PW: Conspiracy Fines detailed, so far...

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

No gunpoint. But it was hardly a free choice when the "industry standard contract" was the only way to be respectably published.
Not totally unlike the Hollywood casting couch; submit or go home.

This!

[FizzyWater]

Originally Posted by Kumabjorn

Seriously? They can do that?
Or is it a spoof?
Sorry, from this side of the pond it is hard to know.

When AT&T was broken up for abusing its monopoly, the actual customers received "gift cards" that could only be used at AT&T pay phones. I seem to remember my share was 3 gift cards, distributed over 3 months, of $5 each.

Since there were no AT&T pay phones near me, they were worthless to me and went unused.

So, oh yeah, they can do exactly that, if that's how the settlement was approved.

[Kumabjorn]

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

When AT&T was broken up for abusing its monopoly, the actual customers received "gift cards" that could only be used at AT&T pay phones. I seem to remember my share was 3 gift cards, distributed over 3 months, of $5 each.

Since there were no AT&T pay phones near me, they were worthless to me and went unused.

So, oh yeah, they can do exactly that, if that's how the settlement was approved.

Amazing, or rather surreal. With all the legalistic options available to Americans they still much get away with anything. I remember a case in Japan where the CEO had to travel to ten different cities and apologize publicly, usually in front of the central train station, the actual town center in most Japanese cities.

[kennyc]

Well, we know who's REALLY in charge in 'merika!
and it ain't 'we the people'

[Kumabjorn]

Originally Posted by kennyc

Well, we know who's REALLY in charge in 'merika!
and it ain't 'we the people'

That pretty much goes for anywhere, I was just, naively I suppose, under the impression that you could stand up to corporations more strongly in the US than in many other places.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by Kumabjorn

That pretty much goes for anywhere, I was just, naively I suppose, under the impression that you could stand up to corporations more strongly in the US than in many other places.

We can.
But they get to fight back and they usually have the better lawyers.
The good guys don't always win big.
And judges are lawyers too, not economists or engineers or doctors. What seems perfectly reasonable to a judge doesn't always match reality.

In this case, Judge Cote is a veteran of these kinds of disputes so there is some hope she'll impose penalties with some bite, unlike the EU's "naughty, naughty... don't do it again" "penalty".

For example, I'd like for her to remember that Apple's success came at the expense of other, non-Amazon, retailers like Books on Board and B&N's Fictionwise. Some reparations are due those folks.

They can sue, but since Apple has infinite litigation funds it is no sure thing.

[John F]

... Notably, the letter includes the total damage awards calculated by the states and lists the amount publishers agreed to pay as a percentage of those damages. In that regard, the deals look pretty good for the initial three settling publishers (Hachette, HarperCollins, and Simon & Schuster). Hachette was calculated to be on the hook for a total of $62,280,000, but has paid $32,686,165, roughly 52% of what it was liable for. HarperCollins paid $20,168,710, about 65% of $31,140,000 it was assessed for. And Simon & Schuster was on the hook for $42,920,000, and paid $18,303,551 or 42% of assessed damages.

Penguin and Macmillan, meanwhile, appear to have paid a premium for being the last two publishers to settle claims. Penguin, which struck a deal just days before Apple's June trial, agreed to pay $75 million to settle calculated damages of $62,128,000, or 121% of its assessed liability. Macmillan, which settled in March, paid $20 million to settle damage claims of $18,515,000—or, 108% of their liability. ...

I guess crime does pay. Just settle early and your good to go.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by John F

I guess crime does pay. Just settle early and your good to go.

In price-fixing cases the first to roll over always makes out like a bandit.
In this case, the ones who didn't settle kept the racket going an extra six months and got to rip off consumers longer. Hence, bigger penalties.
Not that any of them are actually penalized.

[speakingtohe]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

No gunpoint. But it was hardly a free choice when the "industry standard contract" was the only way to be respectably published.
Not totally unlike the Hollywood casting couch; submit or go home.

Part of my point in the last paragraph, which was poorly stated I admit, was that authors who have signed contracts that say they can never publish elsewhere, or not for the next x books are generally signed by an author who thinks it is a good deal. A bit of a gamble that this is the best deal that they will get.

My understanding, which could be wrong, is that the standard boiler plate contract is for 1-3 books. An author who signs up for a longer term has no choice now, but they probably did when they signed this type of exclusivity contract.

Helen

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Kumabjorn

Amazing, or rather surreal. With all the legalistic options available to Americans they still much get away with anything. I remember a case in Japan where the CEO had to travel to ten different cities and apologize publicly, usually in front of the central train station, the actual town center in most Japanese cities.

Let's just say that much of what has been said in this thread is a rather biased take on things. First off, as far as the settlement goes, in most settlements of this kind, the people who were allegedly injured, i.e. the customer, almost always only gets a coupon. The vast majority of the money goes to the lawyers (or government in this case).

Also, keep in mind, in this case, the publishers never admitted wrong. They simply paid the government money to make it go away since it's cheaper and or less risky than going to court. There are several industries within the legal profession that are based on this reality.

[theducks]

In many cases only the Lawyers win
The injured gets a pittance.

[Andrew H.]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

Let's just say that much of what has been said in this thread is a rather biased take on things. First off, as far as the settlement goes, in most settlements of this kind, the people who were allegedly injured, i.e. the customer, almost always only gets a coupon. The vast majority of the money goes to the lawyers (or government in this case).

Also, keep in mind, in this case, the publishers never admitted wrong. They simply paid the government money to make it go away since it's cheaper and or less risky than going to court. There are several industries within the legal profession that are based on this reality.

Originally Posted by theducks

In many cases only the Lawyers win
The injured gets a pittance.

The majority - the vast majority - of the money in these cases always goes to the injured parties; the lawyers share is usually at 10-15% - and it will be less in this case since it was brought by governments. However, when you have millions of injured parties, the settlement than any individual gets will almost always be pretty small compared to the overall amount in question.

[Kumabjorn]

Originally Posted by theducks

In many cases only the Lawyers win
The injured gets a pittance.

Is that the reason lawyers go for class action suits?

[pwalker8]

You betcha. A single class action lawsuit can rake in millions of dollars for the lawyers and an individual plaintiff might end up with a $1 coupon. That's how John Edwards, ex US Presidential Candidate, made his millions. The percentage of the settlement that the lawyers get is part of the negotiation process and goes up depending on how many hours are billed to the case. I've read of cases that went to court and after all the appeals were done, the lawyer ended up with between a third and half.

[Kumabjorn]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

You betcha. A single class action lawsuit can rake in millions of dollars for the lawyers and an individual plaintiff might end up with a $1 coupon. That's how John Edwards, ex US Presidential Candidate, made his millions. The percentage of the settlement that the lawyers get is part of the negotiation process and goes up depending on how many hours are billed to the case. I've read of cases that went to court and after all the appeals were done, the lawyer ended up with between a third and half.

Guess I'm just a dumb European, I thought the judicial system was about justice, not get-rich-fast schemes.