Shannara coming to television - Page 12

DiapDealer · 11-09-2015, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fluribus

When I read the Sword of Shannara all those years ago, my reaction was the same as Harry's. I was never some shrill "everybody's ripping off Tolkien" guy, but in this book Tolkien was more omnipresent than God in the Bible. Doesn't mean that I thought Brooks was a crook. Doesn't mean that I didn't read any of his other books.

If you haven't dismissed his entire body of work based on the first two-thirds of his first book, then feel free to assume my post wasn't directed at you. It is directed at the people who think Brooks is still nothing but a "Tolkien ripoff artist"--thirty-plus years and double-digit books later.

Let me ask you this: how much "absolutely zero comparisons to Tolkien can be made" fantasy did you read in the late 70s early 80s?

HarryT · 11-09-2015, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

Let me ask you this: how much "absolutely zero comparisons to Tolkien can be made" fantasy did you read in the late 70s early 80s?

I can think of a few. Ursula LeGuin's "Earthsea" books have no particularly obvious homage to Tolkien. Of course there are others which clearly do bear comparison, such as Stephen Donaldson's "Chronicles of Thomas Covenant", where "Lord Foul" certainly bears comparison to Sauron.

Katsunami · 11-09-2015, 06:58 AM

On Shannara and Terry Brooks... sometimes I wonder why I still read the series.

I've just finished "The Genensis of Shannara", and "Legends of Shannara" trilogy and duology.
While the first one was OK,

Spoiler:

the second was crap. Brooks takes two books to stage one huge battle, get a lot of good guys killed, have a tragedy happen to a fifteen-year old girl, and the entire conclusion is: "We left our safe haven".

In Wards of Fairy, he says that there the people who were saved from the old world made a one-thousand year journey, between being saved and instating the first druid council. The Legends duology states that it takes place 500 years after saving these people.

So, "Legends of Shannara" is only half-way. Brooks hasn't connected anything between the Word and Void and Shannara; it's only implied. I was expecting to see Paranor built/mentioned, the first Druid Council instated, Galaphile turn op to lead it, etc... but Brooks stops 500 years short of that.

At this point I'm reading Wards of Faerie. Everything was going quite well, until....

Spoiler:

As I said, sometimes I wonder why I still keep up with this series.

DiapDealer · 11-09-2015, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katsunami

On Shannara and Terry Brooks... sometimes I wonder why I still read the series.

Oh I don't read it anymore.

I grew weary of the same themes a long time ago. I liked the Word/Void books because they were different, but then he retro-fitted all that into the Shannara universe/mythos and I lost interest again. I just love the memories I have of loving those books. But my tastes have changed over the years and I'm frankly not into mega-volume/multi-generational fantasy series anymore.

If he wrote something completely unrelated to his two primary universes (and stand-alone), I'd certainly give it a shot. But I'd always be a bit paranoid he was going to try and tie it all together at some later date.

Quote:

Brooks hasn't connected anything between the Word and Void and Shannara; it's only implied.

No. It's not only implied. The connection is quite concrete. It was cemented in the Genesis of Shannara series (and in interviews and AMAs).

Katsunami · 11-09-2015, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

If he wrote something completely unrelated to his two primary universes (and stand-alone), I'd certainly give it a shot. But I'd always be a bit paranoid he was going to try and tie it all together at some later date.

Then maybe the Landover series might be for you

Quote:

No. It's not only implied. The connection is quite concrete. It was cemented in the Genesis of Shannara series (and in interviews and AMAs).

It is *intended* to be concrete, but it doesn't feel like it.

The Genesis and Legend series move out of the old world, and introduce some of the other races, such as Elves, Trolls, Spiders (Spider-gnomes?), and the series moves toward the Shannara setting. No doubt about that.

I only hoped to see a "real" connection, such as mentions of the valley of Rhenn, Paranor, forming of the Druid Council (of which Brona was a member), etc.

JSWolf · 11-09-2015, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

I can think of a few. Ursula LeGuin's "Earthsea" books have no particularly obvious homage to Tolkien. Of course there are others which clearly do bear comparison, such as Stephen Donaldson's "Chronicles of Thomas Covenant", where "Lord Foul" certainly bears comparison to Sauron.

I never once thought of Tolkien while reading the first two Chronicles of Tomas Covenant.

JSWolf · 11-09-2015, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katsunami

On Shannara and Terry Brooks... sometimes I wonder why I still read the series.

So, "Legends of Shannara" is only half-way. Brooks hasn't connected anything between the Word and Void and Shannara; it's only implied.

Read the series in chronological order and you'll easily see how Brooks managed to fit Word and Void into the series.

HarryT · 11-09-2015, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I never once thought of Tolkien while reading the first two Chronicles of Tomas Covenant.

Nor me, but it's not unreasonable to believe that Donaldson might perhaps have been inspired by Tolkien. It would be difficult to write fantasy in the latter part of the 20th century and not be inspired by him, he was such a giant in the field.

DiapDealer · 11-09-2015, 08:50 AM

A volcano was an ancient seat of power for a dark overlord in the Covenant series. Multi-character quests to unseat him abounded. The Elohim were elves and the forests were "alive."

BenG · 11-09-2015, 08:55 AM

If you read Donaldson when he was first published you definitely would have thought of Tolkien, if only for the fact that he wrote it before the flood of modern fantasy novels (or at least at the beginning of the flood).

If it was fantasy with an imaginary world there were few other popular works to compare it to.

HarryT · 11-09-2015, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenG

If you read Donaldson when he was first published you definitely would have thought of Tolkien, if only for the fact that he wrote it before the flood of modern fantasy novels (or at least at the beginning of the flood).

And because it said in large letters on the front cover of his books "Comparable to Tolkien at his best", perhaps, too?

Click image for larger version

Name: donaldson.JPG
Views: 131
Size: 30.1 KB
ID: 143596

BenG · 11-09-2015, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

A volcano was an ancient seat of power for a dark overlord in the Covenant series. Multi-character quests to unseat him abounded. The Elohim were elves and the forests were "alive."

Not to mention the ur-viles, the Ramen horse-lords, the Ravers and a ring of power.

DiapDealer · 11-09-2015, 09:06 AM

Don't get me wrong. I loved the Covenant books too, but lets face it: if you're looking for Tolkien in any epic fantasy, you're bound to discover him.

Brooks and Donaldson (and Lester Del Rey) were (un)lucky enough to be some of the first commercially successful fantasy authors since Tolkien wrote LoTR. One or the other (or both) were bound to be brutally picked apart for any resemblances to Tolkien.

BenG · 11-09-2015, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

And because it said in large letters on the front cover of his books "Comparable to Tolkien at his best", perhaps, too?

True, but just about every fantasy published back then had a similar quote.

BenG · 11-09-2015, 09:15 AM

Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials owes more to C.S. Lewis than Tolkien, but in an antagonistic way. He says he thought of it as the anti-Narnia.

Off topic, but I've read that the BBC is doing a series based on Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials.

11-09-2015, 06:58 AM	#168
Katsunami Grand Sorcerer Posts: 6,111 Karma: 34000001 Join Date: Mar 2008 Device: KPW1, KA1	On Shannara and Terry Brooks... sometimes I wonder why I still read the series. I've just finished "The Genensis of Shannara", and "Legends of Shannara" trilogy and duology. While the first one was OK, Spoiler: in which a few thousand of the old world people are saved by leading them into a magically secluded valley the second was crap. Brooks takes two books to stage one huge battle, get a lot of good guys killed, have a tragedy happen to a fifteen-year old girl, and the entire conclusion is: "We left our safe haven". In Wards of Fairy, he says that there the people who were saved from the old world made a one-thousand year journey, between being saved and instating the first druid council. The Legends duology states that it takes place 500 years after saving these people. So, "Legends of Shannara" is only half-way. Brooks hasn't connected anything between the Word and Void and Shannara; it's only implied. I was expecting to see Paranor built/mentioned, the first Druid Council instated, Galaphile turn op to lead it, etc... but Brooks stops 500 years short of that. At this point I'm reading Wards of Faerie. Everything was going quite well, until.... Spoiler: the current High Druid goes to the Hadeshorn to speak with the dead, to know what she should do. And out comes the next generation of Ohmsfords! There is even a Leah (a girl this time) again! FRAQUE! I was hoping to finally be reading a Shannara story in the four lands WITHOUT an Ohmsford in it, but nooooo.... There MUST be a blasted Ohmsford in it once again. As I said, sometimes I wonder why I still keep up with this series. Last edited by Katsunami; 11-09-2015 at 07:02 AM.

11-09-2015, 08:50 AM	#174
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 28,689 Karma: 205039118 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	A volcano was an ancient seat of power for a dark overlord in the Covenant series. Multi-character quests to unseat him abounded. The Elohim were elves and the forests were "alive." Last edited by DiapDealer; 11-09-2015 at 08:52 AM.

11-09-2015, 09:06 AM	#178
DiapDealer Grand Sorcerer Posts: 28,689 Karma: 205039118 Join Date: Jan 2010 Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD	Don't get me wrong. I loved the Covenant books too, but lets face it: if you're looking for Tolkien in any epic fantasy, you're bound to discover him. Brooks and Donaldson (and Lester Del Rey) were (un)lucky enough to be some of the first commercially successful fantasy authors since Tolkien wrote LoTR. One or the other (or both) were bound to be brutally picked apart for any resemblances to Tolkien. Last edited by DiapDealer; 11-09-2015 at 09:11 AM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Television Without Pity	xoxojackie	Recipes	5	10-13-2013 08:25 PM
Television Rant	ebusinesstutor	Lounge	10	10-12-2012 03:15 PM
Wired interview w/ Terry Brooks (new Shannara book)	taosaur	News	24	08-24-2012 08:52 PM
The dangers of television	HarryT	Lounge	3	01-03-2009 11:19 AM
Television scripts for your handheld	Bob Russell	Lounge	2	01-07-2006 06:22 PM

11-09-2015, 08:55 AM	#175
BenG Home Guard Posts: 4,730 Karma: 86721650 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Alpha Ralpha Boulevard Device: Kindle Oasis 3G, iPhone 6	If you read Donaldson when he was first published you definitely would have thought of Tolkien, if only for the fact that he wrote it before the flood of modern fantasy novels (or at least at the beginning of the flood). If it was fantasy with an imaginary world there were few other popular works to compare it to.

11-09-2015, 09:15 AM	#180
BenG Home Guard Posts: 4,730 Karma: 86721650 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Alpha Ralpha Boulevard Device: Kindle Oasis 3G, iPhone 6	Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials owes more to C.S. Lewis than Tolkien, but in an antagonistic way. He says he thought of it as the anti-Narnia. Off topic, but I've read that the BBC is doing a series based on Philip Pullman's His Dark Materials.

Advert

Advert