Amazon says 'will have to capitulate and accept Macmillan's terms'

[dmikov]

Originally Posted by Lemurion

DRM costs should be included in the price because a business that doesn't cover the all the costs of production in the price of its products will go out of business. Buyers are then free to decide whether to buy the product or not depending on how well the price matches their idea of its value.

Just because DRM'd books are worth less to many buyers, myself included, does not mean it doesn't get factored in when setting the price.

Can I ask you where you got the idea/numbers that indicate that it's publishers, that foot the bill for DRM. With Amazon proprietary DRM, Sony/Adobe etc. I would imagine the DRM is footed by a retailer, same as storage/IT/Bandwidth cost. So the cost to publisher for ebook production (not book production, yeah you have to edit it) is zero.
What I also don't get, is that authors on average (from multiple posts) gets 2-3 bucks per book, are you saying that editing the book is more expensive or time consuming? Cause the publisher tries to charge $7-8 per book for it in agent model.

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by dmikov

What I also don't get, is that authors on average (from multiple posts) gets 2-3 bucks per book, are you saying that editing the book is more expensive or time consuming? Cause the publisher tries to charge $7-8 per book for it in agent model.

IIRC, authors get $2-3 per book for hardcovers; I believe it's less than that for paperbacks. (I'm pretty sure they're not making 30% of list price on paperbacks.)

[mcl]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

IIRC, authors get $2-3 per book for hardcovers; I believe it's less than that for paperbacks. (I'm pretty sure they're not making 30% of list price on paperbacks.)

They make less per item for PBs, but PBs sell in higher volume over time.

[Daithi]

Closer to 65 cents on a $8.00 paperback.

[crewpsu]

Well just spent an hour or so reading through all 17 pages of this post. I'd like to ask what makes people think that Macmillan or any other publisher in the big 6, wants to see ebooks succeed? There is a whole infrastructure out there based on paper books, libraries, brick and mortar book stores, mom and pop book stores, book tours, etc. that each of the big 6 publishers is heavily invested in. I purchased a Kindle mainly due to the fact Amazon had the best prices around on ebooks. I can not see paying as much for an electronic copy of a book (or anything for that mater) when for the same price I can purchase a physical copy of that book. If ebook prices go up to what a hard back book costs, or even a paperback, I believe that would crush the ebook market.

[kennyc]

Originally Posted by crewpsu

Well just spent an hour or so reading through all 17 pages of this post. I'd like to ask what makes people think that Macmillan or any other publisher in the big 6, wants to see ebooks succeed? There is a whole infrastructure out there based on paper books, libraries, brick and mortar book stores, mom and pop book stores, book tours, etc. that each of the big 6 publishers is heavily invested in. I purchased a Kindle mainly due to the fact Amazon had the best prices around on ebooks. I can not see paying as much for an electronic copy of a book (or anything for that mater) when for the same price I can purchase a physical copy of that book. If ebook prices go up to what a hard back book costs, or even a paperback, I believe that would crush the ebook market.

And that is probably MacMillan's intent given the reports.

Authors should RUN not walk away!

[mcl]

Originally Posted by kennyc

And that is probably MacMillan's intent given the reports.

Authors should RUN not walk away!

But the problem is this: Insist, or even hint at authors standing up for themselves and requesting better contract terms, or shopping themselves around a bit, and suddenly they'll glom onto that publisher like they're a liferaft full of food, gold, and virgins.

[kjk]

Originally Posted by mcl

But the problem is this: Insist, or even hint at authors standing up for themselves and requesting better contract terms, or shopping themselves around a bit, and suddenly they'll glom onto that publisher like they're a liferaft full of food, gold, and virgins.

Rather insulting generalization of authors.

[mcl]

Originally Posted by kjk

Rather insulting generalization of authors.

And yet, it's the behavior I've observed. Even suggest that the author could have gotten a better deal elsewhere, or that they're not being treated utterly fairly by their publisher, and the author will defend to his/her death the honor of that publisher.

Even when faced with plan facts, like Macmillan's 5% payout reduction.

Even when, at all other times, the author is complaining about how little money they make as an author, and how little their titles sell, and how hard it is to put food on the table, and how they have to work 2 extra jobs just to make ends meet.

Hint for one second that it doesn't have to be that way, and suddenly the publisher's Santa Claus, being an author is wonderful, and they wouldn't dream of having it any other way.

[Daithi]

Originally Posted by crewpsu

Well just spent an hour or so reading through all 17 pages of this post. I'd like to ask what makes people think that Macmillan or any other publisher in the big 6, wants to see ebooks succeed? There is a whole infrastructure out there based on paper books, libraries, brick and mortar book stores, mom and pop book stores, book tours, etc. that each of the big 6 publishers is heavily invested in. I purchased a Kindle mainly due to the fact Amazon had the best prices around on ebooks. I can not see paying as much for an electronic copy of a book (or anything for that mater) when for the same price I can purchase a physical copy of that book. If ebook prices go up to what a hard back book costs, or even a paperback, I believe that would crush the ebook market.

I don't think they do want to see ebooks suceed.

[bwaldron]

Originally Posted by Daithi

I don't think they do want to ebooks to suceed.

They don't. Well -- they'd be happy for them to succeed at hardback prices, sure.

[Lemurion]

Originally Posted by bwaldron

They don't. Well -- they'd be happy for them to succeed at hardback prices, sure.

Publishers want ebooks to succeed, they absolutely hate the current returns system.

However, the industry runs on very thin margins, which means there isn't a lot of room for taking risks. Amazon has much higher profit margins, especially thanks to the Amazon marketplace, and so they can afford to take more risks.

[guyanonymous]

Does anyone have any profit figures for various publishing houses (the more years the better) and #units moved during the same time?

[JSWolf]

The problem is that I've seen way too many eBooks not get the price lowered when the paperback is released. How do we know that MacMillan will stay on top of prices and actually lower them when the paperback is released? We don't. And we have too much evidence of prices not lowering then lowering.

[llreader]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The problem is that I've seen way too many eBooks not get the price lowered when the paperback is released. How do we know that MacMillan will stay on top of prices and actually lower them when the paperback is released? We don't. And we have too much evidence of prices not lowering then lowering.

A very important point. If people buy at the inflated prices, they won't. At some point, though, some publisher will find the "sweet spot" and then everyone else will eventually fall in line. But that could take a while.