What are your reading habits?

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by MikeB1972

If you look at the UK stats the big change is in the years 2007-2010 where the % dropped by 7.1,13.8,12.5 & 16.7 respectively.
So it looks like the main drop in the UK rate is due to getting points on your licence for using a mobile (Used to be just a fine prior to this). Unless anyone can think of anything else that happened in 2007 - smoking ban in pubs possibly.

UK road safety stats have been getting better for at least forty years, due to government attention to road safety - vehicle regulations, road improvements, drunk driving prosecutions and to a small extent, driver regulations.

Road deaths are now 25% of the rate in the 1970s in absolute numbers. And in that same time period, vehicle road miles has doubled.

If the USA had made the same progress in deaths per vehicle road mile, the current USA rate would be 20,000 instead of 32,000.

That is, a small amount of attention to road safety could save 12,000 lives a year in the US. Or four times the 11 September 2001 death toll. Every year.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

Road deaths are now 25% of the rate in the 1970s in absolute numbers. And in that same time period, vehicle road miles has doubled.

An even greater reduction than that for alcohol-related road deaths: a fall from 1640 in 1979 to 240 in 2013; ie seven times more people died in 1979 than in 2013.

[issybird]

Originally Posted by murg

Because the Americans are driving on the wrong side of the road?

That's just silly. We always drive on the right side.

[Apache]

Originally Posted by issybird

That's just silly. We always drive on the right side.

I Wish that were true. I was almost hit head on twice last week. Both times the drivers crossed a double yellow line to make a left turn. And both places I was in the left turn lane at an intersection. It amazes me how many US drivers will cross a double yellow line when they want to make a left turn.
Apache

[issybird]

I think the problem with extrapolating from such limited data is that everything is guesswork, some of it seemingly likely, but there are so many factors that would affect fatality rates. Just off the top of my head are traffic density per mile traveled and length of average trip (driver fatigue).

That said, I think European drivers are better than Americans. I wish our lane discipline were as good - here, people drive whatever speed they want in whatever lane. That in itself causes a huge number of bottlenecks and accidents. The byzantine nature of driving laws, which differ from state to state, don't help either. In my state (New Hampshire), seat belts are not mandatory but hand-held devices are forbidden. But I commute to Massachusetts and as soon as I cross the state line, my seat belt has to be fastened (it already is, of course), but I can pick up my phone.

[cvkemp]

Originally Posted by issybird

I think the problem with extrapolating from such limited data is that everything is guesswork, some of it seemingly likely, but there are so many factors that would affect fatality rates. Just off the top of my head are traffic density per mile traveled and length of average trip (driver fatigue).

That said, I think European drivers are better than Americans. I wish our lane discipline were as good - here, people drive whatever speed they want in whatever lane. That in itself causes a huge number of bottlenecks and accidents. The byzantine nature of driving laws, which differ from state to state, don't help either. In my state (New Hampshire), seat belts are not mandatory but hand-held devices are forbidden. But I commute to Massachusetts and as soon as I cross the state line, my seat belt has to be fastened (it already is, of course), but I can pick up my phone.

Here is my take on drivers here, they have no respect for speed limits. They have no respect for others on the road, and they have no respect for police. When I first started driving it was fun to drive and go places now to be honest with you it scared the hell out of me just to drive to the drug store.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by cvkemp

Here is my take on drivers here, they have no respect for speed limits.

One of the biggest changes to people's driving habits in the UK in recent years has been the introduction of automatic speed cameras, which take a picture of your car if you break the speed limit, resulting in a fine and points on your driving licence. Very effective at accident "blackspots" in making people slow down.

[cvkemp]

Originally Posted by HarryT

One of the biggest changes to people's driving habits in the UK in recent years has been the introduction of automatic speed cameras, which take a picture of your car if you break the speed limit, resulting in a fine and points on your driving licence. Very effective at accident "blackspots" in making people slow down.

Harry they have been here in areas for over 20 years, and people do not even pay attention to them. There are more outstanding traffic violations here then anywhere else I have ever been. People tear up the tickets and just forget about them. The police here do finally go after the ones with the most outstanding tickets but a lot just get away with it. Oh taking away their drivers permits that means nothing they drive anyway. People now days do not even try to obey the laws.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by cvkemp

Harry they have been here in areas for over 20 years, and people do not even pay attention to them. There are more outstanding traffic violations here then anywhere else I have ever been. People tear up the tickets and just forget about them. The police here do finally go after the ones with the most outstanding tickets but a lot just get away with it. Oh taking away their drivers permits that means nothing they drive anyway. People now days do not even try to obey the laws.

That's bad news . I'm sure these problems exist to a greater or lesser extent everywhere, but it certainly sounds as if it's far worse there than here. I got "rear-ended" by an uninsured driver a couple of years ago, so I know the annoyance of it.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Possibly a change in social attitudes to drink driving? I know that in my younger days it was illegal, but not regarded as "wrong", to have a few drinks and then drive home from the pub. These days most people would regard anyone convicted of drink driving with disgust.

In the 10-year period from 2004 to 2013 (the latest available data), alcohol-related road accident fatalities more than halved:

2004: 580
2005: 550
2006: 560
2007: 410
2008: 400
2009: 380
2010: 240
2011: 240
2012: 230
2013: 240

The big reduction occurred between 2007 and 2010, which fits in with your dates.

Source: Reported drinking and driving statistics tables, produced by the Department for Transport

If you look at the corresponding data for the US, there appears to have been no appreciable reduction in the same time period.

That is fantastic on those rates going down.
Crazy question: how long between the arrest and the court date for punishment over there?

Over here, it could be as much as 2 to 3 months. Arrest, bail out, keep driving, finally go to court.
Now if you are at twice the legal limit, some counties won't hesitate to pull your license for the time of your probation.
Other counties, the drunks just pretty much pay the judges salaries. You are working, here is your ankle monitor. I know one guy that finally went to jail for DUI. He was 65 and they reduced 11 DUi's to 3. I didn't ask the time frame.
I will shut up now or I might start ranting.

[MikeB1972]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

That is fantastic on those rates going down.
Crazy question: how long between the arrest and the court date for punishment over there?

Over here, it could be as much as 2 to 3 months. Arrest, bail out, keep driving, finally go to court.
Now if you are at twice the legal limit, some counties won't hesitate to pull your license for the time of your probation.
Other counties, the drunks just pretty much pay the judges salaries. You are working, here is your ankle monitor. I know one guy that finally went to jail for DUI. He was 65 and they reduced 11 DUi's to 3. I didn't ask the time frame.
I will shut up now or I might start ranting.

Couple of days normally, according to this site.
http://www.drinkdrivinglaw.co.uk/dri...rt_hearing.htm
Only extends out if you plead not guilty.

[murg]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Why would driving on the other side of the road lead to a higher death rate? I asked you before, but you didn't answer my question: did you look at the statistical data I provided a link to? Had you done so, you would have seen that most western nations, the majority of which drive on the right, as the US does, have hugely lower road death rates.

Sorry Harry, but Wikipedia is not considered to be a valid source of factual information.

It may be considered to be a valid source for things like bar bets and trivia contests...

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by murg

Sorry Harry, but Wikipedia is not considered to be a valid source of factual information.

The sources of the data are clearly referenced and are reputable. Why comment on something that you've not taken the trouble to look at?

[AnotherCat]

Originally Posted by HarryT

The sources of the data are clearly referenced and are reputable. Why comment on something that you've not taken the trouble to look at?

In which case:

Why is it reputable when the references that the data is taken from for many countries are only secondhand (or worse-hand) ones, including that for the USA; furthermore the specific secondhand reference used for USA data is not identified?

Why is the data for the USA reputable when it is different to the US own NHTSA's data?

Why is the data reputable when the data differs between the Wikipedia article linked to and other Wikipedia articles traversing related ground?

[Phogg]

Originally Posted by HarryT

The sources of the data are clearly referenced and are reputable. Why comment on something that you've not taken the trouble to look at?

Because Wikipedia has a reputation for shenanigans that is fully earned.
They have happened often enough to be wary of the whole site.

It's a site useful for information on fluff entertainment subjects.
It is generally reliable for nothing else.

Discussing the actual details of Wikipedia 's many flaws and duplicities should probably be related to it's own thread, and that thread should be in the religion and politics section.