20 things you (probably) didn't know about Science Fiction

[carandol]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

Since when is a three-part epic poem a novel?
______
Dennis

And also, how can it be science fiction before the existence of science?

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by carandol

And also, how can it be science fiction before the existence of science?

That would depend on how you define science, and why you think it didn't exist until after the 1200s.

I was quoting Larry Niven. He said that The Inferno was the first SF in that it was based in the most up to date understanding of the world at that time.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

That would depend on how you define science, and why you think it didn't exist until after the 1200s.

I'll go with the late Susan Sontag's definition: science is the process of disproving theories.

I was quoting Larry Niven. He said that The Inferno was the first SF in that it was based in the most up to date understanding of the world at that time.

Niven might consider it SF, but I don't believe he considered it a novel.
______
Dennis

[Sparrow]

"The Illustrated Book of Science Fiction Lists" by Mike Ashley suggests the following ten candidates for earliest SF works:

1) 'The Epic of Gilgamesh' - c.2100 BC
2) 'The Odyssey', Homer - c.750 BC
3) 'The Birds', Aristophanes - 414 BC
4) 'Timaios' and 'Critias', Plato - c.350 BC
5) 'Heliopolis', Iamboulos - c.260 BC
6) 'The Argonautica', Apollonios - c.250 BC
7) 'Somnium Scipianus', Marcus Cicero - 45 BC
8) 'Facies in Orbe Lunare', Plutarch - c.100 AD
9) 'Of Marvels Beyond Thule', Antonius Diogenes - c.100 AD
10) 'Alethes Historia', Lucian of Samosata - c.170 AD

[Sparrow]

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

The form of the modern science-fiction motion picture traces its roots to Fritz Lang's Metropolis. ... To date, every "big budget" science fiction movie, and most of the small ones, owes its heritage to this movie.

Not sure I agree with that. I can think of SF films that don't seem directly related to 'Metropolis' (except in a very broad sense) - 'Incredible Shrinking Man', 'Alien', 'Solaris', 'Andromeda Strain', 'Next', 'Fantastic Voyage', 'E.T.', 'Jurassic Park' etc.

It's possible to find loose connections between any films - perhaps it could be argued that Jurassic Park has a mad scientist (or at least a scientist who does a mad thing), and Metropolis has a mad scientist too - but then so did Frankenstein which predates Metropolis. And, in purely cinematic terms, Jurassic Park and Metropolis don't seem to have much in common.

So, I'd contend the SF tropes in Metropolis were not themselves original; and the cinematic influence of Metropolis is not apparent in "every" big-budget sf movie - all imho of course .

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

Not sure I agree with that. I can think of SF films that don't seem directly related to 'Metropolis' (except in a very broad sense) - 'Incredible Shrinking Man', 'Alien', 'Solaris', 'Andromeda Strain', 'Next', 'Fantastic Voyage', 'E.T.', 'Jurassic Park' etc.

It's possible to find loose connections between any films - perhaps it could be argued that Jurassic Park has a mad scientist (or at least a scientist who does a mad thing), and Metropolis has a mad scientist too - but then so did Frankenstein which predates Metropolis. And, in purely cinematic terms, Jurassic Park and Metropolis don't seem to have much in common.

So, I'd contend the SF tropes in Metropolis were not themselves original; and the cinematic influence of Metropolis is not apparent in "every" big-budget sf movie - all imho of course .

I was admittedly making a broad statement. I was suggesting that Metropolis ' elements became iconic of SF movies in general, not that every movie was made "like" metropolis. In fact, I should have added "technology run amok" to that list of elements... silly me!

Of the movies you mentioned, The Incredible Shrinking Man certainly breaks every tenet of the aforementioned template... although it could arguably be covered under "technology run amok," as that caused the crisis of the story. Many of the other "B" horror movies of that same era, like Them, similarly use the "tech run amok" element to create their menace, and have no other connection to SF.

Others that break those tenets might include Gattaca, Soylent Green, and Vanilla Sky. They are part of a separate movement in SF, represented by movies like Solaris, where technology and futuristic elements clearly take second place to the characters and their stories/motivations.

Of the others, they are obviously not "like" Metropolis, but they still use at least a few of the elements that were iconic to that movie. As time went by, other elements were added to the list of SF "icons," such as space travel in aircraft- or boat-like ships, ray guns, and aliens. ET borrowed from 2 of those later elements, plus the orchestral score.

Labs with incomprehensible displays, flashing lights and computers, were all prominent in Jurassic Park, Solaris (both versions), Fantastic Voyage, Alien, and The Andromeda Strain. Alien included a menacing robot.

Again, I'm not suggesting that these movies deliberately borrowed from Metropolis... just that those iconic elements of SF that they used were largely created for Metropolis originally.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

I did not address Next... personally, I'm not sure if subjects like people with unique mental powers could be considered SF or fantasy (like traditional superhero powers). If you consider it to be SF, then yes, it also breaks the aforementioned tenets. Next is less the iconic SF movie, and more the iconic adventure movie (main character with unique abilities saves the day), which is the way I would consider it.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

Did you know that (Crichton) wrote his first books during med school? Apparently he didn't have enough to do.

Scary, isn't it?

[DaleDe]

More trivia probably known to most of you:

1. Andre Norton is a pen name for Alice Mary North. She wrote other books under here own name but considered that the audience for SF wouldn't buy books written by a woman.

2. Not a singe SF author predicted that the first moon visit would be televised.

Dale

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by DaleDe

More trivia probably known to most of you:

1. Andre Norton is a pen name for Alice Mary North. She wrote other books under here own name but considered that the audience for SF wouldn't buy books written by a woman.

Nope.

She was born Alice Mary Norton, and legally changed her name to Andre Alice Norton in 1934. "Andrew North" was a pen name she used, as was Andre Norton and Allen Weston.
______
Dennis

[Sparrow]

The shortest SF story is "Why Booth Did Not Shoot Lincoln" by Ed Wellen; it appeared in Orbit 15, Damon Knight (ed.) in 1974, and is completely blank.

(Does anyone get it?? Maybe it's some sort of pun on 'blank' page/bullet?)

The shortest SF love story ever written is the cleverly titled "The Shortest Science Fiction Love Story Ever Written" by Jeff Renner ("F & SF", March 1964).
It's 9 words long.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

The shortest SF story is "Why Booth Did Not Shoot Lincoln" by Ed Wellen; it appeared in Orbit 15, Damon Knight (ed.) in 1974, and is completely blank.

(Does anyone get it?? Maybe it's some sort of pun on 'blank' page/bullet?)

Since Booth did shoot Lincoln, how long would a piece about why he didn't be?
______
Dennis

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

SF can be credited with the creation of the 20th century "superhero" genre. Prior to 1900, detectives, cowboys, soldiers, and myths (like Paul Bunyan) dominated adventure stories. The growing popularity of SF in literature and movies led to the first heroes with "superhuman" abilities based on elements taken from science fiction, including alien origins or artifacts, advanced gadgets or tools, and powers obtained from lab experiments (or accidents). Their popularity in turn crowded out most non-superhero characters, and forced others to be altered to suit the new SF geist.

The first superhero costumes drew heavily from illustrator Alex Raymond's costume designs for the Flash Gordon newspaper strip, featuring capes, boots, chest insignias, bright colors and swashbuckling lines.

[Bob Russell]

Originally Posted by Sparrow

The shortest SF love story ever written is the cleverly titled "The Shortest Science Fiction Love Story Ever Written" by Jeff Renner ("F & SF", March 1964).
It's 9 words long.

Quite a coincidence you bring this up. Yours truly has written the shortest dark sci-fi story of the decade. It's my first piece of fiction -- "Another Shortest Story" by Bob Russell. Nine words. I'm still looking for a publisher.

Sam piloted his fusion rocket... into a black hole.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Bob Russell

Quite a coincidence you bring this up. Yours truly has written the shortest dark sci-fi story of the decade. It's my first piece of fiction -- "Another Shortest Story" by Bob Russell. Nine words. I'm still looking for a publisher.

Ever read Barry Malzberg's _Galaxies_?

It's a novel about a space liner falling into a black hole. Only it isn't, quite: as Malzberg explains, the writing techniques required to truly describe the experience won't even exist until the late 24th century, so it's more of a series of notes toward what such a novel might be...

Lots of fun in an odd handedly brilliant package.
______
Dennis