The Technology Vent and Rant Thread

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

I switched to Ublock for the same reasons about a year ago, if not two.

I haven't updated Firefox since 54.01, which was when I discovered that the guy who wrote the OmniSidebar extension and a couple of others gave up after trying to redo his extensions with the new API.

That was my motivation in setting up Firefox ESR while I waited to see if Web Extension versions would become available to replace core functionality. At this point, enaough have to make Firefox Quantum usable.

Firefox is still my default browser. The only things that use Edge are MS tools such as Weather, Cortana etc, which is fine by me. I've never liked the concept of a single default browser into which applications can stuff their URL's; for example the calibre server. IMO every application that needs access to an HTTP client (web browser) should have a user accessible setting as to which one it is required to use, it would of course default to the system browser default.

I'm happy enough to use Firefox, given the level of control and customization possible. Edge is actually usable, given that it now has an extension capability (and uBlock Origin works in it), but if I need to spin dedicated browser instances, I prefer to create Firefox profiles customized for those purposes and run more than one Fireefox instance at a time.

If and when Firefox 54.01 no longer works, I will try to switch to Edge before looking at anything else. Twenty years ago browsers were of some interest, but today I'm prepared to use the one that comes with the OS, same with AV scanners, HIPS detectors, firewalls, even file system managers.

I don't go that far, and "the one that comes with the OS" will depend upon the OS you use. I run Win10 and Linux here, and the nice thing about Firefox is that it's cross platform and works under both OSes. (For that matter, I run it on my new Android tablet, though the Android version lags the desktop version in polish and feature set.)

Firefox 54 will continue to work - the question is how well.

Web standards are a moving target, and I've lost count of the number of browsers that couldn't keep up and no longer exist.

People elsewhere recommend Firefox forks like Pale Moon and Waterfox. They're worthy efforts, but keeping the core rendering engine up to date to be able to handle new web standards is a massive job. Chrome, Edge, and Firefox have fairly large staffs of developers working on stuff like that. With the best will in the world, I simply don't see how the developers of forks of Firefox can can keep up. They simply don't have the resources, and may lack the knowledge.

I made a conscious decision that I was simply going to have to stay current on Firefox releases, or switch to Chrome or Edge. Edge doesn't exist for Linux, and I've never particularly like Chrome, so Firefox got the nod.

It took a while for Quantum to have enough extensions that replicated the functionality I had before, but enough exist that I was able to switch and have been quite pleased. In my environment, Quantum is a lot faster than previous Firefox versions, and faster than Chrome too. Making it fast was the point of the development exercise that produced Quantum, and while it's still a work in progress, they succeeded.

I decided I couldn't be bothered building any more computers. One of our big banks has been deploying Dell Workstations for mission-critical LOB usage for a few years; their Chief Technology Officer (who once reported to me) waxes lyrical about them. So I got one of those, cost considerably more than a regular off-the-shelf system, but I didn't have to compromise too much on the build components.

I got cured of building my own systems too.

My current desktop is a refurb HP off-lease corporate box. Quad-core i5-2400 CPU at 3.1-3.4ghz, 8GB RAM, 500GB SATA drive, Intel HD2000 graphics and a few other things. It came with Win7 Pro. I cost a whopping $250USD.

The previous desktop was a refurb Dell box with a 2.6ghx quad-core Xeon CPU, 4GB RAM, and a 250GB SATA HD. I added RAM to bring it to teh 8GB that was the max it would take, a 240GB SSD, and an ATI low profile graphics card. Total cost when teh dust settles was just over $500 USD.

The Dell had a power supply failure, and the design was such that I couldn't just replace the PS, so a new machine was called for, and HP was the replacement. I swapped in the SSD, old drive from the DELL, and the ATI card, but discovered the built in Intel graphics were better and pulled the ATI card.

I've been quite pleased. I can boost RAM to up to 32GB, and have other expansion capacity. And the HP was designed for easy service, so it's easy to pop the hood and play with hardware. The Dell was a PITA is I had to open it up.

Its a bit light on doco, but what isn't these days. When I bought my new phone a few weeks ago, the young woman who helped me select it was puzzled by my query, "Where's the doco?" Her colleague looked across and explained was 'doco' was, she then said, "Don't worry there are plenty of videos on Youtube?" Being very grateful that, at my request, she was setting it up for me, including sorting out the sim card, the telco, and my google account I kept schtum and smiled.

Video as doco is a peeve of mine. I can read far faster than I can watch, and usually have other things to do with the time than watch a video like that.
______
Dennis

[badgoodDeb]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

Video as doco is a peeve of mine. I can read far faster than I can watch, and usually have other things to do with the time than watch a video like that.
______
Dennis

Amen, and amen.

[Katsunami]

Darn. How to bankrupt your company. TomTom should die.

Have you ever tried to update a TomTom? It's the most convoluted process I've ever encountered. The website just goes round and round in circles, telling you how great and easy it all is, but not telling you HOW to do it, and WHERE to download the MyDrive Connect software (after you find out that this is what you need). After finding it, the mentioned version was 2.9.x, updated on January 18th... with no download button. Then I went through the manual of the navigation system, got a round-about over the website again, and downloaded version 3.x.y of MyDrive C.... no. The link actually downloaded 4.2.x. WTF.

Finally I got the thing installed and running (note: the software doesn't take high-dpi screens into account... yay. It's 2017, TomTom!), then you have to make an account, add the nav, connect to TomTom services, and... then the 'server is too busy. Please try again later.' Try, try, try, and then you get in. The thing downloads the updates, which takes half an hour for 500 MB, and then it takes another 90 minutes to update the device.

Thanks man. My first encounter with a TomTom system (introduced only a few months ago), and I never ever want to touch one again.

WTH should anyone use something like that if you can use Google Maps?

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

WTH should anyone use something like that if you can use Google Maps?

Because you can't use Google Maps in a car, and devices like TomTom are intended as portable GPS navigation units, to be installed in cars.

Why did you get a TomTom?
______
Dennis

[Katsunami]

Why can't you use Google Maps in a car? Me and my GF do so all the time.

I didn't get a TomTom. I'm not allowed to drive due to poor eyesight. A friend of mine did. He has an older Win7 computer. He couldn't get the TomTom to connect (kept searching for drivers). Finally, the help desk told him "It's no use on this machine. Go and try somewhere else."

So he came to me, and I updated it to the latest version, in an IMHO _very_ round-about way because several website pages just kept referring to one another, all mentioning different versions of MyDrive Connect, without providing a download button. I eventually found the download through the online manual, which, incidentally, downloaded a version different than the one stated by the link.

This stuff WASN'T userfriendly, and WASN'T clear, and it takes a lot in both departments for someone like me to say that.

I often build custom Debian installations with a custom kernel and custom drivers for embedded systems, so I'm somewhat used to stuff being not very user friendly or very clear, but for user-facing software to be used by 'normal' consumers, this process was a fracking disaster.

[Blossom]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

Mozilla has already published the Firefox ESR update schedule. It is not intended to be a permanent solution. It's purely to allow organizations running Firefox to properly plan and prepare for upgrades. As I recall, come the release of Firefox 60, that will become the new ESR version, and you will be back where you are now if ESR updates.


I use Process Explorer here, and I'd love to know what you were looking at. See the attached screenshot of the Firefox Quantum processes displayed in PE. Tell me which you think represents extensions?

Chrome makes that simpler - everything in Chrome is a separate OS process - the browser itself, each open tab, each installed extension - and it's easy to see what is taking what RAM. Chrome provides fine grained control at the expense of system overhead. Processes are relatively expensive, as they must be created, maintained, and terminated by the OS. It's why programs that must have multiple things going on normally use threads instead of process, but threads have limitations that make them unsuitable for this.

Quantum uses a different model that I explained earlier. It uses less system overhead, and a goal of Mozilla going forward will be increasing the granularity of content containers to provide better control over usage by open tabs. But meanwhile, one complaint about Quantum under Windows is that it doesn't provide the additional information to let things like PE clearly identify just what those various sub-processes are.

Agreed about the superiority of uBlock Origin to ABP. I never ran ABP. I'm not that fanatical about blocking ads, and didn't care for the overhead involved in using it.
______
Dennis

I'll have to give up Firefox then because Quantum was my problem. To check for an extension hog open up task manger or Process Explorer and open Firefox then disable one by one. Restarting the browser each time of course. It's a tedious process but can help you track it down. You can also use the performance tab in task manager as you troubleshoot. I'm using FireFox 53 and no more problems with CPU/Memory Spikes. My friend showed me how to use the performance tab in task manager to find the problem. Quantum is taking up 60-100% cpu just on open then goes back to normal till I do something else then spikes back to high CPU usage, settles down then spikes again. This happens over and over. 53 is barely a blip on the radar. It's nice to have my fans quiet for a change.

[Blossom]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

I switched to Ublock for the same reasons about a year ago, if not two.

I haven't updated Firefox since 54.01, which was when I discovered that the guy who wrote the OmniSidebar extension and a couple of others gave up after trying to redo his extensions with the new API.

Firefox is still my default browser. The only things that use Edge are MS tools such as Weather, Cortana etc, which is fine by me. I've never liked the concept of a single default browser into which applications can stuff their URL's; for example the calibre server. IMO every application that needs access to an HTTP client (web browser) should have a user accessible setting as to which one it is required to use, it would of course default to the system browser default.

If and when Firefox 54.01 no longer works, I will try to switch to Edge before looking at anything else. Twenty years ago browsers were of some interest, but today I'm prepared to use the one that comes with the OS, same with AV scanners, HIPS detectors, firewalls, even file system managers.

BR

I don't like Edge because it uses IE 11 There are other open source browsers that use Mozilla I might have to check them out. Chrome I use for Swagbucks in a sandbox. It's the safest you can do when dealing with all those ads and junk. You're not allowed an ad blocker. I went portable this time. No google bloatware installed like google updater. I also have Opera portable which I really like but it uses Chrome's engine. I don't install extensions because I don't trust them unless they are from a well known developer. I couldn't find 54 ESR in a portable.

I used Ad Block Plus for years I'm sad to see it go. It's saved me many times but after the interface change it became a real resource hog.

My system is fairly stable. I'm still troubleshooting the fan issue. Updated all drivers thanks to learning how. Samsung has so many tweaks I lost in the reset and they've removed support for my laptop now so I'm having to scramble in finding the right drivers.

[BetterRed]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

Darn. How to bankrupt your company. TomTom should die.

Have you ever tried to update a TomTom? It's the most convoluted process I've ever encountered. The website just goes round and round in circles, telling you how great and easy it all is, but not telling you HOW to do it, and WHERE to download the MyDrive Connect software (after you find out that this is what you need). After finding it, the mentioned version was 2.9.x, updated on January 18th... with no download button. Then I went through the manual of the navigation system, got a round-about over the website again, and downloaded version 3.x.y of MyDrive C.... no. The link actually downloaded 4.2.x. WTF.

Finally I got the thing installed and running (note: the software doesn't take high-dpi screens into account... yay. It's 2017, TomTom!), then you have to make an account, add the nav, connect to TomTom services, and... then the 'server is too busy. Please try again later.' Try, try, try, and then you get in. The thing downloads the updates, which takes half an hour for 500 MB, and then it takes another 90 minutes to update the device.

Thanks man. My first encounter with a TomTom system (introduced only a few months ago), and I never ever want to touch one again.

WTH should anyone use something like that if you can use Google Maps?

According to this, and several other reports, TomTom is out of the satnav and into the wearables business - Near-Death Experience: TomTom Rises From The Grave.

I used their in-car systems in the Balkans last century, at that time they were the best available - not cheap though. I didn't know there was a Windows version, and why would they release it now - maybe they're thrillseekers who want another near death experience.

BR

[BetterRed]

Originally Posted by Blossom

I don't like Edge because it uses IE 11 There are other open source browsers that use Mozilla I might have to check them out. Chrome I use for Swagbucks in a sandbox. It's the safest you can do when dealing with all those ads and junk. You're not allowed an ad blocker. I went portable this time. No google bloatware installed like google updater. I also have Opera portable which I really like but it uses Chrome's engine. I don't install extensions because I don't trust them unless they are from a well known developer. I couldn't find 54 ESR in a portable.

I used Ad Block Plus for years I'm sad to see it go. It's saved me many times but after the interface change it became a real resource hog.

My system is fairly stable. I'm still troubleshooting the fan issue. Updated all drivers thanks to learning how. Samsung has so many tweaks I lost in the reset and they've removed support for my laptop now so I'm having to scramble in finding the right drivers.

Today I find browsers only a little more interesting than a DOS DIR command, or last weeks overcooked cabbage.

However, a few years ago I was having similar problems as you're having with your Samsung, on an HP laptop, so I tried Waterfox, Pale Moon and a couple of others whose names escape me. They all had performance issues despite the extravagant claims and none of them could run all the extensions I was using - and the extension developers weren't very interested in developing XXXX specific versions, so I gave up looking and persevered with Firefox.

I haven't added any extensions to Firefox for a couple of years, the last two were Open in Chrome and Open in Edge, and the rest have been then for no less than 5 years. I update them as and when a new version emerges. As always, Firefox crashes at least once a week. I always start it with a clean sheet, i.e no restore of yesterdays crud - besides which I close all tabs before I close it. I send the reports off, but because I'm not using the latest and greatest I assume they go straight into the bit bucket.

BR

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

According to this, and several other reports, TomTom is out of the satnav and into the wearables business - Near-Death Experience: TomTom Rises From The Grave.

I used their in-car systems in the Balkans last century, at that time they were the best available - not cheap though. I didn't know there was a Windows version, and why would they release it now - maybe they're thrillseekers who want another near death experience.

BR

I know TomTom is getting out of satnav.

They don't have a Windows navigation program AFAIK. What I was talking about is their software to update the satnav box with the latest software and maps.

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by Katsunami

I know TomTom is getting out of satnav.

Really? I thought they were refocussing on their satnav business.

[DiapDealer]

Why are there still people who insist on sharing email accounts?

[Toxaris]

Originally Posted by Blossom

I don't like Edge because it uses IE 11.

That is not true. Edge uses a totally different rendering engine than IE11. In fact, the rendering engine of IE11 has not been maintained for many, many years. The rendering engine of Edge is built from the ground up. Only for backwards compatibility, Edge can start IE11 (or any other browser you would like) for those pages that cannot be rendered on Edge. Those pages are rare on the internet. Those pages are usually from older business applications.

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Why are there still people who insist on sharing email accounts?

LOL. There are so many people who have one e-mail account, especially after they move in together, into a different house. They'll lose their provider's accounts when the old connections are terminated, and then when they subscribe anew, in the new house, they make accounts like Peter_en_Katja@ziggo.nl, just because they don't know they can make multiple accounts (5, in case of Ziggo, IIRC).

[Katsunami]

Originally Posted by Toxaris

That is not true. Edge uses a totally different rendering engine than IE11. In fact, the rendering engine of IE11 has not been maintained for many, many years. The rendering engine of Edge is built from the ground up. Only for backwards compatibility, Edge can start IE11 (or any other browser you would like) for those pages that cannot be rendered on Edge. Those pages are rare on the internet. Those pages are usually from older business applications.

According to Wikipedia, IE11 has had an update 6 weeks ago.

Are those just bug fixes, and is the engine not updated with new HTML(5) and CSS3 features since its release in 2013?