How can we convince Amazon to sell ePub format? - Page 15

KenJackson · 12-30-2010, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew H.

Even if Amazon went to epub, I think that they would use their own DRM, as I doubt that that they will want to pay adobe a royalty for each DRM'd book they sell. In fact, I'm sure they don't want to.

My guess is that that is exactly the issue. They may be privately biting their nails while desperately trying to figure out a way to be able to conveniently sell DRM-corrupted ebooks to Sony, Kobo and Nook owners without surrendering control to a third party--Adobe.

And I'm sure a big part of the technical difficulty is that they would need to have a piece of software installed on those ereaders--whose makers won't be thrilled about handing over some control to a company that is trying to drive them out of business.

I'm a capitalist who thoroughly appreciates any company's right to protect it's investment and ability to do business. But all this posturing over how to best restrict the customer's freedom is disgusting.

ProfCrash · 12-30-2010, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenJackson

My guess is that that is exactly the issue. They may be privately biting their nails while desperately trying to figure out a way to be able to conveniently sell DRM-corrupted ebooks to Sony, Kobo and Nook owners without surrendering control to a third party--Adobe.

And I'm sure a big part of the technical difficulty is that they would need to have a piece of software installed on those ereaders--whose makers won't be thrilled about handing over some control to a company that is trying to drive them out of business.

I'm a capitalist who thoroughly appreciates any company's right to protect it's investment and ability to do business. But all this posturing over how to best restrict the customer's freedom is disgusting.

They are not restricting your freedom. You are free to buy what e-reader you want. You are free to buy the books you want from the stores that sell books for your e-reader. There are people who would take it one step further and say that fair use gives you the freedom to buy from any store and convert the e-book to work on your device.

You are upset because you don't like a business decision that Amazon has made and that business decision is clearly affecting your ability to do what you want.

If you want access to Amazons e-books and you don't want to strip DRM, then use one of the many Kindle apps that are available or buy a Kindle. If not, live with the decision you made to buy a different device and not use the app.

This reminds me of the freaking boycott topics at other sights. You are free to pay the price that is asked or not. If you don't want to pay that price then you don't buy that book. Complaining about the price because it is more then you want to pay is silly. Complain about the sale of one format over the other is silly.

Why are you stamping your feet? You made a decision based on what you thought works best for you. Live with that decision and stop thinking that the world has to bend to your desires. Download an app and read the books you want. Buy a Kindle and read the books you want. Don't do either and buy the books from a bookstore that sells EPub and read what you want. If those stores don't have the books that you want, complain to them about the fact that they don't have the books you want.

KenJackson · 12-30-2010, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Why are you stamping your feet? You made a decision based on what you thought works best for you. Live with that decision and stop thinking that the world has to bend to your desires.

Don't you want to make the world a better place? What on earth could possibly be wrong with encouraging others to insist that the store we want to shop at cater to our needs and even our whims?

ProfCrash · 12-30-2010, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenJackson

Don't you want to make the world a better place? What on earth could possibly be wrong with encouraging others to insist that the store we want to shop at cater to our needs and even our whims?

Goodie. Then I can insist on BN selling books in Mobi format so I can read them on my Kindle. I won't buy anything from BN until BN does this. Same for Sony and Kobo.

The one time a book was not available for sale by Amazon I didn't complain that BN, which had the book stupid Penguin/Amazon dust up, would not sell me that book in Mobi format. Why? Because I know that BN sells EPub and I chose to by a Kindle which uses Mobi.

I dealt with it. My choice, I live with the consequences.

You chose a Sony and in doing so chose a device that cannot read books sold at Amazon on your device. Now you have the freedom to complain that you cannot buy books for the device that you freely choose to buy. Call Sony and ask them to sell the books that you want so you don't have to shop at Amazon.

All this thread makes me do is chuckle and be thankful I bought a Kindle because I have never felt like I have to shop elsewhere. My books have been available for me at competitive prices. I know because I checked before I bought my DXG.

Buy a Kindle or download the app so you can use Amazon. Otherwise be happy with the device that you bought even if you cannot buy books from Amazon.

screwballl · 12-30-2010, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

They are not restricting your freedom. You are free to buy what e-reader you want. You are free to buy the books you want from the stores that sell books for your e-reader. There are people who would take it one step further and say that fair use gives you the freedom to buy from any store and convert the e-book to work on your device.

You are upset because you don't like a business decision that Amazon has made and that business decision is clearly affecting your ability to do what you want.

If you want access to Amazons e-books and you don't want to strip DRM, then use one of the many Kindle apps that are available or buy a Kindle. If not, live with the decision you made to buy a different device and not use the app.

This reminds me of the freaking boycott topics at other sights. You are free to pay the price that is asked or not. If you don't want to pay that price then you don't buy that book. Complaining about the price because it is more then you want to pay is silly. Complain about the sale of one format over the other is silly.

Why are you stamping your feet? You made a decision based on what you thought works best for you. Live with that decision and stop thinking that the world has to bend to your desires. Download an app and read the books you want. Buy a Kindle and read the books you want. Don't do either and buy the books from a bookstore that sells EPub and read what you want. If those stores don't have the books that you want, complain to them about the fact that they don't have the books you want.

I may not agree with you on much but this point I agree 100%

KenJackson · 12-30-2010, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Goodie. Then I can insist on BN selling books in Mobi format so I can read them on my Kindle. I won't buy anything from BN until BN does this. Same for Sony and Kobo.

You are plenty welcome to start your own thread with that line of thinking. And I promise not to ask you why you are stamping your feet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

You chose a Sony and in doing so chose a device that cannot read books sold at Amazon on your device. Now you have the freedom to complain that you cannot buy books for the device that you freely choose to buy. Call Sony and ask them to sell the books that you want so you don't have to shop at Amazon.

Allow me to reach back through the pages and pages of posts in this thread to figure out what it was the OP was saying. Here it is. Oh look! He seems to actually like Amazon and is looking for a way to communicate with them as if he thinks there must be a "How may we serve you better?" link but he just can't find it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenJackson

But the result is that I can't buy books at my favorite book site any more. Amazon is a wonderful website. I'm always pleased if I can buy something from them instead of anywhere else because they have lots of information and are easy to buy from (and the ship fast, though that's moot for eBooks).

But I can't find any place on their website where they are looking for feedback or suggestions or input. Did I miss it? How can I tell them that I wish they would sell books in .epub format too?

It's an excellent website. Which makes this one ugly blemish all the more gross to behold and thoroughly worthy of discussion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Otherwise be happy with the device that you bought even if you cannot buy books from Amazon.

That sounds like a polite way to say shut up. If this thread bothers you in any way, I recommend you click on the Unsubscribe link.

OtterBooks · 12-30-2010, 07:42 PM

Quote:

The one time a book was not available for sale by Amazon I didn't complain that BN, which had the book stupid Penguin/Amazon dust up, would not sell me that book in Mobi format. Why? Because I know that BN sells EPub and I chose to by a Kindle which uses Mobi.

I dealt with it. My choice, I live with the consequences.

Same thing happened to me. It probably would have happened the other way around eventually had I gone with an epub device, too. Oh well. There is no reader I know of that natively uses the format and drm of every electronic book ever created. If that happens eventually, great.

Seems like some people equate this to a hospital refusing to carry their blood type.

ProfCrash · 12-30-2010, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenJackson

You are plenty welcome to start your own thread with that line of thinking. And I promise not to ask you why you are stamping your feet.

Allow me to reach back through the pages and pages of posts in this thread to figure out what it was the OP was saying. Here it is. Oh look! He seems to actually like Amazon and is looking for a way to communicate with them as if he thinks there must be a "How may we serve you better?" link but he just can't find it.

It's an excellent website. Which makes this one ugly blemish all the more gross to behold and thoroughly worthy of discussion.

That sounds like a polite way to say shut up. If this thread bothers you in any way, I recommend you click on the Unsubscribe link.

Call Kindle Customer Service and voice your opinion. It is a free call. I am sure there is an email address you can send it to. I am sure it will join the large pile of similar emails and phone calls and message board posts.

There is no blemish, there is a business decision you don't agree with. The site works great for millions of folks using Kindles and Kindle apps. The solution is easy enough and even free.

Catlady · 12-31-2010, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ProfCrash

Call Kindle Customer Service and voice your opinion. It is a free call. I am sure there is an email address you can send it to. I am sure it will join the large pile of similar emails and phone calls and message board posts.

There is no blemish, there is a business decision you don't agree with. The site works great for millions of folks using Kindles and Kindle apps. The solution is easy enough and even free.

Wow, why be so upset about a discussion?

I'm perfectly happy not to buy books from Amazon. I'm perfectly happy with my choice of an e-reader. I knew the implications of my choice before I made it. But I read threads like this because it astounds me that Amazon is willfully locking out longtime customers who decide not to buy a Kindle. I cannot wrap my head around how it is a sensible business move for Amazon to push me and my money away.

If Kindle supported epub, I probably would have bought a Kindle. If Amazon sold epub format, I would definitely buy e-books from Amazon--out of habit, if nothing else. Now I am shopping elsewhere. And that has carried over to physical books, as well--I've been buying them at the BN site now, because I'm at the BN site more frequently. How many people like me is Amazon losing?

Would I like to understand the logic behind Amazon's business decisons? Yes. Do I really care about them? No.

ProfCrash · 12-31-2010, 01:31 AM

As I see it. the assumption being made by most folks is that Amazon has made a poor business decision by not selling EPub books. I don't think that is the case. I think Amazon is the clear leader, maybe for the time being, in the US using Mobi. I think Amazon is making a tidy profit. If Amazon was not making a profit and they thought that the format was the issue, Amazon would change the format. Instead they added lending.

I don't think that Amazon would be doing that much better in France or Germany or Italy using EPUb because of the way the laws regarding sales and pricing of books even if Amazon sold EPub.

How is it any more sensible for BN to not sell books in Mobi format? They know that there are millions of people with Kindles who are buying books but they are not selling books to those customers. BN doesn't seem to care, and for the most part Kindle users don't seem to be complaining, so it is ok for them not to sell Mobi but it is wrong for Amazon not to sell EPub.

Both companies have made choices and yet one is deemed bad because a specific format is not used. If Amazon does control 75% of the ebook market in the US then who has made the worse choice?

What I get from reading these posts is that people who own Sony's, Nook's, and Kobo's want to be able to shop at Amazon and cannot do so easily. That tells me that Sony, BN, and Kobo Books are not able to meet all of their reading needs but that Amazon sells books that they would like to read.

My interpretation is that some folks, not all because I know plenty of folks who are happy with their EPub options, want the best of both worlds. They want the flexibility of EPub but for Amazon to sell the books that their bookstores are not.

mango · 12-31-2010, 02:24 AM

Well, I solved the problem, as far as I am concerned. I sent the Kindle back from whence it came. I now have a nice Sony PRS650.
See, I don't even really want to buy books. I want to borrow them and give them back. If there is one I MUST have, well, that is fine...I might even get it in paper and dust it.

The other problem with Amazon, as a Canadian, is that they seem to have some issues with certain publishers...or the publishers with them. Doesn't matter to me what or why. What I want to to be able to read certain Canadian authors, not sold by Amazon in the first place. You get them from Chapters/Indigo...which is where I buy most paper books anyway. so...the Sony is the right answer to me.

I am just a bit ticked that the wifi Sony is not useful in Canada. The Sony store mutters things about Verizon and I don't care. No clue when there will be a Canadian version of the Daily Edition. If I could use it, I would have one. so...for now...it will be the PRS650

There are lots of Canadians who read. ya know???? and library users too....

Of course, Amazon is free to do whatever they want...as I am. And so, there will be no amazon for me. oh well.

KenJackson · 12-31-2010, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mango

Well, I solved the problem, as far as I am concerned. I sent the Kindle back from whence it came. I now have a nice Sony PRS650.

Congratulations! A good choice.

mango · 12-31-2010, 02:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenJackson

Congratulations! A good choice.

I will let you know about that if and when it ever shows up. There isn't a one of them in sight around here....ordered it on line and sit and wait. I believe it is the right choice for me. I kind of regret that I can't use that nice Kindle with wifi...the Kobo has a screen I don't like so much....so, again, I sit and wait. on sale for 206 at Futureshop, BTW. you can get a rain check if none show up in the stores before the sale is over on Jan 6th. If I find one before that, well, that is a good thing. They have a decent return policy. If not...well, it will show up in the mailbox one of these days, I suppose.
In the meantime, maybe I can get some knitting done.

I think both Amazon and Sony are annoying. sort of like if you buy a samsung tv, you can only get this channel and if you buy a panasonic, you can get a different channel, but not the same one that you get with the samsung. I have a nice Bravia actually. oh well.

it is all nonsense to me. I chose not to have wifi because of my reading habits...and so....that is how it will go for now around here. Not having used Amazon much, it won't matter to me. Chapters will do fine.

murraypaul · 12-31-2010, 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OtterBooks

Same thing happened to me. It probably would have happened the other way around eventually had I gone with an epub device, too. Oh well. There is no reader I know of that natively uses the format and drm of every electronic book ever created. If that happens eventually, great.

Well, you could buy an iPad.
Or an Android tablet.
Oddly, the non-dedicated readers provide the best selection of books.
(No format is 'natively' supported on the iPad, in the sense of a reader coming preinstalled, but free apps are available for all current formats and DRMs)

screwballl · 12-31-2010, 10:02 AM

If you buy a Kindle, you know you cannot use EPUB format. If you purchase ebooks from Amazon, you know (or quickly learn) you cannot purchase anything in EPUB format.

Feel free to purchase your EPUB books elsewhere that does sell them, but do not expect or demand that a private business should be FORCED to do what you want them to. It is Amazons choice to not sell EPUB books at this time. That may change in the future but until then, sit down, send a request to Amazon yourself and quit complaining.

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12-31-2010, 01:31 AM	#220
ProfCrash Tea Enthusiast Posts: 8,554 Karma: 75384937 Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Somewhere in the USA Device: Kindle1, Kindle DX Graphite, K3 3G, IPad 3, PW2	As I see it. the assumption being made by most folks is that Amazon has made a poor business decision by not selling EPub books. I don't think that is the case. I think Amazon is the clear leader, maybe for the time being, in the US using Mobi. I think Amazon is making a tidy profit. If Amazon was not making a profit and they thought that the format was the issue, Amazon would change the format. Instead they added lending. I don't think that Amazon would be doing that much better in France or Germany or Italy using EPUb because of the way the laws regarding sales and pricing of books even if Amazon sold EPub. How is it any more sensible for BN to not sell books in Mobi format? They know that there are millions of people with Kindles who are buying books but they are not selling books to those customers. BN doesn't seem to care, and for the most part Kindle users don't seem to be complaining, so it is ok for them not to sell Mobi but it is wrong for Amazon not to sell EPub. Both companies have made choices and yet one is deemed bad because a specific format is not used. If Amazon does control 75% of the ebook market in the US then who has made the worse choice? What I get from reading these posts is that people who own Sony's, Nook's, and Kobo's want to be able to shop at Amazon and cannot do so easily. That tells me that Sony, BN, and Kobo Books are not able to meet all of their reading needs but that Amazon sells books that they would like to read. My interpretation is that some folks, not all because I know plenty of folks who are happy with their EPub options, want the best of both worlds. They want the flexibility of EPub but for Amazon to sell the books that their bookstores are not.

12-31-2010, 02:24 AM	#221
mango Junior Member Posts: 9 Karma: 26 Join Date: Dec 2010 Device: Sony PRS650	Well, I solved the problem, as far as I am concerned. I sent the Kindle back from whence it came. I now have a nice Sony PRS650. See, I don't even really want to buy books. I want to borrow them and give them back. If there is one I MUST have, well, that is fine...I might even get it in paper and dust it. The other problem with Amazon, as a Canadian, is that they seem to have some issues with certain publishers...or the publishers with them. Doesn't matter to me what or why. What I want to to be able to read certain Canadian authors, not sold by Amazon in the first place. You get them from Chapters/Indigo...which is where I buy most paper books anyway. so...the Sony is the right answer to me. I am just a bit ticked that the wifi Sony is not useful in Canada. The Sony store mutters things about Verizon and I don't care. No clue when there will be a Canadian version of the Daily Edition. If I could use it, I would have one. so...for now...it will be the PRS650 There are lots of Canadians who read. ya know???? and library users too.... Of course, Amazon is free to do whatever they want...as I am. And so, there will be no amazon for me. oh well.

12-31-2010, 10:02 AM	#225
screwballl NewKindler Posts: 504 Karma: 1865773 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: NWFL Device: Kindle3 Wifi	If you buy a Kindle, you know you cannot use EPUB format. If you purchase ebooks from Amazon, you know (or quickly learn) you cannot purchase anything in EPUB format. Feel free to purchase your EPUB books elsewhere that does sell them, but do not expect or demand that a private business should be FORCED to do what you want them to. It is Amazons choice to not sell EPUB books at this time. That may change in the future but until then, sit down, send a request to Amazon yourself and quit complaining.

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