so true. There is a big difference between structure and styling. If anything, I feel there is too few structure option for eBooks (although DocBook is way too much).
That is also part of the reason why I detest the <em> and <strong> tags over the <i> and <b> tags. The one is about structure, the other about styling and mean something different. They are not the same! I don't mind the tags themselves, but their incorrect usage.

+1

[Turtle91]

Originally Posted by Toxaris

They are not the same! I don't mind the tags themselves, but their incorrect usage.

I for one use <em> and <strong> in place of <i> and <b> because of advice on this forum a couple years ago. I simply put "em {font-style:italic}" and "strong {font-weight:bold}" in my css.

I understand that it equates to the same thing, but using the <em> and <strong> tags is structurally correct at the same time allowing me to style them with css. The argument being that I could easily change the style by changing the css. I know that the vast majority of ePub 2 devices default to italic/bold, but if I wanted to enable options for an audible device...ie <em> = slightly louder volume (or something) then I would have to go and change all of those <i> tags if I had used them since they are a purely visual style. Also if I have a word that needs to be emphasized within a paragraph of italic text, then the emphasis would have to be styled differently than just <i>...I could use "em em {font-style:normal; font-weight:600}" (or something).

Also according to the W3 Schools website:

Tips and Notes

Note: According to the HTML 5 specification, the <b> tag should be used as a LAST resort when no other tag is more appropriate. The HTML 5 specification states that headings should be denoted with the <h1> to <h6> tags, emphasized text should be denoted with the <em> tag, important text should be denoted with the <strong> tag, and marked/highlighted text should use the <mark> tag.
Tip: You can also use the CSS "font-weight" property to set bold text.

Is there any particular reason we SHOULD use <b> and <i>?...other than it being fewer characters...I have heard the mantra many times "Structure in the html, style in the css." and <b>/<i> seem to be purely style...which shouldn't go in the html. Please correct me if I am wrong...I'm still a padiwon and bow to the masters!