Amazon needs to get their act together

[volwrath]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Vols fan, eh?

Hehe well they have kept life interesting lately

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Well, yes and no. There are some aspects of it that, frankly, don't matter to most people and never will. Not that there's anything wrong with that, I tend to be one of them in practice, but I'm not using it for citations, I'm using it to get an idea of how much I'm reading.

Calibre page counts are from a file markup analysis and are merely a convenience feature - one which I happen to use and like very much. It's not meant to duplicate Amazon's implementation, and it's not meant to be exact.

Everything you say above is true. To be honest I was using the page numbers for an example as much as anything. Everything that I read about the mobi format seems to indicate that there are issues with TOC as well as other formatting programs. As you correctly point out calibre page counts are for convenience, but due to the format, arent actually stored in the mobi file.

Most people wont notice any of this, but I noticed all of this, because I wanted to see pages left in chapter, which aren't feasible on mobi format, then I strugged forever to get chapter marks to show up on a converted epub through calibre (now Ive figured it out and its really easy ), then I had to figure out why some of my converted epubs showed page numbers and why some did not. And it was because sometimes I had my kindle plugged in transferring files and sometimes I used the @kindle.com address which wont generate/keep page numbers.

In all of this I found that I found epub easier to disect due to xml etc and think its time for a similar mobi format, although as I said earlier with the same DRM scheme

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

For specific pinpointing of part of a text, it's all about locations, locations, locations.

Is this actually true? Forget the calibre part for a moment, because those books have locations too, regardless of their page count status. To my knowledge, the nature of locations should make them consistent across devices. I mean, that's how Whispersync syncs furthest read and bookmarks. Can someone actually verify that the same book downloaded to different device versions (K1, K2, K3) show different results?

Yea they all sync up fine. The point was that the older firmware showed locations of 1214-1216. Newer K3 format appears to have abandoned the location range for a single value (maybe 1213), and if you hold your head right newer k3s MAY show pages as well as location.

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

All that aside, I do agree with your gripe about the TOC/chapter marker thing. Obviously it's too complicated because few publishers/indies seem to be doing it properly. Either that, or they don't care to do it properly. (I've done it, and I personally don't think it's that hard, but I'm not a publisher. )

So I guess my gripe on that isn't so much the mobi spec as it is the fact that people aren't using it.

Mobipocket created the format in 2000 and the format has aged relatively well but I think its time for amazon to embrace xml and make publishing mobi content easier. I think the title of the thread was harsher than I intended though.

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by bhartman36

So does that mean the page number reported on the Kindle is the actual page number of the print edition? I only have one book in both formats, and that book doesn't have page numbers in the Kindle edition.

Yes, if an Amazon book has been provided with a page number file (more and more are getting them every day), then they will match a specific print edition. If you look at this book on Amazon, down in the product info it shows the ISBN for the edition the page numbers were taken from.

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by volwrath

Yea they all sync up fine. The point was that the older firmware showed locations of 1214-1216. Newer K3 format appears to have abandoned the location range for a single value , and if you hold your head right newer k3s MAY show pages as well as location.

Ah, gotcha. Yeah, I'm not happy with the fact that I have to press the menu button to see the location info, but that's a software issue rather than a spec issue. The only thing that shows full-time is the percentage bar. I'd prefer a configurable display option, and I hope that will someday come to fruition.

Originally Posted by volwrath

Mobipocket created the format in 2000 and the format has aged relatively well but I think its time for amazon to embrace xml and make publishing mobi content easier. I think the title of the thread was harsher than I intended though.

I agree that advances/improvements can be made (although "improvement" can be subjective, as the page count issue illustrates beautifully). I find it hard to believe that they don't have people currently working on updating the spec, but I would be happier if they worked on making it easier for the current spec to be properly implemented by others. When mobi files processed with Amazon's OWN SOFTWARE come out looking like crap, there's more of a problem than just an XML deficiency.

Haha, my pet peeves are showing. I just know, in my heart of hearts, that even if Amazon made mobi the most amazing format on earth, many publishers and indie self-pubs would still do a crappy job of making their ebooks. I look at the amazing files that MR users upload to the library here, proving that with time and care, amazing ebooks can come out of the mobi format.

Amazon can start by helping Smashwords fix their Meatgrinder. There have been times I've downloaded nearly every available format for a book, trying to find the one that's the least mangled.

I don't know if I added anything to this discussion, but I sure do feel better now that I got that out of my system.

[mdovell]

The only reason why Ican see this being a major concern would be to get a better reach into educational markets.

It's easy to say "read chapter 1" but sometimes it might only be part of it and part of another. Formatting naturally can change things as fonts and spacing change.

I think eventually it will be sorted out.

That being said I like kindle more and more.

[DiapDealer]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

I find it hard to believe that they don't have people currently working on updating the spec, but I would be happier if they worked on making it easier for the current spec to be properly implemented by others.

Ding ding ding!

Beautiful ebooks can be designed in the mobi format... I've seen them. When it comes to what you can display, mobi is really only limited by the same things that affect most reflowable ebook formats. The only thing lacking with mobi (really, truly lacking) is the ability for neophytes to create fantastically formatted ebooks, easily... and conveniently.

There needs to be more convenient/efficient mobi creation software (with more documentation)—NOT new spec.

[bhartman36]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Yes, if an Amazon book has been provided with a page number file (more and more are getting them every day), then they will match a specific print edition. If you look at this book on Amazon, down in the product info it shows the ISBN for the edition the page numbers were taken from.

Thanks. That pretty much addresses the concern I had about page numbers (except for the fact that I wish all my e-books had them).

[volwrath]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Ah, gotcha. Yeah, I'm not happy with the fact that I have to press the menu button to see the location info, but that's a software issue rather than a spec issue. The only thing that shows full-time is the percentage bar. I'd prefer a configurable display option, and I hope that will someday come to fruition.

Yeah I agree. I also want, no NEED, number of pages left in chapter. That would keep me reading sometimes. Chapter markers do work but they are an imprecise science

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Haha, my pet peeves are showing. I just know, in my heart of hearts, that even if Amazon made mobi the most amazing format on earth, many publishers and indie self-pubs would still do a crappy job of making their ebooks. I look at the amazing files that MR users upload to the library here, proving that with time and care, amazing ebooks can come out of the mobi format.

Amazon can start by helping Smashwords fix their Meatgrinder. There have been times I've downloaded nearly every available format for a book, trying to find the one that's the least mangled.

I don't know if I added anything to this discussion, but I sure do feel better now that I got that out of my system.

Hey as long as you feel better, that is the main thing. While we are on petpeeves, I have another . I have some software on every device I own, and if I go forward too far, I screw up the sync. We need a way to automatically reset the sync or allow for a manual sync of last position. I cant believe this has festered soo long.

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by volwrath

While we are on petpeeves, I have another . I have some software on every device I own, and if I go forward too far, I screw up the sync. We need a way to automatically reset the sync or allow for a manual sync of last position. I cant believe this has festered soo long.

Feeling better? I'll be honest, I only read on my Kindle, so I can't relate, but I can definitely see how that would be a pain. There was a thread a while back about that, but I don't recall the details and my search-fu is failing me.


Have you always had your location in your profile? Cuz I've seen your posts around but never noticed it till today, and it's not something I would normally overlook. I like seeing where various posters are from, and I think my city would have stood out had I seen it.

[volwrath]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Feeling better? I'll be honest, I only read on my Kindle, so I can't relate, but I can definitely see how that would be a pain. There was a thread a while back about that, but I don't recall the details and my search-fu is failing me.

Yea it is a pain, but I found a manual workaround which is probably around here on mobileread, but this site explains it and it works : http://www.40tech.com/2011/01/04/how...n-your-kindle/

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Have you always had your location in your profile? Cuz I've seen your posts around but never noticed it till today, and it's not something I would normally overlook. I like seeing where various posters are from, and I think my city would have stood out had I seen it.

You know thats a very good question and to be honest I am not sure. I just got an ipad not long ago, and I may have changed it then. I intended (somewhat) for it to be a main reader but it has too many distractions. I find a dedicated ereader is much better for reading for me than a device that can do a myriad of things. Nonetheless, it is awesome to meet a fellow Nashvillian on the boards

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by volwrath

Yea it is a pain, but I found a manual workaround which is probably around here on mobileread, but this site explains it and it works : http://www.40tech.com/2011/01/04/how...n-your-kindle/

Oh, irony, sweet irony - I can't find a thread on MobileRead, but you post a link to an article that explains directions that came from a thread on MobileRead.

Good info, nice find! Is that info in the Wiki here on MR? (I'd search, but that doesn't seem to be my strong point today.) If not, maybe you could add it, since you've actually done it.

Originally Posted by volwrath

You know thats a very good question and to be honest I am not sure. I just got an ipad not long ago, and I may have changed it then. I intended (somewhat) for it to be a main reader but it has too many distractions. I find a dedicated ereader is much better for reading for me than a device that can do a myriad of things. Nonetheless, it is awesome to meet a fellow Nashvillian on the boards

Yes, it is awesome and rare to find someone so local on here. We do have a few regular Tennesseans, but I don't know of anyone else in Nashville who's currently active.

It's good that you have a variety of devices - you probably have some good info for people on the "Which one should I buy?" forum. I, on the other hand, am a Kindle specialist. (That's not to say I'm an expert, only that I've specialized ) I'm also certain that calibre will help me take over the world, all without having to master regex. Okay, maybe not.

[volwrath]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Oh, irony, sweet irony - I can't find a thread on MobileRead, but you post a link to an article that explains directions that came from a thread on MobileRead.

Good info, nice find! Is that info in the Wiki here on MR? (I'd search, but that doesn't seem to be my strong point today.) If not, maybe you could add it, since you've actually done it.

Whats even more ironic is that I didnt notice that it referenced a thread from mr

[terencek]

Um, haven't we had this page-numbering debate at least half a dozen times awreddy? If you want page numbers for .mobi files, put them in with the Calibre plug-in. If you don't, don't....