Foul play and big brother behavior from Amazon regarding failed book update

[jgaiser]

Originally Posted by johnnyb

The big brother behavior I referred to is their ignorance as regards the statement on the preservation of highlights etc they made. They won't admit that they have made a mistake, they just stay vague.

Inigo Montoya: You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

[johnnyb]

Originally Posted by jgaiser

Inigo Montoya: You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Ask him if he's every heard of metonyms, synecdoche and extended metaphors. According to some these are the "tools" that made sure we wouldn't remain monkeys forever, so please stop your trolling and trying to derail the thread...

[OtterBooks]

Even on the phone they would simply declare that they are sorry but they cannot do anything and they don't know what happened.

So they know that something went wrong. They don't know how or why it happened, nor how to reverse the loss of your data. Now what?

[jgaiser]

Originally Posted by johnnyb

Ask him if he's every heard of metonyms, synecdoche and extended metaphors. According to some these are the "tools" that made sure we wouldn't remain monkeys forever, so please stop your trolling and trying to derail the thread...

I see... We make up meanings to phrases and use other big words to justify those meanings. Thanks. Time to ignore this one.

[DMB]

Did you call general Amazon CS or Kindle CS? When I had a problem I found that a) the latter is better, and b) I still had to make 3 separate calls before I got to someone in possession of a brain and fully clued up.

[johnnyb]

Originally Posted by DMB

Did you call general Amazon CS or Kindle CS? When I had a problem I found that a) the latter is better, and b) I still had to make 3 separate calls before I got to someone in possession of a brain and fully clued up.

ok, I'll retry...
thx for the advice!
btw thx to everyone for their advice so far, is it that you're now as interested as me to find out what Amazon actually has to say about this affair? ;-)

[johnnyb]

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

So they know that something went wrong. They don't know how or why it happened, nor how to reverse the loss of your data. Now what?

Well, that's maybe part of the problem. To make a change like this (from "annotations will be lost" to "annotations will be preserved") is maybe a huge deal. So, in order to make something like this available, it probably needs testing (or should have been extensively tested), but it hasn't. As a professional, relying on Amazon's services, I want to find out if I can rely on them in the future or if they have grown so big that indeed one hand has not the slightest clue anymore what the other is doing and all ends up in a huge mess like here...
And if that's the case, I want to consider leaving the Kindle thing for good, I guess their books will work equally well as liberated and epub'ed ones on a Sony 950 or T1...

[vxf]

Originally Posted by johnnyb

Ask him if he's every heard of metonyms, synecdoche and extended metaphors. According to some these are the "tools" that made sure we wouldn't remain monkeys forever, so please stop your trolling and trying to derail the thread...

Your post makes no sense. The use of 'big brother' in that context was a mistake, no matter what word you use to define it - and no, it was neither a metonym, nor a syndechoche or a methaphor of any kind. More like, if you allow me the highly-technical term, a [language edit - moderation].


To the OP - you truly have reason to be upset. I would be as well and their behavior, while not 'big brotherish', is certainly unacceptable.

As for switching to SONY - their new desktop software does not support annotations taken with previous devices (up to last year's models) and the old software is no longer available from their website. In other words, unless you still have a copy of the old software somewhere (came pre-loaded on the old devices), you won't be able to retrieve any annotations, no matter how many backup copies you have. In my case, I have the software, but I think it shows how easy it is to lose your notes.

Also, SONY's notes in the last patch for their desktop software suggest deleting old content to facilitate syncing. SONY readers tend to slow down when they have too many notes stored, so many users download those to their PCs. But now SONY is telling us to delete old content... so, where am I supposed to 'put' my notes? Any guesses?

Really, in this fight for standards, the only 'safe' option is to annotate on some device that allows embedding notes into PDFs or whatnot (ipad, for example). Relying on any closed system is scary.

Not that I don't think you should be pissed. But next time...

[JeremyR]

Unfortunately, unless you call Amazon's customer service, it's pretty much worthless.

I've never understood that, why does an online company not provide proper support online?

[vxf]

Originally Posted by JeremyR

Unfortunately, unless you call Amazon's customer service, it's pretty much worthless.

I've never understood that, why does an online company not provide proper support online?

Once I had an HP CS tell me he could not process my return because his PC wouldn't boot...

[johnnyb]

Originally Posted by vxf

Your post makes no sense. The use of 'big brother' in that context was a mistake, no matter what word you use to define it - and no, it was neither a metonym, nor a syndechoche or a methaphor of any kind. More like, if you allow me the highly-technical term, a [language edit - moderation].


To the OP - you truly have reason to be upset. I would be as well and their behavior, while not 'big brotherish', is certainly unacceptable.

As for switching to SONY - their new desktop software does not support annotations taken with previous devices (up to last year's models) and the old software is no longer available from their website. In other words, unless you still have a copy of the old software somewhere (came pre-loaded on the old devices), you won't be able to retrieve any annotations, no matter how many backup copies you have. In my case, I have the software, but I think it shows how easy it is to lose your notes.

Also, SONY's notes in the last patch for their desktop software suggest deleting old content to facilitate syncing. SONY readers tend to slow down when they have too many notes stored, so many users download those to their PCs. But now SONY is telling us to delete old content... so, where am I supposed to 'put' my notes? Any guesses?

Really, in this fight for standards, the only 'safe' option is to annotate on some device that allows embedding notes into PDFs or whatnot (ipad, for example). Relying on any closed system is scary.

Not that I don't think you should be pissed. But next time...

I will not engage in elaborate discussion of the works of Lakoff, Fauconnier et al but will just raise the question: why do big brother establishments "watch everything"? There must be reasons. Here is to be found the meaning of the tropic extension of the term.

On another note, thanks for your update on Sony policies. You could export your notes (you're surely aware of that) and store them somewhere, there's a button. Something I couldn't do (at least this is not part of the official procedure suggestions).

But you are correct, customers in e-reading are dependent on corporations arbitrary design decisions that are more geared towards attracting more customers with bells and whistles than to provide a stable system for existing ones. Or they assume that all people are reading are _The Hunger Games_...

[CommonReader]

Originally Posted by vxf

As for switching to SONY - their new desktop software does not support annotations taken with previous devices (up to last year's models) and the old software is no longer available from their website. In other words, unless you still have a copy of the old software somewhere (came pre-loaded on the old devices), you won't be able to retrieve any annotations, no matter how many backup copies you have. In my case, I have the software, but I think it shows how easy it is to lose your notes.

..and then we haven't even yet started to talk about their decision to stop supporting BBeB. Excellent way to get rid of a loyal user base, Sony. I may just as well switch to Cybook or whomever, whenever my 650 stops working (which hopefully isn't going to happen in the foreseeable future).
Entrusting serious work to these proprietary formats designed for consumer use is a serious mistake.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by jgaiser

I see... We make up meanings to phrases and use other big words to justify those meanings. Thanks. Time to ignore this one.

[Apache]

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

OMG! Did Amazon hire Peggy for their CS department?

My wife was on with our insurance company and finally resorted to talking to a supervisor. She got disgusted with him and called him Peggy. He was not amused. But if the shoe fits.
Apache

[johnnyb]

Honestly, I must say, I'm impressed... Here's what I got yesterday:

I’m sorry about the difficulties you’ve had with your annotations. I have worked with our engineers and we think we have solved the annotation problem with your book titled The Importance of What We Care About: Philosophical Essays (ASIN:B000SETFRW). Make sure your device is connected to WiFi and then try opening the book again. If you still don’t see your annotations, try removing the book from your device and re-downloading it from your Archived Items. You should then see all the annotations that you had made. Let us know if this solves the problem for you.

Thanks for being a Kindle customer.

Best regards,

And did it work? Yes!