Moral and legal questions about using VPNs to avoid georestrictions

[EowynCarter]

Originally Posted by sabredog

Once you experience excessive geo restrictions, you might have a change of opinion.

Getting slowly better but nowhere quick enough.

Oh, I did. And found my way just by giving a fake US address.

[abookreader]

I've done it - I've never heard anybody put up a moral objection to it other than those who think it is morally wrong to ever lie or break a rule.

I remember reading an article about a year ago - I think it was Bookseller - where they had an opinion that it was probably some sort of fraud to give false information to a retailer in regards to your address. It'd be mind boggling to see a retailer suing a customer over it though.

"Amazon sues book buyers for falsely giving them money!!!!"

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by abookreader

I've done it - I've never heard anybody put up a moral objection to it other than those who think it is morally wrong to ever lie or break a rule.

I remember reading an article about a year ago - I think it was Bookseller - where they had an opinion that it was probably some sort of fraud to give false information to a retailer in regards to your address. It'd be mind boggling to see a retailer suing a customer over it though.

"Amazon sues book buyers for falsely giving them money!!!!"

It's more a case of booksellers being concerned about getting sued by publishers for selling books in areas that they have no contractual rights to sell. The bookseller has to show that they are taking reasonable precautions to prevent people buying who shouldn't be.

[Hellmark]

I know georestrictions aren't liked, but I am surprised there is not more debate on the matter.

Personally, I find it silly. I can order the paper book from anywhere I want, why prevent me from buying the ebook from anywhere I want. I shouldn't have to pretend to be a citizen of another country just to buy something.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by Hellmark

I know georestrictions aren't liked, but I am surprised there is not more debate on the matter.

Personally, I find it silly. I can order the paper book from anywhere I want, why prevent me from buying the ebook from anywhere I want. I shouldn't have to pretend to be a citizen of another country just to buy something.

Because, like DRM, it has been discussed into the ground.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Hellmark

I know georestrictions aren't liked, but I am surprised there is not more debate on the matter.

Personally, I find it silly. I can order the paper book from anywhere I want, why prevent me from buying the ebook from anywhere I want. I shouldn't have to pretend to be a citizen of another country just to buy something.

Georestrictions are a holdover from a physical book distribution system, and it made perfect (well mostly perfect) sense with physical books. But the publishers, especially those in more conservative or less savvy countries, can't figure out what to do about ebooks, and don't want to lose their shirts to other countries' forward thinking, so they are essentially holding up the gravy train by not cooperating in a global effort to work out new legal/contractual agreements.

I don't have a problem circumventing georestrictions, if it is the only way to get a book. I wouldn't do it just to save money, personally, but I wouldn't speak ill of someone who did. Eventually this problem will be worked out (just as the original geographic agreements were eventually settled), and this will be just another passed speed-bump on the road to an ebook future.

[TheSFReader]

Just an other POV : One of my preferred author sold the "restricted" (USA) rights to some of her books to an american publisher (who happens to sell on the web the book without georestrictions), and started self-publishing the same books through Amazon UK....

Now, The books are available at two different prices on different websites... Both are perfectly legitimate, and for one the publisher gets a cut, on the other not ... Bizarre situation !

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by TheSFReader

Now, The books are available at two different prices on different websites... Both are perfectly legitimate, and for one the publisher gets a cut, on the other not ... Bizarre situation !

For the same book to be sold by different publishers at different prices is an extremely common situation. It happens all the time with UK and US publishers of the same book.

[Hellmark]

Originally Posted by HarryT

For the same book to be sold by different publishers at different prices is an extremely common situation. It happens all the time with UK and US publishers of the same book.

Which makes little to no sense to me, especially if they don't remove the americanism or britishisms. I've compared text snippets ebooks and hashes with some of my british friends, and they'll get the same exact ebook sometimes, yet price will vary wildly.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Hellmark

Which makes little to no sense to me, especially if they don't remove the americanism or britishisms. I've compared text snippets ebooks and hashes with some of my british friends, and they'll get the same exact ebook sometimes, yet price will vary wildly.

Blame the authors. They are ones who sold separate rights to UK and US publishers. Filthy lucre at work, I'm afraid - they can generally make more money that way.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Blame the authors. They are ones who sold separate rights to UK and US publishers. Filthy lucre at work, I'm afraid - they can generally make more money that way.

You know, I can even understand that. But it still doesn't explain why a non-English speaking country is also banned from buying books...

[Hellmark]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Blame the authors. They are ones who sold separate rights to UK and US publishers. Filthy lucre at work, I'm afraid - they can generally make more money that way.

I was referring to when it is the same publisher.

[speakingtohe]

I've done it - I've never heard anybody put up a moral objection to it other than those who think it is morally wrong to ever lie or break a rule.

I remember reading an article about a year ago - I think it was Bookseller - where they had an opinion that it was probably some sort of fraud to give false information to a retailer in regards to your address. It'd be mind boggling to see a retailer suing a customer over it though.

"Amazon sues book buyers for falsely giving them money!!!!"

Like going to a store and giving them cash is illegal. (might be in a not to distant future)

I think geographical restrictions are a giant pacifier given to distributers/independant publishers to keep them happy until the large conglomerates have no further need of them.

Then they will all be wiped out with one fell swoop and the conglomerates will defend themselves by saying it is what the consumers demand.

Buying though a VPN is not unethical. Jaywalking is a far more serious offense as is running a red light, or even in many places, drinking a beer in your backyard, although they are common everyday occurences without all the angst and soul searching something this trivial evokes.

Helen

[Fbone]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Blame the authors. They are ones who sold separate rights to UK and US publishers. Filthy lucre at work, I'm afraid - they can generally make more money that way.

We've now seen cases where the US and Canada rights were separated.

[molman]

Interesting topic. I personally haven’t done the VPN thing for eBooks, but I would consider it if I couldn't get a book I really wished to read. Price I'm a little less sensitive to (within reason - the 25x more expensive in the OP is 'a lot').

I tend to feel similar to Andrew H and others in that it isn't illegal, and on a moral level you are paying for the product so I don’t see an issue. It's funny really, companies want all the benefits of globalisation and free trade (cheap labour, more markets etc..) whilst not really competing by creating artificial barriers.