Is all fantasy derivative of Tolkien? How to prove it isn't?

[Geralt]

Originally Posted by Waylander

I may give my father Promise of Blood by Brian Mclellan to read, as it is definitely not a Tolkien clone.

If McClellan's flintlock fantasy doesn't change his mind, nothing will. Good choice.

[cromag]

As another old geezer, I'd say an awful lot of modern epic fantasy is (at the very least) very strongly influenced by Tolkien's work. But there are lots of exceptions, as have already been pointed out.

I would recommend The Chronicles of Master Li and Number Ten Ox, by Barry Hughart. It's available as an affordable ebook almost everywhere.

[NedC]

Tolkien himself was heavily influenced by Sir Gawain and the Green Knight (written in the 14th Century), Beowulf (written possibly as early as the 8th Century) and others. They were his day job.

[Thasaidon]

There are also the works of Lord Dunsany, which influenced Lovecraft, his circle and probably Tolkien as well.

[Waylander]

I'm not necessarily trying to change his mind about whether he thinks fantasy is any good, acceptable reading or whatever, because I couldn't care less in those circumstances, just get him to accept that not all fantasy is a Tolkien knock-off. However, I'm not going to sweat over it, as it's not worth my time. If he doesn't like it, who cares? Thanks for the replies though.

[BearMountainBooks]

I didn't see it mentioned so: Aladdin is fantasy and quite classic, and not at all Tolkien fantasy. In fact, the entire genie/djinn fantasy arm isn't Tolkein-esque. From a modern perspective John Levitt wrote his urban fantasy using djinn as well as some more typical fantasy elements. Vampire Fantasy isn't Tolkien-esque either, although some may push that over into the horror genre (and I refer to original monster type vamps, not romantic ones for this discussion--but the romance ones wouldn't fall under Tolkien type fantasy either...)

I'd say none of the Chinese or Japanese or other Asian type fantasies have much in common with Tolkien either, although some follow the epic storytelling type pattern.

[WillAdams]

For an interesting insight into the interplay between Tolkien and Lewis read _The Lays of Beleriand_ (Vol. 3 of _The Complete History of Middle Earth_) which has a charming bit written by the latter as at once a critique and pastiche and improvement of the Gest.

[Rizla]

Fairer to say that Tolkien is a derivative of A Midsummer Night's Dream and maybe The Tempest.

[Difflugia]

Tolkien claimed George MacDonald as one of his influences. MacDonald's Phantastes was written before Tolkien was born and, though definitely weird, is quite a fun read.

[crich70]

These two books are said to have inspired Tolkien as well.
The House of the Wolfings
House of the Wolfings
Tolkien Warriors—The House of the Wolfings
Tolkien Warriors—The House of the Wolfings

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks

I'd say none of the Chinese or Japanese or other Asian type fantasies have much in common with Tolkien either, although some follow the epic storytelling type pattern.

Its sad so few Asian fantasies make it west.
The few I've run into are delightful.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Its sad so few Asian fantasies make it west.
The few I've run into are delightful.

Have you ever read any of Pu Songling's stories fjtorres?
Strange Stories

[Difflugia]

Originally Posted by crich70

These two books are said to have inspired Tolkien as well.
The House of the Wolfings
House of the Wolfings
Tolkien Warriors—The House of the Wolfings
Tolkien Warriors—The House of the Wolfings

Thanks. I hadn't heard of this one.

It's also free at Gutenberg along with a number of others by the same author that look worth reading.

[crich70]

Originally Posted by Difflugia

Thanks. I hadn't heard of this one.

It's also free at Gutenberg along with a number of others by the same author that look worth reading.

Interesting. I didn't realize they were at Gutenberg. One title I found interesting is "The Story Of Gunnlaug The Worm-Tongue And Raven The Skald" as one of the characters in LOTR is called Grima Worm-Tongue. I can almost see Prof. Tolkien reading the title and thinking that it's a perfect name for one of his characters.

[conan50]

Tolkien is great, he helped jump start the whole modern Fantasy genre. But he "borrowed" and was influenced by the Norse Eddas, Beowulf, the Kalevala, William Morris, and others. Gandalf, Frodo, about half the names of his dwarves came from the Eddas. William Morris first used the name "Mirkwood". Many modern fantasy authors "borrow" from Tolkien, but he first "borrowed" from the best.
Robert E. Howard is your guy if you are looking for a "Father" of Heroic Fantasy.
edit added the word "Heroic".