The Vent and Rant Thread

[Mortis]

Originally Posted by dsvick

Which is all well and good until one of the post it notes covers up a plane that doesn't have its own not yet.

I bet we already do it more often than we know. Maybe not to a computer completely but certainly to a large extent.

To some extent you are correct, traffic lights for example have fail safes built in, but when you are flying at 30,000 feet do you want to entrust your life to something rather than someone?

Think about trains, they can only go one way, they don't have to worry about driving off the track but yet they never let them go off on their own with out a person to do the thinking. There's a good reason for that, the railways would love to get rid of the conductors (I think thats what they are called), computers never get sick, never need a day off to go to their kids piano recital, never have a headache, never need to have a personal day. They run 24/7, yet we still haven't gotten rid of the human element, if only because they need a fail safe.

Computers are really good at doing what they are told, but that would mean that the guy that does the programming would have to think of every possible error, just 1 unusual occurrence and it could be fatal. How many times have you had to reboot your computer for a reason you couldn't figure out, I'd hate to have that happen with a computer controlling a plane carrying 300+ people.

[wodin]

Originally Posted by Mortis

<snip>, as long as the person in question is awake and not hopped up on meth to stay awake.

Well, not meth, but it's a little known (suppressed) fact that US Air Force pilots are routinely given dextroamphetamine when flying particularly long or arduous missions.

[wodin]

I wonder if a computer could have done what Sully Sullenberger did!

[Xenophon]

Originally Posted by dsvick

[SNIP]
[responding to Mortis, on trusting one's life to a computer...]
I bet we already do it more often than we know. Maybe not to a computer completely but certainly to a large extent.

If you fly in any Airbus aircraft from A320 onwards, you trust your life to the computerized fly-by-wire control system.

If you fly in any Boeing aircraft from the 777 onwards, you trust your life to the fly-by-wire control system. Note that there's a reason why Boeing went fly-by-wire a full aircraft generation later than Airbus did! (but I digress...)

If you fly in any large commercial aircraft that has engines newer than mid-90's vintage, you're trusting your life to the FADEC system (that's Full Authority Digital Engine Control system). The pilot's throttle levers lack a physical connection to the engines -- it's networks, computers, and software.

If you drive a car that has (modern) anti-lock brakes, you trust your life to the automotive electronics that control them. Ditto for traction control, automatic stability control, and many similar features.

Any aircraft (new or old) that has Cat-IV auto-landing hardware (I may have the name wrong; it's what lets them land in zero-visibility) -- and pretty much every airliner does -- is capable of doing entirely automatic landings, even when the pilots can't see a bloody thing.

Pretty much every product that involves significant quantities of any material has had its structural design optimized through the use of finite-elements-analysis software. The engineers in charge still incorporate significant safety factors (as well they should!), but the analysis software allows them to slim down parts while being confidant that the needed safety factors remain. Most physical parts in everything from coffee makers, to bicycles, to cars and airplanes depend on this type of analysis for cost reductions without safety reductions. So do bridges, roads, dams, and on, and on.

If you live in the developed world, you depend on this stuff every day. There're people in the loop in many places. But we're doing ever more things that were flat-out impossible until the computers and software got in the picture.

Xenophon

[dsvick]

Originally Posted by Xenophon

If you fly in any Airbus aircraft from A320 onwards, you trust your life to the computerized fly-by-wire control system.

If you fly in any Boeing aircraft from the 777 onwards, you trust your life to the fly-by-wire control system. Note that there's a reason why Boeing went fly-by-wire a full aircraft generation later than Airbus did! (but I digress...)

If you fly in any large commercial aircraft that has engines newer than mid-90's vintage, you're trusting your life to the FADEC system (that's Full Authority Digital Engine Control system). The pilot's throttle levers lack a physical connection to the engines -- it's networks, computers, and software.

If you drive a car that has (modern) anti-lock brakes, you trust your life to the automotive electronics that control them. Ditto for traction control, automatic stability control, and many similar features.

Any aircraft (new or old) that has Cat-IV auto-landing hardware (I may have the name wrong; it's what lets them land in zero-visibility) -- and pretty much every airliner does -- is capable of doing entirely automatic landings, even when the pilots can't see a bloody thing.

Pretty much every product that involves significant quantities of any material has had its structural design optimized through the use of finite-elements-analysis software. The engineers in charge still incorporate significant safety factors (as well they should!), but the analysis software allows them to slim down parts while being confidant that the needed safety factors remain. Most physical parts in everything from coffee makers, to bicycles, to cars and airplanes depend on this type of analysis for cost reductions without safety reductions. So do bridges, roads, dams, and on, and on.

If you live in the developed world, you depend on this stuff every day. There're people in the loop in many places. But we're doing ever more things that were flat-out impossible until the computers and software got in the picture.

Xenophon

Thanks Xenophon, I was pretty sure it was more than a little, but I don't think I thought it would be quite as much as you pointed out I think I'll walk home

[nohmi2]

Originally Posted by wodin

I wonder if a computer could have done what Sully Sullenberger did!

Excellent observation!

Cheers

[CWatkinsNash]

Hiding female problems behind a spoiler tag in consideration of the men.

Spoiler:

So I spend a week sick, another week sort of getting better, and now my freakin' period starts?!?!? WTF? Okay, it was due soon anyway, but still. I could have used a few days to get my strength back before being brought to my knees in misery again. (I'm one of those women for whom it is truly a CURSE.)

Aaargh!!!

[dsvick]

Originally Posted by CWatkinsNash

Hiding female problems behind a spoiler tag in consideration of the men.

Spoiler:

So I spend a week sick, another week sort of getting better, and now my freakin' period starts?!?!? WTF? Okay, it was due soon anyway, but still. I could have used a few days to get my strength back before being brought to my knees in misery again. (I'm one of those women for whom it is truly a CURSE.)

Aaargh!!!

Sorry to hear of your womanly issues, at least you know it has a more specific ending date than a cold. Hope you feel better. A nice warm bath and a good book sounds in order.

[CWatkinsNash]

Originally Posted by dsvick

Sorry to hear of your womanly issues, at least you know it has a more specific ending date than a cold. Hope you feel better. A nice warm bath and a good book sounds in order.

Awww, thanks. And yes, at least I know there's an end in sight. I'm just glad it's Friday. I've got lots of books lined up to be read, and that's exactly what I plan to do this weekend.

[DixieGal]

Didja ever run into an old boyfriend at Ruby Tuesday and he weighs about 400 and looks like hell?

[maianhvk]

if I don't weigh 400 and look like hell too, that will be fun

[DixieGal]

Originally Posted by maianhvk

if I don't weigh 400 and look like hell too, that will be fun

Oh please!
You seem adorable!

[wodin]

Originally Posted by Xenophon

If you fly in any Airbus aircraft from A320 onwards, you trust your life to the computerized fly-by-wire control system.

If you fly in any Boeing aircraft from the 777 onwards, you trust your life to the fly-by-wire control system. Note that there's a reason why Boeing went fly-by-wire a full aircraft generation later than Airbus did! (but I digress...)

If you fly in any large commercial aircraft that has engines newer than mid-90's vintage, you're trusting your life to the FADEC system (that's Full Authority Digital Engine Control system). The pilot's throttle levers lack a physical connection to the engines -- it's networks, computers, and software.

If you drive a car that has (modern) anti-lock brakes, you trust your life to the automotive electronics that control them. Ditto for traction control, automatic stability control, and many similar features.

Any aircraft (new or old) that has Cat-IV auto-landing hardware (I may have the name wrong; it's what lets them land in zero-visibility) -- and pretty much every airliner does -- is capable of doing entirely automatic landings, even when the pilots can't see a bloody thing.

Pretty much every product that involves significant quantities of any material has had its structural design optimized through the use of finite-elements-analysis software. The engineers in charge still incorporate significant safety factors (as well they should!), but the analysis software allows them to slim down parts while being confidant that the needed safety factors remain. Most physical parts in everything from coffee makers, to bicycles, to cars and airplanes depend on this type of analysis for cost reductions without safety reductions. So do bridges, roads, dams, and on, and on.

If you live in the developed world, you depend on this stuff every day. There're people in the loop in many places. But we're doing ever more things that were flat-out impossible until the computers and software got in the picture.

Xenophon

cat the Cat-IV auto-landing hardware put da buggah down in the Hudson?

[maianhvk]

Originally Posted by DixieGal

Oh please!
You seem adorable!

not when I'm asleep!

[GeoffC]

Originally Posted by kennyc

Oh GAWD! I hate that! Hope you get it recovered.

I had mine (win7 64) just crash in the middle of typing a couple of days ago and proceed to do a crashdump. First time I've had that happen with Win7.

it did come back after restarting (and choosing restart normally).

I immediately made sure things were backed up to three different backups.

That's partly a problem now - after the win7 repair could not find my full image backup how can I be sure of the 'next time'

I know the image is there I can see it! (carried out once monthly).

The best backup of non program files was the windows.old dump that the clean re-installation provided - that proved better than the daily backup !



at least my photos and books were safe. most other bits and pieces are rather inconsequential, but annoyingly inconvenient when it all has to be put back together again (Still got MS Office to reinstall).

My MS Money file is being a pain - it has a 'lock' icon by the side of it and seems read only - and seemingly changing the attributes makes no difference.