Do grammatical errors bother you? - Page 17

bobavey · 10-27-2010, 02:01 PM

Friends and acquaintances are always asking me to read a book, or manuscript that someone they know has written. I always warn them that I'm a writer, not an editor but they proceed anyway.

One friend brought me a book that her sister had written and was going to have published by what she thought was a legitamte publisher. I recognized the name of the publisher and tried to warn them but they would not listen.

When the book came out, I was given a copy. Again, I'm no editor, but I did not get past the first page when I began to see numerous errors.

Cyberman tM · 10-27-2010, 04:55 PM

To add my proverbial 2 cents and more:

Errors mainly bother me if they break the flow - I usually do not read so much word by word as continually - going from word to word without really touching separate words. (Not sure if that is understandable?)
When one word doesn't fit the expected pattern, it throws me out of the loop - I have to reread the sentence, trying to gather the meaning.

New idioms or lazy words (alot, btw, ...) aren't a problem for me - while "their/they're" is. (And of course, those two-letter abominations like "u" and "ur" - I actually convinced myself to never pronounce them as intended, but read them like their letters - since english isn't my native language, it works quite well - the writer then sounds like an idiot :-)

Also, the same goes for misplaced commas and the like. Again, it is mainly my personal preference I guess, but since I imagine a comma to be a "pause" of sorts, I only mind them when they break the flow, by being placed somewhere they don't belong).
(I HAVE been told I use them too often, though. So I suppose not everyone agrees with me - perhaps I'm using them all wrong?)

SpiderMatt · 10-27-2010, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lady Fitzgerald

"Ain't" is also in the dictionary but even dictionaries will admit, despite common usage, it is incorrect. Try using "hone in" for "home in" in any English class and, same as if you used "ain't," you will get called on it.

The difference is that "ain't" is specified as slang in dictionaries and for whatever reason is seen as a more base form of English. "Hone in," on the other hand, is noted as having becoming normal usage.

SeaBookGuy · 10-27-2010, 09:14 PM

The biggest problem I have with books would be choppy writing, rather than mechanics:

"Frank couldn't stand bologna. Lola should've known that by now. Nothing he could do about it now, but Frank was pissed. Frank wondered why he put up with Lola if she didn't get him by now ...."

tdmsu · 10-27-2010, 10:00 PM

The thing that bothers me the most is when people use extra apostrophes... seems they don't teach how to use them anymore. Many of my students have problems with their/they're as well.
I teach social studies, but I still help them with their language structure issues, too.

woolythought · 10-28-2010, 12:12 AM

You're right, Ravensknight. I was editing my daughter's essay, and found out that rule for commas before or after quotation marks changed (depending on usage). Apparently now they are ALWAYS after the quotation mark. ick! Wrong!
Let's not get into "he has another think ...... er, thing ...... coming". I've seen it both ways. Of course we all know the right way is the way I say it. <grin>.
I think I'm OCD about this .. sometimes I just want to plug it into a text converter and correct it.
Woolythought

nomesque · 10-28-2010, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SneakySnake

And your point is?

Igmorance and acceptamce eventually becones correct because it sounds similar?

Ironically enough, yes - language is typically evolved by the lower classes who don't have as much 'edumacation' and have no interest in maintaining the etymological status quo.

(phew - the only thing that saves that sentence from being unbearably poncy is the Simpsons reference...

)

SneakySnake · 10-28-2010, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomesque

Ironically enough, yes - language is typically evolved by the lower classes who don't have as much 'edumacation' and have no interest in maintaining the etymological status quo.

(phew - the only thing that saves that sentence from being unbearably poncy is the Simpsons reference...

)

What? Now you are a snob?

A pox on your snootiness. There are loads of us from the lower classes that have managed to 'get edumacated real good'

nomesque · 10-28-2010, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SneakySnake

What? Now you are a snob?

A pox on your snootiness. There are loads of us from the lower classes that have managed to 'get edumacated real good'

Snooty AND a snob - what a mix!

GeoffC · 10-28-2010, 05:51 AM

"Elements of Style" By William Strunk & E.B. White, recommended reading by the UK's Open University ( Distance learning ), doesn't explicitly mention a convention as to where punctuation / quote marks are placed; but each example has the punctuation within the quote marks.

"Four score and seven years ago." And all the acclamations on the rear cover use the same.
As do most of the contributors to The Times (UK) newspaper.

I must admit that until I read this book, and also contributed to this thread, that I was not conscious of any convention. School is obviously far too long ago for me to drag up any memories of what I was, or was not, taught to do.

ShortNCuddlyAm · 10-28-2010, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SneakySnake

What? Now you are a snob?

A pox on your snootiness. There are loads of us from the lower classes that have managed to 'get edumacated real good'

This is what happens when you become a best selling author

GeoffC · 10-28-2010, 08:31 AM

Somewhat topical - BBC link

Pronunciation changes.

Leslie · 10-28-2010, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeoffC

"Elements of Style" By William Strunk & E.B. White, recommended reading by the UK's Open University ( Distance learning ), doesn't explicitly mention a convention as to where punctuation / quote marks are placed; but each example has the punctuation within the quote marks.

It's sitting on my shelf as we speak from college days. I even pulled it out a few weeks ago while editing a book for someone to check if I was correct. I also found that whatever way you want the rule to go as to what is grammatically correct can be found on the world wide web. I use contractions while talking and typing emails, but in a novel it just bothered me. The other editor I was working with was adament about keeping them.

Um, I will admit that in school I would "correct" books I checked out from the library with a pencil or pen. That probably caused more problems for future readers than if they had not noticed the editorial overlook.

JackNolte · 10-28-2010, 02:41 PM

Yeah, it bothers me. But you know, it also bothers me when a lot readers don't realize when an author is intentionally breaking the rules for effect. Voice trumps grammar. Just my opinion, of course.

radleyp · 10-28-2010, 03:20 PM

In an earlier discussion with HarryT in this thread, someone wrote the word "verbally" (i.e. in words, written or spoken) for "orally" (i.e. spoken). I have long found this use of "verbally" irritating as it does not express what is meant, and "orally" is what should be used.

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10-27-2010, 02:01 PM	#241
bobavey Bob Avey Posts: 117 Karma: 501082 Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Broken Arrow, OK Device: none	Friends and acquaintances are always asking me to read a book, or manuscript that someone they know has written. I always warn them that I'm a writer, not an editor but they proceed anyway. One friend brought me a book that her sister had written and was going to have published by what she thought was a legitamte publisher. I recognized the name of the publisher and tried to warn them but they would not listen. When the book came out, I was given a copy. Again, I'm no editor, but I did not get past the first page when I began to see numerous errors.

10-27-2010, 04:55 PM	#242
Cyberman tM Evangelist Posts: 439 Karma: 2248782 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Austria Device: Inkbook Prime; Icarus Illumina;ImcoV6l;EB600;Kobo	To add my proverbial 2 cents and more: Errors mainly bother me if they break the flow - I usually do not read so much word by word as continually - going from word to word without really touching separate words. (Not sure if that is understandable?) When one word doesn't fit the expected pattern, it throws me out of the loop - I have to reread the sentence, trying to gather the meaning. New idioms or lazy words (alot, btw, ...) aren't a problem for me - while "their/they're" is. (And of course, those two-letter abominations like "u" and "ur" - I actually convinced myself to never pronounce them as intended, but read them like their letters - since english isn't my native language, it works quite well - the writer then sounds like an idiot :-) Also, the same goes for misplaced commas and the like. Again, it is mainly my personal preference I guess, but since I imagine a comma to be a "pause" of sorts, I only mind them when they break the flow, by being placed somewhere they don't belong). (I HAVE been told I use them too often, though. So I suppose not everyone agrees with me - perhaps I'm using them all wrong?)

10-27-2010, 09:14 PM	#244
SeaBookGuy Can one read too much? Posts: 2,029 Karma: 2487799 Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Naples, FL Device: Kindle PW 3, Sony 350 and 650	The biggest problem I have with books would be choppy writing, rather than mechanics: "Frank couldn't stand bologna. Lola should've known that by now. Nothing he could do about it now, but Frank was pissed. Frank wondered why he put up with Lola if she didn't get him by now ...."

10-27-2010, 10:00 PM	#245
tdmsu Enthusiast Posts: 42 Karma: 10 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Michigan, USA Device: Onyx Boox Nova2	The thing that bothers me the most is when people use extra apostrophes... seems they don't teach how to use them anymore. Many of my students have problems with their/they're as well. I teach social studies, but I still help them with their language structure issues, too.

10-28-2010, 12:12 AM	#246
woolythought Junior Member Posts: 3 Karma: 10 Join Date: Oct 2010 Device: Nook	You're right, Ravensknight. I was editing my daughter's essay, and found out that rule for commas before or after quotation marks changed (depending on usage). Apparently now they are ALWAYS after the quotation mark. ick! Wrong! Let's not get into "he has another think ...... er, thing ...... coming". I've seen it both ways. Of course we all know the right way is the way I say it. <grin>. I think I'm OCD about this .. sometimes I just want to plug it into a text converter and correct it. Woolythought

10-28-2010, 05:51 AM	#250
GeoffC Chocolate Grasshopper ... Posts: 27,599 Karma: 20821184 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Scotland Device: Muse HD , Cybook Gen3 , Pocketbook 302 (Black) , Nexus 10: wife has PW	"Elements of Style" By William Strunk & E.B. White, recommended reading by the UK's Open University ( Distance learning ), doesn't explicitly mention a convention as to where punctuation / quote marks are placed; but each example has the punctuation within the quote marks. "Four score and seven years ago." And all the acclamations on the rear cover use the same. As do most of the contributors to The Times (UK) newspaper. I must admit that until I read this book, and also contributed to this thread, that I was not conscious of any convention. School is obviously far too long ago for me to drag up any memories of what I was, or was not, taught to do.

10-28-2010, 08:31 AM	#252
GeoffC Chocolate Grasshopper ... Posts: 27,599 Karma: 20821184 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Scotland Device: Muse HD , Cybook Gen3 , Pocketbook 302 (Black) , Nexus 10: wife has PW	Somewhat topical - BBC link Pronunciation changes.

10-28-2010, 02:41 PM	#254
JackNolte Mystery writer Posts: 29 Karma: 510210 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Oregon Device: Nook, Kindle, iPad	Yeah, it bothers me. But you know, it also bothers me when a lot readers don't realize when an author is intentionally breaking the rules for effect. Voice trumps grammar. Just my opinion, of course.

10-28-2010, 03:20 PM	#255
radleyp Evangelist Posts: 499 Karma: 20623 Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: North Salem & NYC, NY Device: Kindle Global, iphone4, ipad	In an earlier discussion with HarryT in this thread, someone wrote the word "verbally" (i.e. in words, written or spoken) for "orally" (i.e. spoken). I have long found this use of "verbally" irritating as it does not express what is meant, and "orally" is what should be used.

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