Steve Jobs on the "iPod of reading"

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by 6charlong

I know snookems is quoting from somewhere else, but is it just me or is there some way that these numbers work? 70 million dogs living in 110 million households? So, is someone sharing their dog?

Ever read Norton Juster's delightful "The Phantom Tollbooth"?" At one point, Milo meets another kid, or rather, half a kid. It seems every family has an average of 2.5 kids, and he's the .5 of a kid in his. But he's not upset: the average family also has 1.3 cars, and since he's the only one that can drive .3 of a car, he gets to use it all the time...
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Dennis

[DaleDe]

Originally Posted by 6charlong

I know snookems is quoting from somewhere else, but is it just me or is there some way that these numbers work? 70 million dogs living in 110 million households? So, is someone sharing their dog?

You added living. the original text meant that there are 70 million dogs in a population of 110 million households. Do you need to borrow a dog?

Dale

[Utahcowboy]

I can see where Mr. Jobs gets his idea about the death of reading because I went ahead and read the whole article that this quote came from. His claim is that 40 percent of people only read one book a year, and that is probably true. But that is not the only kind of reading that people do anymore a lot of reading these days is informational and is largely found on the internet. People now like to read forums and blogs, news feeds and wikis. In contrast to what Mr. Jobs said, I think that people read more these days then they ever have before, but it just isn't measurable. In our society when someone is asked if they read they may say "not much" but in reality they could have just spend a few hours on their computer reading blogs and news feeds.

In the traditional definition, it is true that people don't read as much but that does not mean that there is no market for ebook readers. I think that amazon had the right idea when they set up their Kindle with the ability to easily subscribe to newspapers and blogs because that is where a lot of modern reading is, and to be able to do it without eye strain now is wonderful.

I think if Steve Jobs was to change his definition of reading he would see a huge market for an ibook device.

[yvanleterrible]

Originally Posted by Utahcowboy

I can see where Mr. Jobs gets his idea about the death of reading because I went ahead and read the whole article that this quote came from. His claim is that 40 percent of people only read one book a year, and that is probably true. But that is not the only kind of reading that people do anymore a lot of reading these days is informational and is largely found on the internet. People now like to read forums and blogs, news feeds and wikis. In contrast to what Mr. Jobs said, I think that people read more these days then they ever have before, but it just isn't measurable. In our society when someone is asked if they read they may say "not much" but in reality they could have just spend a few hours on their computer reading blogs and news feeds.

In the traditional definition, it is true that people don't read as much but that does not mean that there is no market for ebook readers. I think that amazon had the right idea when they set up their Kindle with the ability to easily subscribe to newspapers and blogs because that is where a lot of modern reading is, and to be able to do it without eye strain now is wonderful.

I think if Steve Jobs was to change his definition of reading he would see a huge market for an ibook device.

What you described as being today's type of reading heavily involves computer use. Of course Jobs would be inclined to favor those, he sells computers. Reading long text on a computer is not however what most would prefer for many reasons. I know of no one who is comfortable doing so. For me it's my failing eyesight and the fact that I can't really shift position for comfort. A reading device allows frequent repositioning and more liberty. If aPple were to make any portable device resembling some king of reader, I'd be a buyer. I just can't accept that Mr. can not feel for this.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

If aPple were to make any portable device resembling some king of reader, I'd be a buyer. I just can't accept that Mr. can not feel for this.

I can. I think he knows there's a market. His problem is that he doesn't think the market is big enough. The iPod sold millions, and the iPhone is approaching that.

An iBook (or whatever it would be called) would sell in the hundreds of thousands, at best. That is not enough to make it worth Apple's effort to do it. They are a big widget maker, and need to sell a lot of widgets to justify making any particular type.
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Dennis

[yvanleterrible]

If we look at the computer market in which aPple is "well seated", how many mAcbook aIr are they expecting to sell and at what return? I believe an iBook reader could well outsell that!?!

[Utahcowboy]

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

What you described as being today's type of reading heavily involves computer use. Of course Jobs would be inclined to favor those, he sells computers. Reading long text on a computer is not however what most would prefer for many reasons. I know of no one who is comfortable doing so. For me it's my failing eyesight and the fact that I can't really shift position for comfort. A reading device allows frequent repositioning and more liberty. If aPple were to make any portable device resembling some king of reader, I'd be a buyer. I just can't accept that Mr. can not feel for this.

I totally agree with you. I also am loosing my sight (I can't even drive anymore). My point is that Mr. Jobs is missing the potential of what ebook readers can do. I think that Amazon is on the right track with their Kindle (Although it is the ugliest thing since the first microwave) its online features such as subscribing to RSS feads, newspapers, and blogs, as well as other traditional computer and web content make using the traditional computer for modern reading something that could easily become a thing of the past. I also think that school teachers may also get into these devices. Most teachers refuse to go paperless (especially english teachers) because of all the reading that they have to do, and would much rather read paper than their computer LCD screen. But with an ebook reader, they can download the essays from their students onto the device and read it with ease. In the future I also see that most, if not all, divices will support a stylus like the Iliad has and will be able to edit manuscripts with notations in a variety of formats and not just pdf. Mr. Jobs is just not seeing all the possibilities in the inevitable future of reading. These things will replace the book and traditional computer reading.

[yvanleterrible]

Originally Posted by Utahcowboy

Most teachers refuse to go paperless (especially english teachers) because of all the reading that they have to do, and would much rather read paper than their computer LCD screen. But with an ebook reader, they can download the essays from their students onto the device and read it with ease. In the future I also see that most, if not all, divices will support a stylus like the Iliad has and will be able to edit manuscripts with notations in a variety of formats and not just pdf. Mr. Jobs is just not seeing all the possibilities in the inevitable future of reading. These things will replace the book and traditional computer reading.

Agreed. Shamefully no device today can support the 8 by 10 format necessary for scholars. Can't "they"(aPple) feel the huge market out there? Or is it imposssible to face the obtuse unwavering paper mindset behind the educational institutions?

The dreamed magazine format machine would make huge inroads in to changing things in education. A stable footed electronic reading device, such as iPod has become to music distribution, is required to be 'instituted' before anything happens. We can only dream it for now...

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

Agreed. Shamefully no device today can support the 8 by 10 format necessary for scholars. Can't "they"(aPple) feel the huge market out there?

I don't believe the market is anywhere near huge by Apple standards.

Or is it imposssible to face the obtuse unwavering paper mindset behind the educational institutions?

If you are a tescher, you must not only read papers. You must comment on and grade them. You do this by marking up the paper. That is not currently very feasible with ebook readers.

The dreamed magazine format machine would make huge inroads in to changing things in education. A stable footed electronic reading device, such as iPod has become to music distribution, is required to be 'instituted' before anything happens. We can only dream it for now...

Convince Apple there is an iPod sized market for suck a thing. You'll have problems, because there isn't.
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Dennis

[yvanleterrible]

There are millions and millions of people learning from printed text and graphics, surely someone could see the impact a slight direction of intent could have? Or are the ways of education so "unshiftive" and impregnable?

I believe one has to learn to write with one's hand, granted, but past that the sky's the limit. Distributing electronic formated material is quicker and would accelerate the amount of learning. Sometimes I feel that teachers are so unevolutive...

If anyone remembers Next computers, I'm pretty sure that's the moment where Jobs got the brushoff from scolars and since then forfeited doing more for education. There are other around with creative spirit and vision enough to tackle the task. For now I only feel aPple could be up to the task. Anyone has an idea of who then could be ambitious enough to turn the tables?

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

There are millions and millions of people learning from printed text and graphics, surely someone could see the impact a slight direction of intent could have? Or are the ways of education so "unshiftive" and impregnable?

No, there's a market that is likely to be served at some point. It just isn't a big enough market for Apple to be interested.

The current market is probably measurable in tens or perhaps hundreds of thousands of units, depending on the device and the price.

Apple wants a market of millions of devices. If they can't get iPod/iPhone numbers, they won't bite.

I believe one has to learn to write with one's hand, granted, but past that the sky's the limit. Distributing electronic formated material is quicker and would accelerate the amount of learning. Sometimes I feel that teachers are so unevolutive...

Lots of material can be distributed in electronic form, if all you need to do is read it. If you need to make changes to it, it's a different story.

If anyone remembers Next computers, I'm pretty sure that's the moment where Jobs got the brushoff from scolars and since then forfeited doing more for education.

The NeXT machine was over-priced and poorly executed for the intended market. No surprise it failed. It was aimed at grad students, who couldn't afford it, and universities weren't interested in picking up the tab.

The NeXT OS and development environment had potential, if it had ever been released for anything besides Apple gear.

There are other around with creative spirit and vision enough to tackle the task. For now I only feel aPple could be up to the task. Anyone has an idea of who then could be ambitious enough to turn the tables?

Apple could be, but isn't interested. Not enough money in it. I'm not sure off hand who I'd point at instead.
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Dennis

[tompe]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

If you are a tescher, you must not only read papers. You must comment on and grade them. You do this by marking up the paper. That is not currently very feasible with ebook readers.

It must be easier having a computer file and grade them and email the result. At least when I had a course where students had to hand in thing the case when the student handed in a paper copy was annoying and caused me more work.

[nekokami]

One can mark up papers on an iLiad, but the price is out of reach for most teachers. The screen is a bit small for the purpose, too. I'd say, maybe another 5 years. But most people probably won't want to spend enough for a large-screen device unless it can do more than read (and even annotate) text. And e ink displays aren't fast enough to do much else, even if color were available. Another hardware breakthrough is needed for a low-power, reflective screen capable of displaying motion and color, and yet another hardware breakthrough will probably be needed to bring the cost of stylus input down to affordable levels, before this kind of device will really take off.

I'm hoping that it won't be tied to Windows. But so far, there's no good handwriting recognition software for Linux, and I'm not optimistic about Apple supporting such a platform. Maybe by the time the hardware is ready, there will be another OS to choose from.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

ReadWriteWeb has another take on this subject, inspired by Jobs' initial statement. From the article:

As it turns out, he was only half-right. People read, even those in the younger generation, they just prefer to do it online.

The studies referenced back the claim that people are switching to online reading, and most of the reading is news-related subjects as opposed to entertainment fiction, etc. It further describes how the new reading habits are causing a deterioration of certain comprehension quality, especially in youngsters, something that needs to be addressed.

However, it points out that the Harry Potter franchise has proven that kids will still read things that engage them.

[radleyp]

And if you read on a small (2") smartphone screen, you get used to seeing and absorbing matter in a small format: the NewYorkTimes piece on the Japanese habit of actually writing fiction on cellphones noted that it leads to the composition of short paragraphs and sentences. Everything takes on the look of a text message. This will in the not so long run change the very nature of writing, and most likely for the worse.