Can textbook go drm free ?

[webroot]

Ok so drm is becoming older and outdated and more publisher are better off abandoning it. but what about educational ebooks? they are expensive and of high value what options publishers have if they look for drm free alternative?

[eschwartz]

The same options they have for novels. What is your distinction?

[HarryT]

Perhaps the OP is thinking of textbook rental? Hard to see how that could ever be DRM-free.

[eschwartz]

Then rentals should have been specified. And I would respond:

You're right, and DRM isn't going away for rented textbooks anymore than it is for rented ebooks (Kindle Unlimited) or library loaned ebooks.



I still don't get the point of (trying to) make a distinction.

[latepaul]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

I still don't get the point of (trying to) make a distinction.

The economics are different.

You buy a novel to read for leisure*, you buy a textbook because it's necessary for your study. Novels are cheaper. Students often have less money.

Which means that the casual piracy which goes on, is probably more about convenience than saving money for novel readers. That's why Tor could go DRM-free and see no drop in sales. A textbook publisher has good reason to believe that the same would not happen for them.

(*unless you're a book reviewer but then it may well be free anyway)

[fjtorres]

There is no reason why textbooks can't be DRM free.
It is just one of many business decisions an author/publisher makes.

Some textbook sources not only go DRM free, they *are* free. Just check online for "open source textbook":

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_textbook

http://open.umn.edu/opentextbooks/

http://www.teachthought.com/technolo...rce-textbooks/

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by latepaul

The economics are different.

You buy a novel to read for leisure*, you buy a textbook because it's necessary for your study. Novels are cheaper. Students often have less money.

Which means that the casual piracy which goes on, is probably more about convenience than saving money for novel readers. That's why Tor could go DRM-free and see no drop in sales. A textbook publisher has good reason to believe that the same would not happen for them.

(*unless you're a book reviewer but then it may well be free anyway)

Any publisher that wants to rationalize DRM will do so without regard for facts.
Any publisher that is intellectually honest will realize the greater issues surrounding DRM.
What the heck does the likelihood of pirating have anything to do with the matter?


Moving on...
Often textbooks come with one-use codes to e.g. create an account at website X which manages the coursework. Pirated textbooks don't help with that. In fact, that particular scam even makes buying used textbooks a problem.
Textbooks are indeed special snowflakes, but I would argue that is because they, digital or paper, have DRM (of a sort) that is truly the pinnacle of the art. It certainly isn't because they need to fear you pirating the mere words.

[latepaul]

I'm not interesting in defending or attacking whether textbooks can be successfully be DRM-free. I'm agnostic on that.

I was merely pointing out that the market for textbooks is not like the one for novels. Therefore there is a distinction which could affect the question.

[jhowell]

Another possibility for DRM-free textbooks would be to have the school purchase licenses in bulk from the publisher and charge students as part of the course's tuition. Then the textbooks could be freely distributed to the students without DRM.

[webroot]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Then rentals should have been specified. And I would respond:

You're right, and DRM isn't going away for rented textbooks anymore than it is for rented ebooks (Kindle Unlimited) or library loaned ebooks.



I still don't get the point of (trying to) make a distinction.

I had in mind some kind of managed system for students. It maybe rental or buying from outside, all as ebooks. Drm may not go away in case of e-textbooks (probably dont have to), just think of a situation when one student buys book and whole class gets the copy for free. The reason behind asking this was, drm increases book price and complexity in distribution life-cycle.

And let as accept that ebook piracy is rampant and more severe in case of textbook because there you not only have casual sharing but professional pirate racket involved. And because schools still big consumer of paper books not many are talking about DRM but soon situation will be different. Kindle, 3M or overdrive are just name to few but they are vendor specific options.

And then there is big difference in consuming a novel than a textbook, in later case you may not focus too much on convenience and because reading a textbook is already painful, other pain dont count. Student reading textbook is far focused and will be satisfied with available ereader as long as the ebook reader allows doing fundamental things such as note making. good character support etc.

A student who need a particular e-textbook has no option but to buy/rental no matter it is drmed or drm free, in most cases he/she is only interest the that book until exams.

[webroot]

Originally Posted by latepaul

The economics are different.

You buy a novel to read for leisure*, you buy a textbook because it's necessary for your study. Novels are cheaper. Students often have less money....

Agreed

Originally Posted by fjtorres

There is no reason why textbooks can't be DRM free.
It is just one of many business decisions an author/publisher makes.
...

These are interesting links but I wonder if all book become opentextbook, then writing profession will be out of business. A novel writer, business insider or self-help writer have different reason to write (and they can write anything without being responsible for its correctedness ), they do mainly to improve their communication skills and become subject matter expert. Any money they get is considered a reward not the compensation of efforts.

Originally Posted by jhowell

Another possibility for DRM-free textbooks would be to have the school purchase licenses in bulk from the publisher and charge students as part of the course's tuition. Then the textbooks could be freely distributed to the students without DRM.

Yes maybe this is what is going to happen, a bundled packaged for education. And searching for a different material other than recommended by teaching faculty could be a history, as education becoming very focused, commercial business and mostly as means to livelihood i dont see why current trend continues.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by webroot

These are interesting links but I wonder if all book become opentextbook, then writing profession will be out of business. A novel writer, business insider or self-help writer have different reason to write (and they can write anything without being responsible for its correctedness ), they do mainly to improve their communication skills and become subject matter expert. Any money they get is considered a reward not the compensation of efforts.

Ummm... I don't think anyone has suggested all books become open textbooks, the clue is in the word textbooks.

The motivation is quite obvious -- education, gov't-funded, grant-based texts. Instructional manuals and teaching guides can benefit from collaborative editing among thousands of teachers who all want better resource materials for their students.

Novel writing would never fit into a crowd-sourced collaborative model, it is a different and incompatible subject matter.
Novel writers do not write novels in order to improve their communication skills, or for the noble sake of the public good -- that myth is usually propagated by people who are angry at authors for selling their products instead of giving it away for free.

Writers write novels for the filthy lucre.

[webroot]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Ummm... I don't think anyone has suggested all books become open textbooks, the clue is in the word textbooks.
...

Writers write novels for the filthy lucre.

Interesting...

I didn't literally mean communication skill (or English) but they can better ability the put across ideas so as other person understand well, and to develop a powerful persuasive skill. Ultimately these things help in other areas of life. Different author depending on their establishment can have different reasons to write, what do you think the most basic reason?

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by webroot

These are interesting links but I wonder if all book become opentextbook, then writing profession will be out of business.
.

Nobody in those (and other like links) is talking about fiction or commercial non-fiction. So pretending open source textbooks have anything to do with commercial authors incomes is a non-sequitur.

The target of all those efforts are publicly-funded educational resources developed at public expense for common use in higher education.

There is no law of nature that says university textbooks have to be $200 per book cash cows for the likes of Pearson, Elsevier, McGraw-Hill, etc. Not when many if not most of the texts are decades old and only minimally tweaked every year or two, mostly to undercut the used textbook market.

Ebook technology allows the universities to combine their efforts and produce superior texts for students and allow them to divert the money going to the predatory publishers to go towards the eternally rising tuitions.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102746071

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by webroot

Interesting...

I didn't literally mean communication skill (or English) but they can better ability the put across ideas so as other person understand well, and to develop a powerful persuasive skill. Ultimately these things help in other areas of life. Different author depending on their establishment can have different reasons to write, what do you think the most basic reason?

I reiterate -- they are in it for the filthy lucre. That is the usual, default, 99.999999999999999999999999999999999% guaranteed reason for someone selling (for the aforementioned filthy lucre) the product they spent tremendous amounts of time creating, marketing, and selling (or negotiating with a publisher to sell for them).