Switch from Kindle Oasis to Kobo Forma?

[BookyHatguy]

Why kobo? They just flicker, might as well use smartphone or read books on monitor. Figured I would mention this since, I was aiming for kobo forma myself until only by chance I found video proofs on this topic.

[j.p.s]

eink is pretty much incapable of flicker unless displaying video content.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by BookyHatguy

Why kobo? They just flicker, might as well use smartphone or read books on monitor. Figured I would mention this since, I was aiming for kobo forma myself until only by chance I found video proofs on this topic.

Originally Posted by j.p.s

eink is pretty much incapable of flicker unless displaying video content.

The e-ink screen doesn't flicker. But, the Kobo Forma uses PWM to control the light level. That means that the light is flickering. But, it is at a high enough rate that no human would actually be able to see. It is only detectable with something like a high-speed camera recording it.

[lumpynose]

Originally Posted by davidfor

The e-ink screen doesn't flicker. But, the Kobo Forma uses PWM to control the light level. That means that the light is flickering. But, it is at a high enough rate that no human would actually be able to see. It is only detectable with something like a high-speed camera recording it.

Try telling that to people who swear they can see it. On the other hand could it perhaps be perceived when it's interacting, so to speak, with another light source? I.e., if there are fluorescent lights nearby? I remember when I first started working with computers that my boss said that fluorescent lights were bad when working on a computer because they caused flickering of the computer screen, which in those days were CRT terminals.

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by lumpynose

Try telling that to people who swear they can see it. On the other hand could it perhaps be perceived when it's interacting, so to speak, with another light source? I.e., if there are fluorescent lights nearby? I remember when I first started working with computers that my boss said that fluorescent lights were bad when working on a computer because they caused flickering of the computer screen, which in those days were CRT terminals.

That's a good point, fluorescent flicker can shift the frequency of other flickering, and CRTs are a classic example.

[BookyHatguy]

Originally Posted by davidfor

The e-ink screen doesn't flicker. But, the Kobo Forma uses PWM to control the light level. That means that the light is flickering. But, it is at a high enough rate that no human would actually be able to see. It is only detectable with something like a high-speed camera recording it.

I dont see it, but my eyes get irritated slightly, so over few hours it becomes from "invisible" into very tiring for the eyes. So if this was everyday few hours then you get the gist.

Same way no one likes to read books with monitors - its tiring in a way compared to real book.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by lumpynose

Try telling that to people who swear they can see it. On the other hand could it perhaps be perceived when it's interacting, so to speak, with another light source? I.e., if there are fluorescent lights nearby? I remember when I first started working with computers that my boss said that fluorescent lights were bad when working on a computer because they caused flickering of the computer screen, which in those days were CRT terminals.

The issue is the frequency. The PWM used by the Forma is around 1MHz. The frequencies of the CRT screens were around 60Hz and flourescents would be 120Hz (or twice whatever AC frequency). 60Hz is at the upper end of most humans seeing it. The 120Hz is further up. The interaction between these were visible.

The only way to see the PWM of the Forma is the interaction with another high speed flickering. It was demonstrated using cameras capable of high framerates. I think it was some iPhones which did 240fps, but, it might have needed higher.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by BookyHatguy

I dont see it, but my eyes get irritated slightly, so over few hours it becomes from "invisible" into very tiring for the eyes. So if this was everyday few hours then you get the gist.

Same way no one likes to read books with monitors - its tiring in a way compared to real book.

How sure are you that it is the flickering and not just that you have been staring at the same thing for hours? As I stated above, comparing these screens to older monitors is hard. And some of the issues with using monitors is related to physical positioning.

My reading when this came up is that it is extremely unlikely that the PWM in the Forma is causing any issue. The frequency chosen is above anything that causes problems.

[Raphi'Elohim]

Originally Posted by faithbw

Hello all!

I currently have a Kindle Oasis (9th Generation). It works fine and I have no issues with the reader itself. I guess my issue is that lately, I've been worried that I'm too tied to the Amazon ecosystem. I have Calibre and use it to keep my books free. So I'm not worried about losing my library of books. However, I feel like Amazon is making it increasingly difficult to de-DRM books. I won't go into details since I know that can't be discussed but I'm afraid that one day it may become impossible to get out of the Amazon garden.

I love the size of the Kindle Oasis and it looks like the Kobo Forma is comparable. I also like that the Forma can directly download library e-books (which I read a lot).

How do you all think these two compare? For those who use the Kobo ecosystem, how do you like it? Is there a downsize that I'm not seeing. For those who have experience with both, which one do you prefer and why?

When eREaders first came out I used to use Sony eReaers exclusively. Then when they stopped making eReaders I switched to Kobo. I have owned the Kobo Aura HD, the Kobo Aura Edition 2 and the Kobo Aura ONE and they were all worth my money but not such much the Kobo Aura Edition 2 but it was still decent but it was never meant to be one of their higher end eReaders.

I have also owned the Amazon kindle Oasis (before the warm light) and various kindle paperwhites.

I would say you can't go wrong with the Kobo experience. I prefer Kobo to my current Barnes and Noble Nook Glowlight Plus but the Glowlight Plus 2 was only $199 with a similar screen to the Kobo Forma so that is why I bought it. I could not justify spending $280 dollars on the Forma after breaking some of the kindles and Kobos and having the other ones stolen after acting like a eccentric vagrant for a summer in Manhattan.

You will always get the anal nitpickers that have nothing good to say but I just ignore them and say based on my past experience the Kobo Forma probably offers a solid value for the money.

[BookyHatguy]

Originally Posted by davidfor

How sure are you that it is the flickering and not just that you have been staring at the same thing for hours? As I stated above, comparing these screens to older monitors is hard. And some of the issues with using monitors is related to physical positioning.

My reading when this came up is that it is extremely unlikely that the PWM in the Forma is causing any issue. The frequency chosen is above anything that causes problems.

I got few monitors. With one I could sit for hours before noticing, with other I just sit for 30min and feel discomfort in eyes.
I used to play games on crt, or tv with snes, so it all makes sense. Stronger eyes are immune to all this crap, but all this flickering from tv,crt, flourescent lamps(hate them!!!) does is reduce immunity over decades.

Since we are off topic i would share: Whats funny id rather look at PWM 120Hz monitor than flourescent lamps! You can think whatever reasons you wish but those lamps affects negatively me more than lcd.

[lumpynose]

Originally Posted by davidfor

The only way to see the PWM of the Forma is the interaction with another high speed flickering. It was demonstrated using cameras capable of high framerates. I think it was some iPhones which did 240fps, but, it might have needed higher.

So it obviously affects people who read their books after videoing them on their phones.