Arrr, Another Pirate - Page 2

arjaybe · 02-04-2014, 01:53 PM

I'd like to check the site out. Could someone post the URL please?

crich70 · 02-04-2014, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arjaybe

I'd like to check the site out. Could someone post the URL please?

If you google Cromag's name (as he mentioned in an earlier post) you will find the youtube link in the results and the link is at the youtube page. I don't want to give them validation or potentially get in trouble with the mods by posting a direct link.

HarryT · 02-04-2014, 02:27 PM

Moderator Notice
Please don't post links to copyright-infringing material.

Thanks!

cromag · 02-04-2014, 03:02 PM

In all fairness, I don't how many others (if any) were made without permission. They do seem to have notes of thanks from some authors.

I have "cooled off" a bit -- thanks for the words of advice. My current plan is to send them an email requesting an explanation before further action. I don't especially want to give them my regular email address, so I've set up a new account (which includes the word "copyright") at gmail for this purpose.

crich70 · 02-04-2014, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Please don't post links to copyright-infringing material.

Thanks!

I certainly wasn't going to. In fact all I did was to repeat what cromag himself had said in one of his posts.

I figured it was much like the issue of discussing DRM (i.e. just tell them to look for AA) as it is against the rules to go into any detail on the board. And Cromag has got links to his actual smashwords page in his postings so that end of things is covered.

arjaybe · 02-04-2014, 04:05 PM

I figured out how to find cromag's real name. Okay, I'm a little slow.-) On the site there were more credits for the person reading the story than there were for the author, but there was a link to the original ebook (Amazon.)

cromag, keep us posted. I'd like to know how they justify themselves.

Ken.Hagdal · 02-05-2014, 07:30 AM

Quote:

To purchase a high-definition copy of this story and others we have produced, with no introductory tags, visit our store here:

Quote:

Why donate to xxx
Our narrators, producers and authors do not get directly compensated for the work they do. Your generous donations ensure that they are rewarded for their efforts, and with more support, we are able to write, produce and publish stories more often, and of higher quality.
(...)
Invest in the future of Chilling Tales for Dark Nights – your generous support will allow our members to make this their full-time job, and this will result in more stories being posted more often.

Honor or thank the individuals involved that have provided you with the entertainment you enjoy for free every day.
(...)
Please join in supporting the work of Chilling Tales for Dark Nights. Our many producers, narrators and authors appreciate your help and commitment.

They lie to their visitors about compensating authors since they never contacted you. Basically, their business plan is to make a living off of works stolen from (at least some of) the authors featured, while using the free audiobooks on YT for promotional purposes.

cromag · 02-05-2014, 12:00 PM

I'm not a very prolific author. I have a couple new stories approaching completion, but right now this is the only story I actually sell (except on Amazon, which doesn't permit me to offer stories for free), so giving it away to generate publicity doesn't make much sense right now.

I assumed this was an aggressive tactic to get permission.

crich70 · 02-05-2014, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken.Hagdal

They lie to their visitors about compensating authors since they never contacted you. Basically, their business plan is to make a living off of works stolen from (at least some of) the authors featured, while using the free audiobooks on YT for promotional purposes.

It does sound like their idea of "donations" is the equivalent of the 5 finger discount. After all how can you be considered a contributor to their site if you didn't even know of its existence til after they had already had someone record it and post it to the site? Being a contributor means you agreed to let them do it which it sounds like Cromag didn't do.

cromag · 02-06-2014, 03:26 PM

An update.

First, the audio has been withdrawn -- at least temporarily.

I got a long email from the webmaster/executive producer at the site. He stated that their website is fairly new and that they are trying to be a legitimate market for short horror fiction.

The beginning of the email was pretty apologetic. According to him, they received my story as a submission at their website by someone using my name and claiming to be me. That person provided links to my Smashwords author page and the story at Amazon. They performed a Google search -- but that only confirmed that someone with my name wrote that story. He didn't go into detail, but he did say that they were apparently "swindled."

By the end of the email he was a bit defensive. He pointed out that two people have represented themselves as me and how does he know who is who. He asked me for some proof that I am who I say I am, and that I own the copyright.

My first response was to log into my account at Smashwords and take a screenprint of my profile, clearly showing that I have the ability to edit my biography, change my account details, etc.

But this poses an interesting problem. If someone using your name sold the rights to one of your stories ... how would you prove that it was your story, and that you are you?

This story is an interesting case. I wrote it 35 years ago, which means I wrote it on a typewriter (an Olivetti Editor II, a wonderful machine). In the years since then I moved four times, but somewhere in my crawlspace I probably still have the onionskin carbon copies (there go the young kids, off to Wikipedia), a copy of the check from the magazine (with a conditional endorsement granting "First North American Serial Rights") and my correspondence with various editors. It would be a pain in the butt, but I might be able to find it.

But today I do all of my writing on a computer. How would I demonstrate that my .doc file was the original?

(There's probably a story in there!)

ApK · 02-06-2014, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crich70

Just common courtesy I would think.

And...you know...the law.

arjaybe · 02-06-2014, 03:52 PM

If they want to be legitimate they're going to have to find a better way to validate copyright. The onus is on them.

ApK · 02-06-2014, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cromag

But this poses an interesting problem. If someone using your name sold the rights to one of your stories ... how would you prove that it was your story, and that you are you?

Not a new problem. How do you know that person offering you Brooklyn Bridge really owns it? How do you get permission to drill for oil on Jed Clampet's land?
What stops me from calling the phone company and having your phone disconnected? (there's a fun story behind that one....)

The owner of this web site in this case might actually have some sort of good faith argument that he believed he had permission to post the video.
You can CERTAINLY prove you are you if need be, and if someone were to SELL the right to one of your stories, the BUYER better be able to show due diligence in knowing where his money was going, who was signing the contract and that he was not buying hot property. The bad kind of hot, not the good kind. Otherwise, easy-peasy lawsuit victory for you.

crich70 · 02-06-2014, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApK

And...you know...the law.

Touche. And the gentleman with the website does have a point as well. It is probably very easy to impersonate the legitimate owner of anything now days what with how we can all get access to a ton of information about one another. The horror stories we've all heard about where someone's identity is stolen by someone else is testimony to the downside of our modern digital world. Still I can't help but wonder, if the man had been given a link to Cromag's Smashwords page how is it he didn't notice that the story he used for the audio was the only one of the three that was being charged for? I mean the other two stories were listed as free and the one he is being offered is the one that has a dollar amount attached and he doesn't wonder why he's being offered the use of it for free? Where is the logic in charging for something and yet giving someone else the use of it for no charge?

gmw · 02-07-2014, 08:14 AM

Hmmm ... it's an interesting problem. If you look at the way we sign up to Smashwords and Amazon etc., there's not a lot of verification going on that I'm aware of. Although in those cases they are acting as distributors, the submitter still bears the full responsibility for what they submit.

In the offending website situation, I believe, the administrator should have attempted contact with the author using details available NOT obtained from the unsolicited contact. eg: Follow the links from the Smashwords page etc. to the website or Facebook page and send a message from there. This is pretty similar to the advice to type URLs for your bank and PayPal etc. rather than clicking on links in emails. Don't trust what you didn't solicit, verify it independently.

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02-04-2014, 01:53 PM	#16
arjaybe Wizard Posts: 1,069 Karma: 12500000 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Okanagan Device: Sony PRS-650, Kobo Clara	I'd like to check the site out. Could someone post the URL please?

02-04-2014, 02:27 PM	#18
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383099 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	Moderator Notice Please don't post links to copyright-infringing material. Thanks!

02-04-2014, 03:02 PM	#19
cromag Surfin the alpha waves ~~ Posts: 26,301 Karma: 459765791 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: New Jersey Device: Jetbook Lite & Mini, Nook STR, Kobo, Hanvon N516, Kindle 2, Androids	In all fairness, I don't how many others (if any) were made without permission. They do seem to have notes of thanks from some authors. I have "cooled off" a bit -- thanks for the words of advice. My current plan is to send them an email requesting an explanation before further action. I don't especially want to give them my regular email address, so I've set up a new account (which includes the word "copyright") at gmail for this purpose.

02-04-2014, 04:05 PM	#21
arjaybe Wizard Posts: 1,069 Karma: 12500000 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Okanagan Device: Sony PRS-650, Kobo Clara	I figured out how to find cromag's real name. Okay, I'm a little slow.-) On the site there were more credits for the person reading the story than there were for the author, but there was a link to the original ebook (Amazon.) cromag, keep us posted. I'd like to know how they justify themselves.

02-05-2014, 12:00 PM	#23
cromag Surfin the alpha waves ~~ Posts: 26,301 Karma: 459765791 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: New Jersey Device: Jetbook Lite & Mini, Nook STR, Kobo, Hanvon N516, Kindle 2, Androids	I'm not a very prolific author. I have a couple new stories approaching completion, but right now this is the only story I actually sell (except on Amazon, which doesn't permit me to offer stories for free), so giving it away to generate publicity doesn't make much sense right now. I assumed this was an aggressive tactic to get permission.

02-06-2014, 03:26 PM	#25
cromag Surfin the alpha waves ~~ Posts: 26,301 Karma: 459765791 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: New Jersey Device: Jetbook Lite & Mini, Nook STR, Kobo, Hanvon N516, Kindle 2, Androids	An update. First, the audio has been withdrawn -- at least temporarily. I got a long email from the webmaster/executive producer at the site. He stated that their website is fairly new and that they are trying to be a legitimate market for short horror fiction. The beginning of the email was pretty apologetic. According to him, they received my story as a submission at their website by someone using my name and claiming to be me. That person provided links to my Smashwords author page and the story at Amazon. They performed a Google search -- but that only confirmed that someone with my name wrote that story. He didn't go into detail, but he did say that they were apparently "swindled." By the end of the email he was a bit defensive. He pointed out that two people have represented themselves as me and how does he know who is who. He asked me for some proof that I am who I say I am, and that I own the copyright. My first response was to log into my account at Smashwords and take a screenprint of my profile, clearly showing that I have the ability to edit my biography, change my account details, etc. But this poses an interesting problem. If someone using your name sold the rights to one of your stories ... how would you prove that it was your story, and that you are you? This story is an interesting case. I wrote it 35 years ago, which means I wrote it on a typewriter (an Olivetti Editor II, a wonderful machine). In the years since then I moved four times, but somewhere in my crawlspace I probably still have the onionskin carbon copies (there go the young kids, off to Wikipedia), a copy of the check from the magazine (with a conditional endorsement granting "First North American Serial Rights") and my correspondence with various editors. It would be a pain in the butt, but I might be able to find it. But today I do all of my writing on a computer. How would I demonstrate that my .doc file was the original? (There's probably a story in there!)

02-06-2014, 03:52 PM	#27
arjaybe Wizard Posts: 1,069 Karma: 12500000 Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Okanagan Device: Sony PRS-650, Kobo Clara	If they want to be legitimate they're going to have to find a better way to validate copyright. The onus is on them.

02-07-2014, 08:14 AM	#30
gmw cacoethes scribendi Posts: 5,818 Karma: 137770742 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Australia Device: Kobo Aura One & H2Ov2, Sony PRS-650	Hmmm ... it's an interesting problem. If you look at the way we sign up to Smashwords and Amazon etc., there's not a lot of verification going on that I'm aware of. Although in those cases they are acting as distributors, the submitter still bears the full responsibility for what they submit. In the offending website situation, I believe, the administrator should have attempted contact with the author using details available NOT obtained from the unsolicited contact. eg: Follow the links from the Smashwords page etc. to the website or Facebook page and send a message from there. This is pretty similar to the advice to type URLs for your bank and PayPal etc. rather than clicking on links in emails. Don't trust what you didn't solicit, verify it independently.

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