Concerns About Sony's Religious Intolerance - Page 10

Patricia · 01-25-2009, 05:58 PM

I don't think that it is helpful to attribute such motives to the original poster. He asked a question. He got a lot of responses. It is entirely possible that this was a new issue that he hadn't yet needed to consider. Jumping on a person is not conducive to helping them reflect on new ideas.

May I add a plea that we continue to try and keep this thread polite, please?
If not, the mods are beginning to wonder whether it might be time to close it.

RickyMaveety · 01-25-2009, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patricia

Now that has nevered bothered me at all. Either there is no God, in which case the prayers will be merely expressions of feeling. Or there is a God, in which case we are all likely to come to his attention sooner or later.

We are wandering away from the original point, aren't we?

Orrrrr ..... there are many gods and goddesses, or there were many or one, and they went far far away a loooong time ago because Earth was just some high-school sophomore god's failed science experiment left in a galactic backwater to rot.

Wandering away from the original point is what we are good at. Why should this post be any different??

slayda · 01-25-2009, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickyMaveety

Orrrrr ..... there are many gods and goddesses, or there were many or one, and they went far far away a loooong time ago because Earth was just some high-school sophomore god's failed science experiment left in a galactic backwater to rot.

Wandering away from the original point is what we are good at. Why should this post be any different??

Isn't that why they're called "threads"?

Cthulhu · 01-25-2009, 08:42 PM

MsSmith (et Al)--

Pardon me if I am re-iterating:

I would direct you to Hanlon's Razor, a corollary of Occam's Razor, which warns that one not attribute to nefarious purpose what can easily be explained by incompetence. However, in this case, we should replace "incompetence" with "greed." However, once again, some might see greed & nefarious purpose being equal parts of the equation.

My point, at any rate, is that SONY is quite savvy; they bought the rights to a popular, well-selling book, and they have generated conversation and debate that revolves around their product. Word of mouth is a fantastic marketing tool, and for most companies, any attention is good attention.

In the interest of full disclosure, I am a staunch proponent of religious intolerance, by which I mean that I rarely tolerate religiosity.

That is the same thing that Mr. Dawkins said in his book
(disclosure: a friend bought it for me, and I gave it away and bought another copy to circulate among friends),
that there should be no preferential treatment of anyone's opinion, especially if it attempts to stand behind the shield of religious expression.

The notion that "faith" should be unassailable is silly and annoying, and I agree with Dawkins on that point. A person's belief in a flat earth, evolution, flying spaghetti monsters, or Jewish zombies is just that, a belief that can be and should be questioned.

RickyMaveety · 01-25-2009, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slayda

Isn't that why they're called "threads"?

I thought "threads" were those things that the Dragonriders of Pern had to battle. I'm confused.

RickyMaveety · 01-25-2009, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by msmith

My original point was only to have topic neutral books preloaded on the Reader suitable for a diverse audience, and then people can have the freedom to BUY whatever they want wherever they want. Again, it wouldn't be right to have anti-hispanic or anti-african american books on there either.

The only "topic neutral" books I can think of are written at a second grade level. How about Sony just leaves the Reader blank? No excepts at all. That would certainly be "topic neutral."

And, even if you do have excepts that are not "topic neutral" (and what the hell is that really?), how does that take away someone's freedom to BUY (your caps not mine) whatever they want wherever they want? You are aware you can delete the excerpts off the Reader, I know you are, you mentioned it earlier. Or is there something I don't know about Sony?? Are you limited to purchasing books that are preloaded?

What is or is not "anti-Hispanic" or "anti-African-American" (I really hate that term ... if it's anti-Black, who the heck cares if they are American, Canadian, or actually African), is in the eye of the beholder. What one person (of the same race or religion) might consider insulting, another might not.

If you're not talking about censorship, I don't understand what you are talking about. Who's going to be the person who decides what is or is not "topic neutral"? You??

desertgrandma · 01-25-2009, 09:41 PM

Ricky, I can see the vein in your forehead throbbing. Calm down!

Sometimes, you just need to turn your back and walk away.

Ready boots?? Start Walking!

RickyMaveety · 01-25-2009, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Ricky, I can see the vein in your forehead throbbing. Calm down!

Sometimes, you just need to turn your back and walk away.

Ready boots?? Start Walking!

Nah, really I find this whole thread sort of funny. It's just too fascinating to watch someone working so hard to figure a way to censor materials without calling it censorship.

I mean .... topic neutral?? Really?? I'm not even sure my freaking grocery list is topic neutral.

desertgrandma · 01-25-2009, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickyMaveety

Nah, really I find this whole thread sort of funny. It's just too fascinating to watch someone working so hard to figure a way to censor materials without calling it censorship.

I mean .... topic neutral?? Really?? I'm not even sure my freaking grocery list is topic neutral.

Yeah, I know, there is no such thing. But it is the way of the world today to not hurt anyones feeling, and God help you if you do. Oops. Sorry.

Aw crap, I swore I would stay away from here. Durn you mobileread!

slayda · 01-25-2009, 10:16 PM

Didn't they burn all the non-topic-neutral books at the Alexandria Library a long time ago?

RickyMaveety · 01-25-2009, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Yeah, I know, there is no such thing. But it is the way of the world today to not hurt anyones feeling, and God help you if you do. Oops. Sorry.

Aw crap, I swore I would stay away from here. Durn you mobileread!

Can't be done. Period. Can ... not ... be .... done. All you have to do is accidentally sit with the soles of your feet facing Mecca and you've gone and upset whole countries worth of people.

The whole politically correct fad just cracks me up. Honestly "African-American"?? If I see someone who has very dark skin, I'm supposed to just assume the person is an American?? What if they're English or French??

Faced with a group of men, all of whom resemble Woody Allen, except for the one guy who looks like Denzel Washington, I am not pointing him out as an "African-American" .... I am pointing him out as the "stone fox" in the group. No, actually, I'd probably just point and drool and go humadahumadahumada!!!

Wonder what I'm supposed to be?? I suppose I'd go with Anglo-American, but then that does a disservice to those of my ancestors who were from (1) Germany, (2) Holland, (3) France, (4) Scotland, (5) Wales, (6) Denmark, (7) Sweden ... the list is endless. Go back far enough and I'm reasonably certain I could scrape up a few genes from the African continent.

"Topic neutrality" is censorship pure and simple. I much prefer people who are secure in their ethnicity and their faith, and don't see the need to take offense at every third reference to something that could remotely be considered non-PC.

Their mothers were hamsters and their fathers smelled of elderberries, and I fart in their general direction.

slayda · 01-25-2009, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Yeah, I know, there is no such thing. But it is the way of the world today to not hurt anyones feeling, and God help you if you do. Oops. Sorry.

Aw crap, I swore I would stay away from here. Durn you mobileread!

RickyMaveety · 01-25-2009, 10:49 PM

Yeah .... what about the giant conspiracy between the Gideon Society and the Hotels of America?? Why is it that they want to force me to read the Christian Bible?? Why can't I have some nice topic neutral reading material in the bedside stand?? Or at least some Richard Dawkins to balance things out a little?? How about a Koran (or however the hell we are supposed to spell it these days)? Book of Mormon (not one of my all time faves, but why not)? 101 Things to do With a Dead Cat?? The Terrorist's Cookbook?? Madame Bovary?

desertgrandma · 01-25-2009, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickyMaveety

Their mothers were hamsters and their fathers smelled of elderberries, and I fart in their general direction.

Oh, my aching gut!

Patricia · 01-25-2009, 10:55 PM

You ladies are incorrigible.

01-25-2009, 08:42 PM	#139
Cthulhu Technologist Posts: 488 Karma: 585237 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: I'm between Cities Device: SONY Reader PRS-500	MsSmith (et Al)-- Pardon me if I am re-iterating: I would direct you to Hanlon's Razor, a corollary of Occam's Razor, which warns that one not attribute to nefarious purpose what can easily be explained by incompetence. However, in this case, we should replace "incompetence" with "greed." However, once again, some might see greed & nefarious purpose being equal parts of the equation. My point, at any rate, is that SONY is quite savvy; they bought the rights to a popular, well-selling book, and they have generated conversation and debate that revolves around their product. Word of mouth is a fantastic marketing tool, and for most companies, any attention is good attention. In the interest of full disclosure, I am a staunch proponent of religious intolerance, by which I mean that I rarely tolerate religiosity. That is the same thing that Mr. Dawkins said in his book (disclosure: a friend bought it for me, and I gave it away and bought another copy to circulate among friends), that there should be no preferential treatment of anyone's opinion, especially if it attempts to stand behind the shield of religious expression. The notion that "faith" should be unassailable is silly and annoying, and I agree with Dawkins on that point. A person's belief in a flat earth, evolution, flying spaghetti monsters, or Jewish zombies is just that, a belief that can be and should be questioned. Last edited by Cthulhu; 01-25-2009 at 08:53 PM. Reason: Needed to vent a wee bit more

01-25-2009, 10:49 PM	#148
RickyMaveety Holy S**T!!! Posts: 5,213 Karma: 108401 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: San Diego, California!! Device: Kindle and iPad	What about the "religious intolerance" of American hotels? Yeah .... what about the giant conspiracy between the Gideon Society and the Hotels of America?? Why is it that they want to force me to read the Christian Bible?? Why can't I have some nice topic neutral reading material in the bedside stand?? Or at least some Richard Dawkins to balance things out a little?? How about a Koran (or however the hell we are supposed to spell it these days)? Book of Mormon (not one of my all time faves, but why not)? 101 Things to do With a Dead Cat?? The Terrorist's Cookbook?? Madame Bovary?

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01-25-2009, 05:58 PM	#136
Patricia Reader Posts: 11,504 Karma: 8720163 Join Date: May 2007 Location: South Wales, UK Device: Sony PRS-500, PRS-505, Asus EEEpc 4G	I don't think that it is helpful to attribute such motives to the original poster. He asked a question. He got a lot of responses. It is entirely possible that this was a new issue that he hadn't yet needed to consider. Jumping on a person is not conducive to helping them reflect on new ideas. May I add a plea that we continue to try and keep this thread polite, please? If not, the mods are beginning to wonder whether it might be time to close it.

01-25-2009, 09:41 PM	#142
desertgrandma Enjoying the show.... Posts: 14,270 Karma: 10462843 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Device: A K1, Kindle Paperwhite, an Ipod, IPad2, Iphone, an Ipad Mini & macAir	Ricky, I can see the vein in your forehead throbbing. Calm down! Sometimes, you just need to turn your back and walk away. Ready boots?? Start Walking!

01-25-2009, 10:16 PM	#145
slayda Retired & reading more! Posts: 2,764 Karma: 1884247 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: North Alabama, USA Device: Kindle 1, iPad Air 2, iPhone 6S+, Kobo Aura One	Didn't they burn all the non-topic-neutral books at the Alexandria Library a long time ago?

01-25-2009, 10:55 PM	#150
Patricia Reader Posts: 11,504 Karma: 8720163 Join Date: May 2007 Location: South Wales, UK Device: Sony PRS-500, PRS-505, Asus EEEpc 4G	You ladies are incorrigible.

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